Population woes

[pirate]

3Boys:

matrix0405:

BG Tan already issued 2 warnings on this issue.

Enlighten me.

Apparently some idiot HR firm advertised some openings stating to the effect that only foreigners need apply. After that, some people think that this is enough to show that all Singapore employers prefer to employ foreigners because they are 'cheaper' and hence Singaporean PMEs need special protection.

[verykiasumummy]

every country wil have their fair bit of FT or FW, not just in sg… i believe a missing link in balance in just required to make sg more harmonious…

[limlim]

3Boys:

limlim:

Yes.. but not at the expense of the well-being of locals please..

Fight means must make some sacrifice lah! Not at some cost, then what kind of fight are we putting up?!

If other people willing to make sacrifices but Singaporeans cannot, then how to win the fight?

If we lose the fight, the well-being of locals WILL be compromised!

Why you still don't get it?

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1233404/1/.html
[quote]He said Singapore cannot continue to rely on low cost foreign labour to grow the economy.

Relying on low cost labour is a race to the bottom. The price advantage that companies offer cannot be based just on lower cost. This is because Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.

Mr Tan also said over reliance on low cost labour imposes hidden costs on the economy and on society.

It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.

[/quote]The fight shouldn't be on the basis of providing cheap workers.. including PMETs.

He may be referring to FW.. but the same reasoning applies to PMETs too. \"Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.\", \"It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.\"

[3Boys]

limlim:

3Boys:

[quote=\"limlim\"]Yes.. but not at the expense of the well-being of locals please..

Fight means must make some sacrifice lah! Not at some cost, then what kind of fight are we putting up?!

If other people willing to make sacrifices but Singaporeans cannot, then how to win the fight?

If we lose the fight, the well-being of locals WILL be compromised!

Why you still don't get it?

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1233404/1/.html
[quote]He said Singapore cannot continue to rely on low cost foreign labour to grow the economy.

Relying on low cost labour is a race to the bottom. The price advantage that companies offer cannot be based just on lower cost. This is because Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.

Mr Tan also said over reliance on low cost labour imposes hidden costs on the economy and on society.

It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.

[/quote]The fight shouldn't be on the basis of providing cheap workers.. including PMETs.

He may be referring to FW.. but the same reasoning applies to PMETs too. \"Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.\", \"It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.\"[/quote]Agreed, but you said well being leh. Meaning what, cannot suffer a bit is it? Chiong a bit and stress also cannot?

[zarahsmom]

limlim:

3Boys:

[quote=\"limlim\"]Yes.. but not at the expense of the well-being of locals please..

Fight means must make some sacrifice lah! Not at some cost, then what kind of fight are we putting up?!

If other people willing to make sacrifices but Singaporeans cannot, then how to win the fight?

If we lose the fight, the well-being of locals WILL be compromised!

Why you still don't get it?

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1233404/1/.html
[quote]He said Singapore cannot continue to rely on low cost foreign labour to grow the economy.

Relying on low cost labour is a race to the bottom. The price advantage that companies offer cannot be based just on lower cost. This is because Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.

Mr Tan also said over reliance on low cost labour imposes hidden costs on the economy and on society.

It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.

[/quote]The fight shouldn't be on the basis of providing cheap workers.. including PMETs.

He may be referring to FW.. but the same reasoning applies to PMETs too. \"Singapore cannot out compete with its neighbours who will always have more ready access to low cost labour.\", \"It reduces motivation to innovate, raise productivity and move up the value chain.\"[/quote]I am a pinoy.. and most of my singaporean friends can understand me and from the last time I check, I know that my salary isn't categorised as \"cheap\", so I always have to prove my value every quarterly performance objective setting and appraisal.

but I do agree with above post from limlim, we cann compete with low cost labour too much (whether its in Singapore or China, India or Philippines)... salary have to be commensurate to skills and experience.. and overall attitude towards contributing for the company, customers and greater good..not nationalities (that one I think we have a common ground)..

I so love all the ethics training being force fed to all MNCs, it forces everyone to make ethical decisions everyday....including on the issue of DIVERSITY

however, fighting for the high value jobs need a lot of hardwork and intuition and a lot of changing of overall attitude...

[limlim]

zarahsmom:

I am a pinoy.. and most of my singaporean friends can understand me and from the last time I check, I know that my salary isn't categorised as \"cheap\", so I always have to prove my value every quarterly performance objective setting and appraisal.

Hi zarahsmom.. I did make it a point to mention that my pinoy colleague does exhibit professionalism and capability.. so, we have to recognise that indeed there are foreign talents.. as in your case where you have demonstrated that you do possess capability, and your company recognise and reward you accordingly.

So, those rant that I have against FT policy is the large number of those who aren't really qualified. you wouldn't take my comments too personal ya.. Just want to say that I appreciate your sharing and input too..

