Is GEP really necessary?
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Chenonceau:
Of course yes! IMO, nobody wants to be extraordinary, simply because of the price we have to pay. That is why, I often tell my children that they are ordinary people doing extraordinary things. And I agree that all we want is for our kids to be normal and blend in.
Extraordinary people stand out, no? They don't blend in? If you draw extraordinarily well, people notice you. You will still be lonely in that only you can engage with your art at the level you do. Others cannot understand. When you can see things and do things others cannot, you are different. Not ordinary.Imami:
I see a difference between being able to blend in with the Majority and being ordinary. No, If i can have a say, i do not want my child to be ordinary. Being such a mediocre all my life, I do not wish that on my child if he is capable of more. One can be different/better yet being able to blend in.
When I started Potato Chinese(TM), I was flamed by those who did not understand the human psychology. I met resistance from my own family. It was lonely. Not until we obtained results were friends and family open to my psychological explanations of why and how it works. Potato Chinese(TM) isn't anything great but it does mean I am different... And it made Little Boy a little less ordinary. But it did mean social rejection for me, for a while. And really, that is peanuts compared to what truly extraordinary people have to bear.
Being extraordinary means you can't blend in. The 2 go together, no? What you want is high ability. Those can still blend in. Gee... Am I even making sense? Sorry... Sleepy... Not very coherent! Heh!
Having said that, you can now understand how difficult it is to be ordinary. It is a struggle for me on a daily basis. I send the kids to school, they won't blend in, I send them to universities, they thrive! So, we send them to universities at a young age.
It puzzles me why people want their kids to be known to be smart or gifted, because it is such a tall order. There are so many expectations, so many assumptions and so many misunderstandings. When you look at people who brought us innovations and pushed the boundaries, it is about them being just themselves and doing something way within their reach. An example is Terry Tao. His colleague told of how he solved a problem within a day or two that would have taken himself a few years. His invention is now used in our digital cameras. It required no effort to solve complex questions for him.
Sometimes, I wished my kids were simpler, I told my DS1 he thinks too much. I wished he would simplify things rather than thinking so much! I see how he deliberately dumb down so he could fit in, and avoid using his 'prowess' unless pushed to the corner. He does all these just to blend in and survive. My #4 had such a hard time fitting into schools - any school. But in the university, he thrived. He topped his Ivy League class last semester with a 96/100, though he is at least 8 years younger than the next youngest. That was not what we set out to do. We put him there because we do not know where else to put him, tried every kind of school we can think of. Funny enough, while he (still) struggles in primary school, he thrives in the university.
People who do extraordinary things might not necessarily thought they were going to. They were simply doing what they love and challenged themselves beyond what they are able, and no amount of branding or MOE telling us our kids are gifted can change that. Some of us are given more, and to those who are given more, more is expected. We cannot live well, until we are able to be who we are. I often pray that my kids will enjoy their gifts to the fullest, as much as I pray that they use whatever gifted them to bring mankind to the next level in their small ways. Big or small, it does not matter, all we want is for them is to be happy, ordinary and normal. Just like every parent.
This video shows us how these folks were misfits, and you can call them any names. None started out well and often misunderstood. But in the end, they chose to listen to themselves and be themselves, and then they achieved beyond what any human ever dreamed of. The price to pay for being different is high, and I pray that my kids will never have to pay that price: to have happiness and enjoy life ranks above all else.
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jULUGHJCCj4][/youtube] -
Chenonceau:
I see you define this way - if you cannot blend in, you must be extraordinary. If you can blend in, you must be ordinary. But I view it this way - extraordinary people hardly blends in with the majority. Most people can blend in with the majority (note: nothing mention about. Their ability).
Extraordinary people stand out, no? They don't blend in? If you draw extraordinarily well, people notice you. You will still be lonely in that only you can engage with your art at the level you do. Others cannot understand. When you can see things and do things others cannot, you are different. Not ordinary.Imami:
I see a difference between being able to blend in with the Majority and being ordinary. No, If i can have a say, i do not want my child to be ordinary. Being such a mediocre all my life, I do not wish that on my child if he is capable of more. One can be different/better yet being able to blend in.
When I started Potato Chinese(TM), I was flamed by those who did not understand the human psychology. I met resistance from my own family. It was lonely. Not until we obtained results were friends and family open to my psychological explanations of why and how it works. Potato Chinese(TM) isn't anything great but it does mean I am different... And it made Little Boy a little less ordinary. But it did mean social rejection for me, for a while. And really, that is peanuts compared to what truly extraordinary people have to bear.
Being extraordinary means you can't blend in. The 2 go together, no? What you want is high ability. Those can still blend in. Gee... Am I even making sense? Sorry... Sleepy... Not very coherent! Heh!
I am not disputing your idea of and examples given for extraordinary people. I just thought the definition of blending in or not, can be broader. -
2ppaamm:
That is probably because their kids are not in the first place. What one doesn't have, is always the best. How many parents can be totally contented who their children are and leave things as it is?
