Corona Virus Disease (COVID-19) Updates
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lee_yl\" post_id=\"2037421\" time=\"1631291850\" user_id=\"17023:
How about PM Lee? PM Lee announced on his TV broadcast how SG can exit from managing Covid via Vaccinate, Test and Trace. But the MTF sort of forgot about following these (basic) strategies.
I think it’s just the fear of the unknown. I think the country is well-positioned to transit into endemic and can see OYK believes it could work. But the rest like LW and HC are probably still on the fence about it. I guess they all give OYK 2 weeks to see if his theory would actually work out.Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2037396\" time=\"1631274127\" user_id=\"38907:
[quote=lee_yl post_id=2037389 time=1631269636 user_id=17023]My DH says MOH and MTF too panicky. Don’t know what they are talking about.
LW said we all should be mentally prepared that cases will surge once we open up. Our cases already surged to 451 before the tourists started coming in and with 50% still WFH. So “Open up” to what? Opening of dining in?
The vaccination rate has reached 81%, so there’s no more trump card except to roll out booster shots?
OYK must have the courage lah. But can sense he is feeling very pressurized already. So it will be a pity cos we will never know whether his idea will work or not. :sad:
During the conference, OYK mentioned that contact tracing still need to go through manual interview and every interview lasts for 2hours+. Upon hearing this, DH nearly fell off his chair. Thought we already pushed out Trace Together token (at a very high cost), the app and Safe Entry yet we still need to rely on manual process? What’s wrong? If you interview 10 pax, 8 will not remember where they have been for past 2 weeks. And if ask 10 pax whether they had visited KTVs, 9 would say no.
OYK said MOH can’t contact trace because the daily numbers are so huge. They cannot spend 2hrs for every case. Did the ego of the ‘person-in-charge of contact tracing’ so big that he didn’t know how to ask for help? Last year still roped in SAF and Police to help. Now it’s tooooo late, daily unlinked numbers too big, can’t be helped, sigh….[/quote]I think the point is eventually to stop contact tracing altogether. Anyway, I think was it you who said that SG is shooting itself in the foot by including asymptomatic cases in the daily count whereas some countries only tally the symptomatic ones (like probably Taiwan)?
Anyway it seems that from the news they seem to be willing to accept a threshold of 3000 cases a day eventually. With the new rule allowing mild and asymptomatic cases to recover at home we shall see if the hospital could cope. -
The data from the MINDSville and Bukit Merah clusters back in June already suggests that the P and M mRNA vaccines are ineffective against transmission of the Delta variant. So the idea now 3 months later for the boosters is still more of the same? What scientific principle is this meant to be following?
Conversely, on what scientific principle can one say that after 2 shots of P or M, a booster shot of an inactivated virus vaccine is unlikely to induce a broader immune response or is likely to be more dangerous than a booster of P or M?
On what scientific principle do we say 2S+1P or 1M = good, but 2P or 2M+1S = bad?
I appreciate there is still not enough published data on mixing. But are we supposed to look at scientific data as if we are rote learning, without seeking to apply some scientific principle or knowledge? Especially when there is likewise no data to show that 3P or 3M is better or safer than 2P or 2M + 1S.
Isn’t it time to step up studies on mixing boosters? Or are we waiting for the West to get over their political hangup? -
Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2037441\" time=\"1631321315\" user_id=\"38907:
Given the current climate of fear, I doubt they will stop contact tracing anytime in the foreseeable future. I think they should just gradually (and more quickly!) reduce the extent of contact tracing. Just known contacts - family, colleagues, social gatherings - should be sufficient rather than try to track everyone they sat near in the hawker centre, who were in the same shopping centre at the same time, etc.
I think the point is eventually to stop contact tracing altogether. Anyway, I think was it you who said that SG is shooting itself in the foot by including asymptomatic cases in the daily count whereas some countries only tally the symptomatic ones (like probably Taiwan)?
Anyway it seems that from the news they seem to be willing to accept a threshold of 3000 cases a day eventually. With the new rule allowing mild and asymptomatic cases to recover at home we shall see if the hospital could cope.