[limlim]

3Boys:

Agreed, but you said well being leh. Meaning what, cannot suffer a bit is it? Chiong a bit and stress also cannot?

no lah.. of coz stress and chiong must lah.. \"well being\" as in.. salary lor.. and standard of living in the mist of the inflation and rapidly rising costs.

just that sometimes, the locals may not get a chance to chiong and kena stress if the competition is too cheap for the employer to resist.. (just saying)

[zarahsmom]

limlim:

zarahsmom:

I am a pinoy.. and most of my singaporean friends can understand me and from the last time I check, I know that my salary isn't categorised as \"cheap\", so I always have to prove my value every quarterly performance objective setting and appraisal.

Hi zarahsmom.. I did make it a point to mention that my pinoy colleague does exhibit professionalism and capability.. so, we have to recognise that indeed there are foreign talents.. as in your case where you have demonstrated that you do possess capability, and your company recognise and reward you accordingly.

So, those rant that I have against FT policy is the large number of those who aren't really qualified. you wouldn't take my comments too personal ya.. Just want to say that I appreciate your sharing and input too..

:lovesite: just \"contributing\" to interesting conversation.. am also hoping that my fellow pinoy and other fellow FW reading this.. as I must admit the misunderstanding happens on both sides too..

during my first 2 years here, I honestly think most SCs are too demanding and too whiney...past my 3rd yr mark, I begin to emphatise more...

scenario 1: I hear my SC colleague making a point about our unreasonable boss who happens to be outside of SG (and managing us remotely)

Year 2000 -- my reaction would be.. here we go again
Now---? I knoww.. can relate..

:grphug:

[Daddy D]

http://www.straitstimes.com:80/premium/top-the-news/story/govt-may-curb-inflow-s-pass-holders-20121026

[quote]Govt may curb inflow of S-Pass holders
Spike in number of foreign workers on such permits raises concerns

THE Manpower Ministry (MOM) is looking at tightening the inflow of S-Pass holders in a bid to further slow down the increase of foreign workers here.

And to deter firms from employing locals on token pay just to hire more foreign workers, MOM will raise the minimum pay at which locals can be considered full-time workers when calculating a firm's foreign workers quota.

Acting Manpower Minister Tan Chuan-Jin disclosed these impending moves to The Straits Times in an exclusive interview this week.

Explaining the tightening of SPasses, Mr Tan said: \"We have seen a spike in the numbers.\"

The number of foreigners on S Passes shot up by 14,200 to hit 128,100 in the first half of this year. These foreigners earn over $2,000 a month in supervisory or junior professional, managerial and executive (PME) jobs.
\"If there is any prospect of a downturn, you do not want to accentuate (it) further,\" he said. \"So you want to make sure that the policies are sensible given that climate.\"

Mr Tan acknowledged the tensions between keeping Singapore business-friendly and controlling foreign worker numbers.

But the ultimate consideration, he said, must be the well-being of Singaporeans.

\"On a net basis, does it still benefit our people? I think that has to be the question. If it doesn't, then I think we have to relook the equations.\"[/quote]The spike is indeed a worry... At least to me and my future generation.
To curb or not to curb?
Don't get me started on which is the lesser evil... :faint:

[3Boys]

Daddy

http://www.straitstimes.com:80/premium/top-the-news/story/govt-may-curb-inflow-s-pass-holders-20121026

[quote]Govt may curb inflow of S-Pass holders
Spike in number of foreign workers on such permits raises concerns

THE Manpower Ministry (MOM) is looking at tightening the inflow of S-Pass holders in a bid to further slow down the increase of foreign workers here.

And to deter firms from employing locals on token pay just to hire more foreign workers, MOM will raise the minimum pay at which locals can be considered full-time workers when calculating a firm's foreign workers quota.

Acting Manpower Minister Tan Chuan-Jin disclosed these impending moves to The Straits Times in an exclusive interview this week.

Explaining the tightening of SPasses, Mr Tan said: \"We have seen a spike in the numbers.\"

The number of foreigners on S Passes shot up by 14,200 to hit 128,100 in the first half of this year. These foreigners earn over $2,000 a month in supervisory or junior professional, managerial and executive (PME) jobs.
\"If there is any prospect of a downturn, you do not want to accentuate (it) further,\" he said. \"So you want to make sure that the policies are sensible given that climate.\"

Mr Tan acknowledged the tensions between keeping Singapore business-friendly and controlling foreign worker numbers.

But the ultimate consideration, he said, must be the well-being of Singaporeans.

\"On a net basis, does it still benefit our people? I think that has to be the question. If it doesn't, then I think we have to relook the equations.\"

The spike is indeed a worry... At least to me and my future generation.
To curb or not to curb?
Don't get me started on which is the lesser evil... :faint:[/quote]It is the reality. We do need to move up the productivity curve, and part of the answer is curtailing the easy availability of cheap labour.

I really do think its do or die in the next 10-15 years for our economy.