MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids?

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 08:29:49 GMT

kiddo — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 08:29:49 GMT

Chenonceau:
verykiasu2010:
[quote=\"vicki\"]I'm wondering a little - but maybe abit 'offtopic' - so the result of popular schools like NYPS n HPPS - is it becos of the teachers or MOE biasness?

What happens if MOE totally switch the staff/ resources from these schools to less popular ones? Will the std of the unpopular school then go up?
if you parachute a very capable teacher to a lowest ranked primary school with a one of a kind type crazy principal, it won't work magic, it is kamikaze

teachers (and for that matter, any employees) thrives well in a certain given environment

and that environment is made up of the following :

1. peer support (fellow teachers, fellow co-workers) - share resources, tips, help one another etc

2. support from bosses (principal, vp, HOD, etc) - clear headed leadership, let the teachers teach instead of doubling up as admin manager - continuously improving on teaching materials, buy the necessary resource; provide the supporting framework like good IT set up, database management software, providing conducive physical environment like nice lounges in staff area, organise staff functions, appreciation for teachers who have done well, give recognition to teachers and sharing of best practice among colleagues

3. parental support of kids, ensuring kids do their homework, revision etc, good alumni network to support school activities, good PTA support

4. motivated teachers who has the calling to be an educators, not a mercenary who switch to teaching from corporate life because of being unable to cope with the strive and stress of the corporate work place.....

you can rotate a staff but you can't uproot culture, sense of belonging, sense of family, and you can't replicate culture and \"environment\"....these are built over time.....and yes, back to the popular catch phrase ..... not all school are the same good

:goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost: Spoke my mind exactly.

How do companies like Apple (technology driven) and more importantly, Hyatt Hotels (people driven) maintain a certain consistency of quality worldwide through soft power such as corporate culture? These 2 companies are present in different markets and yet globe trotters recognise a consistent level of service quality as well as intelligent adaptations to local needs.

If we gave schools like NYPS the chance to expand, would they be able to replicate themselves and seed the system with their culture?[/quote]well said :salute: verykiasu2010 / Chenonceau

If a Good visionary leader is allow full autonomy to manage,
with a few good men and an effective platoon.
no buts, he/she will succeed in any arena?

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:08:11 GMT

Chenonceau — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:08:11 GMT

verykiasu2010:
MOE = McDonalds of Education

you can order any fries as long as it is fried fries

:rotflmao: You think out of the box. We should let NYPS Board run MOE. That might help to spread good practices and great culture.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:06:41 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:06:41 GMT

MOE = McDonalds of Education

you can order any fries as long as it is fried fries

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:03:23 GMT

Chenonceau — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 07:03:23 GMT

Rotating Principals is MOE’s way of ensuring consistency across the system. They control the schools through Principal rotation/selection. They also use KPIs and awards to control. These management mechanisms are insufficient to ensure quality consistency across the system.

It’s like McDonald’s leaving it to each country to source ingredients for burgers. The main ingredients need centralized procurement by HQ, but of course, customers in different countries can still enjoy specialized burgers and there are differences in menu from country to country. France has a wide selection of salads we don’t get here but the core menu of burgers is what makes McDonald’s what it is. Here we get McDonald’s Rice Burgers that France does not sell.

MOE should have an HQ team that writes good resources for all teachers in all schools. Subsidiary control is a matter of degree. Too much control is stifling and prevents local responsiveness. To little control results in large variations in quality delivered from school to school. That is what is happening in schools now.

The problem at MOE is not teachers, nor resources etc… it’s that MOE’s org design does not allow HQ to easily unify the schools in practices and resources or even to spread good practices fast. One MOE, different schools, as many different variations in content and quality.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:56:30 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:56:30 GMT

limlim:
I got the impression that they rotate the principles.. how are they going to develop feeling for the schools like that..

My kids school principle just change.. and the previous one didn't even last a few years..

they do rotate

but some principals will never be rotated to say mission schools or gov't aided schools because (if I am not wrong) the management board or clan association or church board must also agree with the candidates

will a Maha Bodhi principal ever become a CHIJ principal ?

a VP could be in the position for 5 to 7 years and the take over from the out-going principal to be come the P for another 5 to 7 years ..... so it is possible for a P to have been with the same school for 10 to 14 years .....there is continuity ... not impossible

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:51:22 GMT

limlim — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:51:22 GMT

I got the impression that they rotate the principles… how are they going to develop feeling for the schools like that…

My kids school principle just change… and the previous one didn’t even last a few years…

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:10:15 GMT

Chenonceau — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 06:10:15 GMT

verykiasu2010:
vicki:
I'm wondering a little - but maybe abit 'offtopic' - so the result of popular schools like NYPS n HPPS - is it becos of the teachers or MOE biasness?

