S'pore may raise retirement age to 68

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Thu, 04 Nov 2010 12:35:03 GMT

INNOVATE — Thu, 04 Nov 2010 12:35:03 GMT

dunnoleh

Small-cap stock-Actionasia Ltd

Co had released its 3rd qtr result after market closed today.
Summary: turnover for 1st 9-mth period $290M more than FY2009 $267M
nett profit $18.185M vs 2009 $12.553M +44.87%
dividends 0.5ct payable on 1st Dec this yr.

Plus the dividends of 1ct paid this yr,the yield is 7.5%-clearly
one of the highest in SGX.

As mentioned earlier, the main concern is a large chunk of profit is derived from a single major mnc, though the co is making progress in diversifying its customer base. Exchange rate loss due to the falling US$ was $1.09M, better than expected. Co has cautiously given a positive outlook notwithstanding economic uncertainities.

In conclusion, co is worth investing at price of $0.2 or lower if you are prepared to hold for at least 6 mths. I am holding on to my existing position at least till full yr result.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Tue, 02 Nov 2010 01:12:07 GMT

Trapwithin — Tue, 02 Nov 2010 01:12:07 GMT

verykiasu2010:
dunnoleh:
[quote=\"verykiasu2010\"]... In my previous work place, there are some who worked till 70+ and the record was age 87
you an ex staff of PMO?

hahaha, you are quite a joker!![/quote]A good Joke indeed

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 10:43:13 GMT

Funz — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 10:43:13 GMT

[quote="verykiasu2010]

In my previous work place, there are some who worked till 70+ and the record was age 87[/quote]

My 2 oldest employees were 77 and 72 when they finally retired, well, sort of, cos within a year, both of them came to me asking if I have any opportunities for them and I found them placements elsewhere as I have no vacancies for them.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 10:37:37 GMT

Funz — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 10:37:37 GMT

3Boys:
Its not really about the retirement age is it?

Its about the CPF withdrawal age right?

I.e. for those who can afford to stop working early, they will stop working early, even if the retirement age is 70+. I've heard of someone age 38 who has accumulated enough wealth and is now golfing around the world.

For someone who is interested in working, he will keep on working, whatever the retirement age. MM Lee being case in point, but there are others.

For those who cannot afford to stop working, then even if the retirement age were 55, they would still work on well beyond that.

So why this hang up about a number? Whether you stop or continue working quite often is down to yourself and very little to do with what a g'ment or any other agency says about it.

So its all about the CPF withdrawal.

There are those for whom CPF will be an insignificant part of their retirement funds. For them, whatever age they withdraw their CPF is inconsequential

There are those whose CPF will form a meaningful but not overwhelming part of their retirement fund. For this group, raising the retirement age poses an interesting conundrum of trading retirement lifestyle for added security, and in my view, it is this group that need to talk through the pros and cons of raising the retirement age. However, one could also argue that if you had done your sums right, you could still stop work at 65, live off your initial savings, and then access CPF at 68. So its not all dire.

There are those for whom CPF will be a large or only chunk of retirement funds. For these folk, there is no question that they need the most prudent policy possible. If they are desperate for cash at 65, how will they be at 75? And at that age it will be even harder to have any kind of income and harder to deal with poverty.

I do so agree with you. Like I said earlier on, why the hang up about the age, it is just a number.

With the raising of the retirement age, I believe it will help those who do not have enough in their CPF to see them through their old age.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:52:56 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:52:56 GMT

dunnoleh:
verykiasu2010:
... In my previous work place, there are some who worked till 70+ and the record was age 87
you an ex staff of PMO?

hahaha, you are quite a joker!!

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:48:35 GMT

dunnoleh — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:48:35 GMT

verykiasu2010:
... In my previous work place, there are some who worked till 70+ and the record was age 87

you an ex staff of PMO?

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:47:38 GMT

3Boys — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:47:38 GMT

Its not really about the retirement age is it?

Its about the CPF withdrawal age right?