Of course yes! IMO, nobody wants to be extraordinary, simply because of the price we have to pay. That is why, I often tell my children that they are ordinary people doing extraordinary things. And I agree that all we want is for our kids to be normal and blend in.
Having said that, you can now understand how difficult it is to be ordinary. It is a struggle for me on a daily basis. I send the kids to school, they won't blend in, I send them to universities, they thrive! So, we send them to universities at a young age.
It puzzles me why people want their kids to be known to be smart or gifted, because it is such a tall order. There are so many expectations, so many assumptions and so many misunderstandings. When you look at people who brought us innovations and pushed the boundaries, it is about them being just themselves and doing something way within their reach. An example is Terry Tao. His colleague told of how he solved a problem within a day or two that would have taken himself a few years. His invention is now used in our digital cameras. It required no effort to solve complex questions for him.
Sometimes, I wished my kids were simpler, I told my DS1 he thinks too much. I wished he would simplify things rather than thinking so much! I see how he deliberately dumb down so he could fit in, and avoid using his 'prowess' unless pushed to the corner. He does all these just to blend in and survive. My #4 had such a hard time fitting into schools - any school. But in the university, he thrived. He topped his Ivy League class last semester with a 96/100, though he is at least 8 years younger than the next youngest. That was not what we set out to do. We put him there because we do not know where else to put him, tried every kind of school we can think of. Funny enough, while he (still) struggles in primary school, he thrives in the university.
People who do extraordinary things might not necessarily thought they were going to. They were simply doing what they love and challenged themselves beyond what they are able, and no amount of branding or MOE telling us our kids are gifted can change that. Some of us are given more, and to those who are given more, more is expected. We cannot live well, until we are able to be who we are. I often pray that my kids will enjoy their gifts to the fullest, as much as I pray that they use whatever gifted them to bring mankind to the next level in their small ways. Big or small, it does not matter, all we want is for them is to be happy, ordinary and normal. Just like every parent.
This video shows us how these folks were misfits, and you can call them any names. None started out well and often misunderstood. But in the end, they chose to listen to themselves and be themselves, and then they achieved beyond what any human ever dreamed of. The price to pay for being different is high, and I pray that my kids will never have to pay that price: to have happiness and enjoy life ranks above all else.
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jULUGHJCCj4][/youtube] -
ksi:
If her son were still there.... It would mean the program was suitable? In that case...Dear 2ppaamm,
Appreciate and like your sharing of your children's less travelled path for Singapore kids to be inspired....but...
If your GEP son is still in GEP today, will you campaign so hard against GEP? :? Just wondering.... -
Imami:
I see you define this way - if you cannot blend in, you must be extraordinary. If you can blend in, you must be ordinary. But I view it this way - extraordinary people hardly blends in with the majority. Most people can blend in with the majority (note: nothing mention about. Their ability).
Extraordinary people stand out, no? They don't blend in? If you draw extraordinarily well, people notice you. You will still be lonely in that only you can engage with your art at the level you do. Others cannot understand. When you can see things and do things others cannot, you are different. Not ordinary.Chenonceau:
[quote=\"Imami\"]
I see a difference between being able to blend in with the Majority and being ordinary. No, If i can have a say, i do not want my child to be ordinary. Being such a mediocre all my life, I do not wish that on my child if he is capable of more. One can be different/better yet being able to blend in.
When I started Potato Chinese(TM), I was flamed by those who did not understand the human psychology. I met resistance from my own family. It was lonely. Not until we obtained results were friends and family open to my psychological explanations of why and how it works. Potato Chinese(TM) isn't anything great but it does mean I am different... And it made Little Boy a little less ordinary. But it did mean social rejection for me, for a while. And really, that is peanuts compared to what truly extraordinary people have to bear.
Being extraordinary means you can't blend in. The 2 go together, no? What you want is high ability. Those can still blend in. Gee... Am I even making sense? Sorry... Sleepy... Not very coherent! Heh!
I am not disputing your idea of and examples given for extraordinary people. I just thought the definition of blending in or not, can be broader.[/quote]Nope. I meant.... If you are extraordinary, you can't blend in.
I did not mean that all those who CAN blend in are ordinary. There are many many high ability people who can blend in. My kids are of those. I made sure all their lives that they CAN blend in and I am happy DD went to NUS so that she can learn to get along with the majority of Singaporeans beyond her rarefied top school.
It is the truly gifted that suffer. Like Pam's kids. But then well.... I dun think God let Pam choose.
When God chooses a woman to bring up a genius, he anoints a saint. I dun wanna be a saint. Too painful.
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Chenonceau:
Well, does pam believe in God?
It is the truly gifted that suffer. Like Pam's kids. But then well.... I dun think God let Pam choose.