What happens if MOE totally switch the staff/ resources from these schools to less popular ones? Will the std of the unpopular school then go up?
if you parachute a very capable teacher to a lowest ranked primary school with a one of a kind type crazy principal, it won't work magic, it is kamikaze

teachers (and for that matter, any employees) thrives well in a certain given environment

and that environment is made up of the following :

1. peer support (fellow teachers, fellow co-workers) - share resources, tips, help one another etc

2. support from bosses (principal, vp, HOD, etc) - clear headed leadership, let the teachers teach instead of doubling up as admin manager - continuously improving on teaching materials, buy the necessary resource; provide the supporting framework like good IT set up, database management software, providing conducive physical environment like nice lounges in staff area, organise staff functions, appreciation for teachers who have done well, give recognition to teachers and sharing of best practice among colleagues

3. parental support of kids, ensuring kids do their homework, revision etc, good alumni network to support school activities, good PTA support

4. motivated teachers who has the calling to be an educators, not a mercenary who switch to teaching from corporate life because of being unable to cope with the strive and stress of the corporate work place.....

you can rotate a staff but you can't uproot culture, sense of belonging, sense of family, and you can't replicate culture and \"environment\"....these are built over time.....and yes, back to the popular catch phrase ..... not all school are the same good

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 05:00:20 GMT

verykiasu2010 — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 05:00:20 GMT

vicki:
I'm wondering a little - but maybe abit 'offtopic' - so the result of popular schools like NYPS n HPPS - is it becos of the teachers or MOE biasness?

What happens if MOE totally switch the staff/ resources from these schools to less popular ones? Will the std of the unpopular school then go up?

if you parachute a very capable teacher to a lowest ranked primary school with a one of a kind type crazy principal, it won't work magic, it is kamikaze

teachers (and for that matter, any employees) thrives well in a certain given environment

and that environment is made up of the following :

1. peer support (fellow teachers, fellow co-workers) - share resources, tips, help one another etc

2. support from bosses (principal, vp, HOD, etc) - clear headed leadership, let the teachers teach instead of doubling up as admin manager - continuously improving on teaching materials, buy the necessary resource; provide the supporting framework like good IT set up, database management software, providing conducive physical environment like nice lounges in staff area, organise staff functions, appreciation for teachers who have done well, give recognition to teachers and sharing of best practice among colleagues

3. parental support of kids, ensuring kids do their homework, revision etc, good alumni network to support school activities, good PTA support

4. motivated teachers who has the calling to be an educators, not a mercenary who switch to teaching from corporate life because of being unable to cope with the strive and stress of the corporate work place.....

you can rotate a staff but you can't uproot culture, sense of belonging, sense of family, and you can't replicate culture and \"environment\"....these are built over time.....and yes, back to the popular catch phrase ..... not all school are the same good

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 04:02:16 GMT

lim72 — Tue, 20 Mar 2012 04:02:16 GMT

Just make sure your kids are in the top three classes , sad to say, otherwise you are most likely left to your own device, even in top branded school. My friend’s dd is in this situation now.

She had made a bad decision as she is not highly educated, she can’t teach and she is not rich. Her dd is smart but not smart enough. I think if she studies in a normal school, she could be in the top three classes.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:38:38 GMT

znzyzyzx — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 14:38:38 GMT

vicki:
I'm wondering a little - but maybe abit 'offtopic' - so the result of popular schools like NYPS n HPPS - is it becos of the teachers or MOE biasness?

What happens if MOE totally switch the staff/ resources from these schools to less popular ones? Will the std of the unpopular school then go up?

Actually it is bcos of the parents (ie, the kids family background). Those who bother to send their kids to these schools are either more well off or more highly educated, so they can either teach the kids themselves or send for tuition. Even if not not teaching themselves or go for tuition, the kids are also in a better off environment with more resources available.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Sat, 03 Mar 2012 09:03:46 GMT

Baby_May_09 — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 09:03:46 GMT

huanghou:
Baby_May_09:
I think that the current situation of primary one registration is quite ridiculous. Even if you only want your kid to go to a better neighborhood school near your house, you have to do PV for a chance to ballot. Before I have any kids, I used to tell myself not to be so kiasu, don't need to do PV...