I.e. for those who can afford to stop working early, they will stop working early, even if the retirement age is 70+. I've heard of someone age 38 who has accumulated enough wealth and is now golfing around the world.

For someone who is interested in working, he will keep on working, whatever the retirement age. MM Lee being case in point, but there are others.

For those who cannot afford to stop working, then even if the retirement age were 55, they would still work on well beyond that.

So why this hang up about a number? Whether you stop or continue working quite often is down to yourself and very little to do with what a g'ment or any other agency says about it.

So its all about the CPF withdrawal.

There are those for whom CPF will be an insignificant part of their retirement funds. For them, whatever age they withdraw their CPF is inconsequential

There are those whose CPF will form a meaningful but not overwhelming part of their retirement fund. For this group, raising the retirement age poses an interesting conundrum of trading retirement lifestyle for added security, and in my view, it is this group that need to talk through the pros and cons of raising the retirement age. However, one could also argue that if you had done your sums right, you could still stop work at 65, live off your initial savings, and then access CPF at 68. So its not all dire.

There are those for whom CPF will be a large or only chunk of retirement funds. For these folk, there is no question that they need the most prudent policy possible. If they are desperate for cash at 65, how will they be at 75? And at that age it will be even harder to have any kind of income and harder to deal with poverty.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:39:42 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:39:42 GMT

Daddy
3Boys:
[quote=\"Daddy D\"]http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...
It is inevitable....resistance is futile.

Let's guess which MP will speak up next... :P[/quote]In my previous work place, there are some who worked till 70+ and the record was age 87

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:38:10 GMT

Daddy D — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:38:10 GMT

3Boys:
Daddy
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...
It is inevitable....resistance is futile.

Let's guess which MP will speak up next...

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:25:15 GMT

3Boys — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:25:15 GMT

Daddy
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...

It is inevitable....resistance is futile.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:23:29 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:23:29 GMT

duriz:
verykiasu2010:
the truth is we can retire anytime we feel like, because there is no retirement benefits from the gahmen as it is

cheers !
And despite the baby bonus, we are still an aging population.

Working till 67 or retirement would depend on varied factors e.g. male vs female, existing illness/disability, overall health and wellness (memory, strength, endurance etc) as well as family support system.

ideally is kids education all provided, given them a leg up on housing, then don't need big house unless multi-generation stay together....then cash out the house and move into a smaller unit...and hopefully still can afford present living standard and lifestyle with reserves plus, and do ad hoc advisory work to keep the mind active....

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:17:51 GMT

duriz — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:17:51 GMT

verykiasu2010:
the truth is we can retire anytime we feel like, because there is no retirement benefits from the gahmen as it is

cheers !

And despite the baby bonus, we are still an aging population.

Working till 67 or retirement would depend on varied factors e.g. male vs female, existing illness/disability, overall health and wellness (memory, strength, endurance etc) as well as family support system.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:10:50 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:10:50 GMT

Daddy
verykiasu2010:
[quote=\"Daddy D\"]http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...
more like open declaration than subtle hints .....

I tot they used to do the consultative approach... now dun have liao ah? :celebrate:[/quote]the truth is we can retire anytime we feel like, because there is no retirement benefits from the gahmen as it is

cheers !

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:09:09 GMT

Daddy D — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:09:09 GMT

verykiasu2010:
Daddy
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...
more like open declaration than subtle hints .....

I tot they used to do the consultative approach... now dun have liao ah? :celebrate:

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:05:46 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:05:46 GMT

Daddy
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...

more like open declaration than subtle hints .....

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:03:26 GMT

Daddy D — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 08:03:26 GMT

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1090650/1/.html

\"Retirement age \"not impossible\" to go beyond 67: Manpower Minister\"

Ho seh liao... all the MPs come and drop subtle hints liao...

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:58:06 GMT

dunnoleh — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:58:06 GMT

INNOVATE:
...Mid Cap-Raffles education.

...Small-Cap-Action Asia.
... Take note that I shall liquidate all my existing positions if I proven wrong either by macro factors or cos fail to lift up tp expectations in its earnings.