I'm glad they are reducing the quarantine duration, and relying more on testing. I feel that this is what our testing capacity should increasingly be used for - letting people get out of restrictions rather than capture more people to restrict! I think I may have been the one who made the \"shooting themselves in the foot\" comment? Since once someone has been tested and got a positive, I guess you are obliged to count it, I think they should just test less, and certainly not \"step up testing\" for people without close contact with a positive case and are not in frontline occupations. My office staff are all fully vaccinated, never meet outsiders (everything online now), are only working 1-2 days in the office each week - yet we are now told that we will have to do ART weekly. Why? Just because they use public transport and visit supermarkets? -
Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2037441\" time=\"1631321315\" user_id=\"38907:
Thank you slmkhoo for the clarification.
I think the point is eventually to stop contact tracing altogether. Anyway, I think was it you who said that SG is shooting itself in the foot by including asymptomatic cases in the daily count whereas some countries only tally the symptomatic ones (like probably Taiwan)?
Anyway it seems that from the news they seem to be willing to accept a threshold of 3000 cases a day eventually. With the new rule allowing mild and asymptomatic cases to recover at home we shall see if the hospital could cope.
Want to stop contact tracing then MTF should be more coherent in their public messaging and engagement. One thing to stop contact tracing because it’s no longer needed, another thing to stop because the processes are so manual and they couldn’t cope. During the MTF conference, sounds like OYK wants contract tracing just that MOH couldn’t cope as the numbers surge. When we implemented TT token and apps to facilitate contract tracing, why still need to manually interview every C+ case for hours?
PM Lee is the one who shared his plan to vaccinate, test and trace to manage Covid. If stop tracing then who to QO and conduct testing on to keep community cases low? As of today, we seem to want to have both endemic living and yet keep community cases low.
Other countries see huge waves doubling but for us, bouts of tourists have not even entered SG yet. All of us are masks on unlike other countries like US and we do not have mega events like Euro2020. So what is exactly happening now that our numbers are doubling at exponential rate?
Bus interchanges? BHG? NDP parade? -
lee_yl\" post_id=\"2037452\" time=\"1631328547\" user_id=\"17023:
I believe that Covid fatigue plus asymptomatic cases is the cause of the rapid spread. I think that mask wearing and safe distancing is less carefully observed now, especially when out of sight of SDAs. But if the cases now are mainly asymptomatic, I would simply say that the vulnerable and fearful, and their close contacts, will have to take more care. The nos. now are tipping to make them a small minority, while larger nos. and the economy are now suffering on their behalf. The MTF is being cautious, maybe overly so, but hopefully not for too long. If our ICU nos. are still under 100 in 2 weeks time (10% of total capacity), hopefully some of these \"test everyone in sight\" measures will be removed.
Other countries see huge waves doubling but for us, bouts of tourists have not even entered SG yet. All of us are masks on unlike other countries like US and we do not have mega events like Euro2020. So what is exactly happening now that our numbers are doubling at exponential rate?
Bus interchanges? BHG? NDP parade? -
Can't be buses. They are open air and passengers are not cooped up together in a small confined space with re-cycled cooled air for more than a few fleeting minutes. Oh wait... :siam:
Furthermore, there is no data that these people took buses...
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I'm a little confused by the new protocols re Home Recovery Scheme. Earlier, if one family member is confirmed, DMS said the rest of the family must self-isolate at home, right?
Now that they allow confirmed case aged between 5 & 50 year old (regardless of fully, partially or unvaccinated) without comorbidities to serve their QO at home for 10 days, this ''whole family SHN'' still applies yah? Meaning if the dad is 51 years old or the live-in grandpa is 70, while he goes to the CCF, the remaining family members will self-isolate at home for 10 days, correct?
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/household-members-people-under-covid-19-quarantine-now-required-self-isolate-home-moh-1419871
Wah, liddat cham ah. If the 20 year old maid kena first, then everyone stays home with her for 10 days.
If there are unvaccinated kids in the household below 12, they show symptoms weeks later after being infected by the maid, then wouldn't this family have to extend their Home Recovery & self-isolation for a longer period?! Everyone takes turn to use that room with ensuite bathroom! Jialat... -
OK, since they are so shorthanded and TT is utterly useless (Delta spreads within seconds not 15min/within 2 metres) and MOH officers are not able to link cases fast, they should totally omit calling up or quarantining the Fully Vaccinated. If we kena, so be it, but don't kacau us!