I used to think so too...not anymore...have since repented...hee hee :nailbite:

I used to think never mind my kid don't have to go to branded/top primary school just a not too bad school near my house. But looking at the current situation, I have to ask myself - since I am intending to do PV, should I try my luck at the top/ branded school instead of doing PV at a better neighborhood school which might not even guarantee me a place. Or do I really do nothing and let the government post me to a hopefully not so bad school. I think doing nothing is fine maybe 5 years ago, looking at current situation, PV is the norm and I think I cannot do nothing anymore unless the changes Govt come up with is good enough such that everyone (or most) don't have to do PV.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Sat, 03 Mar 2012 08:59:55 GMT

vicki — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 08:59:55 GMT

I’m wondering a little - but maybe abit ‘offtopic’ - so the result of popular schools like NYPS n HPPS - is it becos of the teachers or MOE biasness?

What happens if MOE totally switch the staff/ resources from these schools to less popular ones? Will the std of the unpopular school then go up?

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Sat, 03 Mar 2012 07:13:30 GMT

huanghou — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 07:13:30 GMT

Baby_May_09:
I think that the current situation of primary one registration is quite ridiculous. Even if you only want your kid to go to a better neighborhood school near your house, you have to do PV for a chance to ballot. Before I have any kids, I used to tell myself not to be so kiasu, don't need to do PV...

I used to think so too...not anymore...have since repented...hee hee :nailbite:

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Fri, 02 Mar 2012 18:53:37 GMT

Baby_May_09 — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 18:53:37 GMT

I think that the current situation of primary one registration is quite ridiculous. Even if you only want your kid to go to a better neighborhood school near your house, you have to do PV for a chance to ballot. Before I have any kids, I used to tell myself not to be so kiasu, don’t need to do PV, but now PV has become the norm so I may be ‘forced’ to do PV. For some popular schools, you may not even get selected for PV. I can see the reasons for all the phases ie. Phase 1 for practical reasons, phase 2A for ties of old boys/girls to the school, phase 2B for all contributions recognized ie clan, church and grassroots.

I do not know how MOE is going to change the registration process, but I hope it will somehow be better than the situation now. However it is a zero sum game, certain group of people will be better off after the change and certain group of people will be worse off.

That being the case, personally, I would prefer that priority be given to
Singaporean kid at all phases.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Thu, 01 Mar 2012 02:01:54 GMT

1amber — Thu, 01 Mar 2012 02:01:54 GMT

Don’t think so. As someone pointed out, the system, processes and KPIs are different between local primary schools and international IB schools Y1-Y5. Like apples are apples and and oranges are oranges. So no need to worry that all the best teachers who can teach apples well will get hired to teach oranges. Otherwise, even before asking for transfer from an apple school to an orange school, we will hear of many teachers wanting transfers to top local apple schools.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Thu, 01 Mar 2012 01:02:05 GMT

jtoh — Thu, 01 Mar 2012 01:02:05 GMT

janet_lee88:
huanghou:
If parents prefer to send their kids to international school where learning is more fun than all the tuition and scrambling around for notes and papers that schools do not provide, then why should MOE stop them even if they live and work here?

Isn't this their personal choice? So back to this thread - if MOE would like every local kid to be in local school then why should he/she not be given priority?
Since govt has given the go ahead for international schools like ACS (international), SJI I and HCI to operate, why not allow primary schools to go independent too ? If rich parents send their littles one to international primary schools, then there will be more vacancies for mainstream primary schools, esp popular ones. Then we won't have another Jim Rogers taking up a place in Phase 2B in NYPS.

What if this does get the go-ahead and the international primary schools hire some of the best teachers, have the best processes etc. All the while somehow the kids are having fun and still do well for PSLE (assuming that PSLE is still compulsory for all regardless of whether you're in international or local schools).

Will there come a time when other parents will cry foul and say it's not fair that the rich are able to send their kids to these international schools while the rest have to attend your local primary schools who may not have the best teachers/processes?

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Thu, 01 Mar 2012 00:09:53 GMT

janet88 — Thu, 01 Mar 2012 00:09:53 GMT

huanghou:
If parents prefer to send their kids to international school where learning is more fun than all the tuition and scrambling around for notes and papers that schools do not provide, then why should MOE stop them even if they live and work here?

Isn't this their personal choice? So back to this thread - if MOE would like every local kid to be in local school then why should he/she not be given priority?

Since govt has given the go ahead for international schools like ACS (international), SJI I and HCI to operate, why not allow primary schools to go independent too ? If rich parents send their littles one to international primary schools, then there will be more vacancies for mainstream primary schools, esp popular ones. Then we won't have another Jim Rogers taking up a place in Phase 2B in NYPS.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:44:55 GMT

huanghou — Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:44:55 GMT

Well, if you have been toggling between different threads you will read a comment that when our children suffer we suffer. How true.