The above is only my reading and I can be totally wrong!

appreciate yr take on RafflesEdu, they hv taken fair punishment, I think.
ActionAsia - from a chicken's perspective, I stay chicken. :oops:

your earlier eg. on PCL, what they did was pretty unique, and only bcoz they had the means, and still remain very comfortable after delisting.
even some people inside were dissappointed...
good example to illustrate an exception, I guess?

better get back to work now, and save for my retirement.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:23:27 GMT

3Boys — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:23:27 GMT

adhdadhd:
Live example here, and I represent at least 5 other friends of mine, who had been affected by \"structural unemployment\". We were encouraged to move up the ladder, and proven to be too costly, and laid the axe at 50+/- 5 year old. for the last 2 years, could not find any full time jobs.

Taxi driver, life agents, property consultant are not our cup of tea.

What can we do until 68? we are talking about another 20 years or so...

If we are paid $2mil a year why not..

There must be structural employment to maintain tax income to afford a well paid group of talents, so that they don't return to private sectors. When the baby boomers stopped working, tax income and CPF account will drop, is only raising the legal retirement age to \"cushion\" the impact... as most of our money were invested, and not liquid...

The extrapolated effect will be, retired and cannot touch your CPF until you die...

or, borrow from loan shark for daily expenses... at current retirement age, is already happening, even cars get burnt!

Today's Mypaper front page, implied Singaporean kiasu and not able to produce Facebook liked billionaires... We need a social fallback mechanism like US or Europe, to give us cushion, if we fail in any attempts in risky ventures, or we will always be kiasu... is high time gov.sg do their part to create such a economic cushion... so to free us to be able to be creative...

Sorry to hear about your predicament, but how does accessing your CPF now help in anything other than postponing the inevitable? Is it sufficient to provide you a reasonable living standard until age 80? Or beyond?

As for social security, it comes with a cost. If you are receiving a 'cushion' to fall back on, someone else is paying for it, be it this or the next generation. This is a possible paradigm, but needs to be a societal acceptance of it.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:15:01 GMT

blueblue — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:15:01 GMT

sianz..what to do? in the first place who vote for them???

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:03:05 GMT

adhdadhd — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 05:03:05 GMT

Live example here, and I represent at least 5 other friends of mine, who had been affected by \"structural unemployment\". We were encouraged to move up the ladder, and proven to be too costly, and laid the axe at 50+/- 5 year old. for the last 2 years, could not find any full time jobs.

Taxi driver, life agents, property consultant are not our cup of tea.

What can we do until 68? we are talking about another 20 years or so...

If we are paid $2mil a year why not..

There must be structural employment to maintain tax income to afford a well paid group of talents, so that they don't return to private sectors. When the baby boomers stopped working, tax income and CPF account will drop, is only raising the legal retirement age to \"cushion\" the impact... as most of our money were invested, and not liquid...

The extrapolated effect will be, retired and cannot touch your CPF until you die...

or, borrow from loan shark for daily expenses... at current retirement age, is already happening, even cars get burnt!

Today's Mypaper front page, implied Singaporean kiasu and not able to produce Facebook liked billionaires... We need a social fallback mechanism like US or Europe, to give us cushion, if we fail in any attempts in risky ventures, or we will always be kiasu... is high time gov.sg do their part to create such a economic cushion... so to free us to be able to be creative...

Daddy
3Boys:
Those who cannot afford, will still be working, or looking for work after 65 or 68, whatever the retirement age is.

Those who are interested in working to keep sharp and fit will be working or looking for work, whatever the retirement age is.

Raising the retirement age to 68 improves the opportunities for those in the latter 2 groups.
What opportunities?
I think if those above 50yrs old... jobless and still looking for job... no $$ for daily expenses... yet cannot touch their CPF $$... very SAD lor...
Even those above 40 yrs old and retrenched... already very hard to find jobs liao...
How much can a 50yr old get in terms of salary from a new job?