Instead, they should zero in on the Unvaccinated or Partially Vaccinated Elderly population. There are only 100,000 left. Why not mandate them to submit their RRT using the free ARTs at home, once a month? Can send personnel to their homes to swab those who are immobile, 顺便 bring along some Sinopharm or Sinovac to jab them there and then, since they are so obsessed with traditional vaccines and don't trust mRNA, right?
Likewise, MTF should know who the rest of the Unvaccinated 12-59 persons are, and where they live, study and work. Why not only shadow these Unvaccinated individuals and keep a close watch on them? Can also make Unvaccinated teenagers submit their ART results on a regular basis.
If one Unvaccinated student kena, the other Fully Vaccinated classmates and teachers shouldn't need to be isolated. I recall reading about some country (either some US state or France) is already doing that??? No need for the Fully Vaccinated close contact classmates to serve LOA or QO at all, but can continue with in-person lessons as the rest are all Fully Vaccinated already. Don't even need to do ART please.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/parenting-education/students-and-staff-can-return-to-school-once-they-or-their-close
In the same vein, if one Unvaccinated employee kena, the other Fully Vaccinated colleagues can still go to work.
If you can allow Fully Vaccinated visitors to strut in with just a few negative ARTs to freely roam the streets, why can't you leave your Fully Vaccinated citizens who are confirmed cases alone? -
zeit.\" post_id=\"2037472\" time=\"1631336306\" user_id=\"194295:
Good question.
OK, since they are so shorthanded and TT is utterly useless (Delta spreads within seconds not 15min/within 2 metres) and MOH officers are not able to link cases fast, they should totally omit calling up or quarantining the Fully Vaccinated. If we kena, so be it, but don't kacau us!
Instead, they should zero in on the Unvaccinated or Partially Vaccinated Elderly population. There are only 100,000 left. Why not mandate them to submit their RRT using the free ARTs at home, once a month? Can send personnel to their homes to swab those who are immobile, 顺便 bring along some Sinopharm or Sinovac to jab them there and then, since they are so obsessed with traditional vaccines and don't trust mRNA, right?
Likewise, MTF should know who the rest of the Unvaccinated 12-59 persons are, and where they live, study and work. Why not only shadow these Unvaccinated individuals and keep a close watch on them? Can also make Unvaccinated teenagers submit their ART results on a regular basis.
If one Unvaccinated student kena, the other Fully Vaccinated classmates and teachers shouldn't need to be isolated. I recall reading about some country (either some US state or France) is already doing that??? No need for the Fully Vaccinated close contact classmates to serve LOA or QO at all, but can continue with in-person lessons as the rest are all Fully Vaccinated already. Don't even need to do ART please.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/parenting-education/students-and-staff-can-return-to-school-once-they-or-their-close
In the same vein, if one Unvaccinated employee kena, the other Fully Vaccinated colleagues can still go to work.
If you can allow Fully Vaccinated visitors to strut in with just a few negative ARTs to freely roam the streets, why can't you leave your Fully Vaccinated citizens who are confirmed cases alone?
Complete freakin' waste of resources.
Oh wait. Maybe someone ordered a whole bunch of ART tests that they dunno what to do with... -
pirate\" post_id=\"2037460\" time=\"1631331771\" user_id=\"66252:
Now I know why need manual interviews.
Can't be buses. They are open air and passengers are not cooped up together in a small confined space with re-cycled cooled air for more than a few fleeting minutes. Oh wait... :siam:
Furthermore, there is no data that these people took buses...
MOH : “ Hi Sir/Mam, can you recall if you board any SBS buses for the past 14 days that embarked from Toa Payoh, Bishan, Sengkang interchanges?” :?:
2 HRS later….
You: “ Errr… Hmmm… Err…” :scratchhead:
How is MOH very sure no commuter was infected in bus interchange cluster? For example, bus captains (and the public) like to eat at the cafeteria on top of the Bishan Bus Interchange? Was that cafeteria cleaned and why is it still operating?
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