If parents prefer to send their kids to international school where learning is more fun than all the tuition and scrambling around for notes and papers that schools do not provide, then why should MOE stop them even if they live and work here?

Isn’t this their personal choice? So back to this thread - if MOE would like every local kid to be in local school then why should he/she not be given priority?

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:29:13 GMT

toddles — Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:29:13 GMT

well the international school fees are much higher than local schools’ isn’t it?

they have a "better" curriculum in that it’s not so stressful, and more fun.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:20:47 GMT

huanghou — Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:20:47 GMT

Not at all. There are quite a handful of local parents who intentionally do not wish to enter the rat race and choose to put their kids in international schools. For now these parents must produce justification why their kid cannot enter local primary and it must be by reason of overseas work etc.

International schools go by IB program. It is a different curriculum from local program you will not end up in the scenario like rich get posh schools with great teachers.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:11:48 GMT

toddles — Wed, 29 Feb 2012 02:11:48 GMT

1amber:
Mawar:
I have nothing against parents who use their financial muscle to give their children a head start in life. They have worked hard, and they are free to spend their money. In fact, I am pro choice. Use the money to put their kids into the private school of their choice.

Maybe there should be more private schools to give MOE a run for their existence.
MOE should start first by giving parents the freedom to place their kids in international schools from primary school.

This is a bit like making the primary school system like the preschool/childcare system today. Free for all, dependent on market forces. You pay for what you want to get.

I find that a bit disturbing, because it again favours the rich.

In fact, I am in favour for increased regulation and standardisation of the pre-primary sector so that parents are not held ransom in paying exorbitant fees for an adequate level of care/teaching. The high fees are going into owners/franchiseee pockets, not even the teachers', who are paid dismal wages.

At least with pri sch, the fees paid across the board are heavily subsidised and standardised, as well as the fact that all the teachers are NIE trained grads so there's some minimum standard. Whatever our beef with the current registration, at least ability to pay very high fees is not another factor to decide who gets to the 'good' schools.

If we go the preschool way, it might be a race to the bottom. The rich will be able to afford the posh schools with the great teachers, and the have-nots will get lousy \"public school\" teachers.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 28 Feb 2012 14:25:43 GMT

janet88 — Tue, 28 Feb 2012 14:25:43 GMT

1amber:
Mawar:
I have nothing against parents who use their financial muscle to give their children a head start in life. They have worked hard, and they are free to spend their money.

Maybe there should be more private schools to give MOE a run for their existence.
MOE should start first by giving parents the freedom to place their kids in international schools from primary school.

If there are INDEPENDENT primary schools, then rich parents can send their kids there all the way...then the ordinary parents like us will have NO more problems with P1 registration. Present phases remain status quo.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 28 Feb 2012 07:00:48 GMT

1amber — Tue, 28 Feb 2012 07:00:48 GMT

Mawar:
I have nothing against parents who use their financial muscle to give their children a head start in life. They have worked hard, and they are free to spend their money. In fact, I am pro choice. Use the money to put their kids into the private school of their choice.

Maybe there should be more private schools to give MOE a run for their existence.

MOE should start first by giving parents the freedom to place their kids in international schools from primary school.

Reply to MOE should give P1 registration priority to SG kids? on Tue, 28 Feb 2012 07:00:42 GMT

cherrygal — Tue, 28 Feb 2012 07:00:42 GMT

Aiyah… so complicating… I feel apart from Phase 1 (siblings), the whole of Phase 2A - 2C should be combined into 1 phase. Foreigners come in at Phase 3.

Just give:
10 ballot slips to SG citizens (both parents) who live <1km, + old student / PV / clan / church
8 slips to SG citizens (both parents) who live 1-2km, + old student / PV / clan / church

6 slips to SG citizen (1 parent) / PR who live <1km, + old student / PV / clan / church
6 slips to SG citizens (both parents) who live <1km, no other connections

4 slips to SG citizen (1 parent)/PR who live 1-2km, + old student / PV / clan / church
4 slips to SG citizen (1 parent)/PR who live <1km, no other connections
4 slips to SG citizens (both parents) who live 1-2km, no other connections

2 slips to SG citizen (1 parent)/PR who live 1-2km, no other connections

1 slip to SG citizens and PRs who live >2km, regardless of any connections (this one is really heng suay)

Phase 2 Supp for those unsuccessful above.

Foreigners can only try at Phase 3 if any vacancies left.