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:47:53 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:47:53 GMT

Hi INNOVATE

thanks for your sharing

wish you all the best!

if international trade is not recovering, shipping coy shares will suffer

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:38:52 GMT

3Boys — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:38:52 GMT

Daddy

Well... simply raising the retirement age, is like sweeping the poverty problem under the mat... out of sight out of mind.
Need to face the fact that CPF $ is not sufficient for retirement... then the purpose/mission of CPF, or what it started out as... becomes debatable.

My take is... it's a social problem... tackling it from the retirement age doesn't solve much... there are many other factors to consider.

Yes, it is but one tool, but no, its not sweeping it under the carpet, it is dealing with it in the most direct way. I.e. work longer, defer on drawing savings --> More left over for old age when its difficult to work.

There are of course many other factors to consider, but CPF is one important tool, and its needs to be gotten right. And raising retirement age DOES help, and you seem to have at least accepted that, even if grudgingly.

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:29:55 GMT

INNOVATE — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 04:29:55 GMT

verykiasu2010

Yes, NOL is a proxy and Temasek did not manage to privatise it during the last bull run at $2.80/share. Currently, the counter is trading at $2.18.

Personally, do not wish to take fresh positions at this level. Had taken money off the table in recent months when the market had rallied. During US financial crisis, took major positions in 2008. Prefer to take concentrated positions of not more than 4 stocks as diversification dilutes one’s portfolio performance.

However, as requested,like one mid-cap and one small cap for its share undervaluation/performance.
Mid Cap-Raffles education. Co’s performance in recent yrs was rather dissapointing. It has lost much of its market value over 30 mths, from price of $1.38 to current $0.275. Co failed to pay dividends in last financial yr, the first in recent yrs. Expecting its fortune to turn around and the coming 1st qtr reporting due this mth should be a verification whether my reading is correct. At this level, the risk is relatively low. Its cash hoard is approx $140 million with gearing at 0.08x. Co is no longer in the radar screen of instituitions as the latter got their fingers burned having subscribed to share placement at $0.6/share.

Small-Cap-Action Asia. Currently holding some positions having taken profits in recent mths. At price of $0.185, its dividends is 5.4%. Like its nett cash position when progressively bought much at $0.055-$0.075 during financial crisis. At that level, dividends yield was approx 16-17%. Four negative pts to note:1. Co relies heavily on single customer for its bulk of profits. 2. Falling US$ which is expected to dampen their nett profit. 3. Low liquidity. 4. No instituition support.

Must hve patience waiting for share prices to appreciate.

As oulined above, I do not intend to take fresh positions and only holding to much smaller positions at this index level. Take note that I shall liquidate all my existing positions if I proven wrong either by macro factors or cos fail to lift up tp expectations in its earnings.

The above is only my reading and I can be totally wrong!

Reply to S'pore may raise retirement age to 68 on Mon, 01 Nov 2010 03:44:01 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Mon, 01 Nov 2010 03:44:01 GMT

INNOVATE:
verykiasu2010

Approximately ten yrs ago invested in a solid company named Pacific Carrier Ltd, a Kuok family's related listed on SGX. Bought at below par using CPF. On the date of full yr results annoucement, co requested for suspension of its shares. To my deep dissapointment, majority shareholders offered to privatise at approx 35-40% premium over its last traded price. This solid co was paying over 7% dividends consistently and was grossly neglected by instituitions as they did not hve a sexy/high growth story vs-a vs those information cos, which were red hot at that time. Imagine if the co remains listed with the booming commodities market, its share price would have multiply several folds not to mention higher dividends payout.

When an investor has indept knowledge of the market, he/she is a already a winner as the correct entry pt is never a question as the basis of taking positions are centered on fundamentals, technical and psychological factors not withstanding shrewd major players claiming their counters were not heavily traded. So much for market efficient theory!

Thanks for sharing!

Any counter to recommend or that you fancy currently ?

Pacific Carriers is also dependent on world trade, a good proxy is NOL...... but .....