By the way, just wondering if you or Pam went thru our own pri school system yourselves coz some of your writings seem to give me the impression that u only 1st tasted our school system thru yr kids. -
verykiasu2010:
Thks for the correction huh ...
i think some of us really åæåęé¾ instead of ęåęé¾ :evil: :evil: :rotflmao:vlim:
Hi 2ppamm,
I think I get your pt ... But I think for parents who are not so resourceful and $$$$... They have no choice but to 'play' the game ... As we wouldn't want chances or money to drop from the shy ... Neither do I want to let my kid to go to a much lousier school if I think tt he deserve or good enough to be in a better one ....
Anyway tt is just my opinion, all of us hope to åæåęé¾...but we parents can only help Our kids within our own capability ... Sad huh ..unfair huh .. ..
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I think the school experience has changed over the last 20 years. And once you have tasted and seen a different system, you realise the drawbacks of our system. it is not without its strengths, and I think it did a good job providing high quality basic education to an entire population in a very short time. But it is not perfect. My main gripe is that kids will burn out too early and the entire mode of teaching at the lower levels do not support the higher thinking skills required at the tertiary levels.
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Edureach:
I understand your situation as outlined above and also delighed to hear your story.
Thank you for taking time to read my post.
On this occassion, i also want to comment on the issue of achieving T-score of above 262 not to debate but for the benefits of readers in general. In RI, the above 80 percentile are indeed very bright naturally and they discuss about the possibilities of studying in top ranked unis overseas with and without top scholarships. Those within the 50-80 percentile also hve their dreams and this grp continues to do well in their A-levels every yr. The problem is those at the bottom 20 percentile, about 250 students each yr struggling to perform decently.
I hope ds can stay within the 70 - 85 percentile. He is one that prefers to be a small fish in a big pond. So I guess RI pond fits him well. I think it is less stressful to be a small fish, as no one expects you to be the top anymore. You can take your time to learn and improve. My wish is he will enjoy his education in RI, make lifelong friends, be an independent and critical thinker and of good character.
Scholarship panels in general treat every applicant as equal irrespective of the jcs. Apart from RI and HCI, there are another 7 jcs even excluding NUSH and ACSI that are producing students capable of winning scholarships or securing the most competive courses in medicine, dentistry, law and accountancy etc. Many of these jcs' tutors were once students of leading schools. Do not also forget that good ccas and evedence of leadership are aslo required. The quality of the teaching faculty in at least the top 15 schools are equal, no such thing as RI is more superior in this area hence higher chance of securing better results. You could be suprised that many RI students attend external tuitions.
Yes, I am fully aware of this too. Like any other schools, RI has good and so-so teachers too. I would say ds has a very good form teacher this year. I am so glad that ds has her as a teacher.
We parents know our kids best as heighted in this forun by many parents. All in all, we need to pray for wisdom.
I fully agree with you on this. As parents we know our child the best and I really pray for wisdom to bring them up to be fine young man.
In this thread, there are invaluable articles contributed by 2ppaamm, chenonceau and many others. I hve learnt something and so do many others. -
Chenonceau:
Hi Chen,My DD had 8 distinctions at A levels... Prize-winning sportswoman... 2 research awards amongst others. Rejected by Cambridge. Her best friend was VP of student council in secondary... She took a top tier PSC scholarship even BEFORE sitting A levels. Rejected by Princeton AND Harvard.
Ivy leagues want you to be top of your school. They don't care whether you come from a school where you compete with the best of the nation or not. It's the bell curve in YOUR school that counts. It doesn't matter that the average in RI is better academically than the top in another school in China, the top in the other school stands a better chance. DD's tutor explained that Cambridge reduced intake of Singaporean students greatly last year. The places went to PRC students instead. Pam's kids went on alternative paths where they don't compete like crazy. They had differentiated paths and this differentiation has put almost all of them in Harvard on scholarship. I am not sure Pam's kids are smarter than DD's best friend. They're just so lucky to have Pam. This is what Pam meant by we may be an island but we are part of the world.
That has been our experience.
But if you're not sticky about Ivy League then a good A level certainly does get you nice bond free scholarships to NUS and various Australian unis. We're not sticky about Ivy League in our family. We reckon that after 5 years in the workforce... Unless you wanna be in academia... No one cares which uni you went to.
Thanks for sharing. Can you help me with the following scenario.
Student A & Student B both have equally excellent A level results, sporting and leadership achievements etc. Student A is from RI/HCI. Student B from a less academically competitive school. Student A is an above average student in RI/HCI, but not the top student. Student B is a top student in this average school.
Does that mean that Student B will be offered a place in Cambridge, Oxford, Princeton, Harvard and the like over Student A? Has this actually happened, ie a student like Student B was offered a place in Oxbridge and the Ivy Leagues this year?
What if Student B has less outstanding A level results, sporting achievement etc compared to Student A but is still the top student in his less competitive school. Will he still be viewed more favorably than Student A by these top universities?
Thanks.
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