Corona Virus Disease (COVID-19) Updates
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Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2039345\" time=\"1632500010\" user_id=\"38907:
Yes, a lot of Western countries had high fatalities among the vulnerable groups earlier on.
These countries hv a lot of infected cases earlier and they hv paid the price. Our cases are not a lot by comparisonstarlight1968sg\" post_id=\"2039330\" time=\"1632492280\" user_id=\"14025:
[quote=sevenseals post_id=2039327 time=1632491962 user_id=124401]
Not true.
In fact,
Some form of normal life is happening in Denmark, Sweden, Qatar, UAE, Italy, France, Germany where they are on the mend after opening, or approaching flattening of curve.
There might be something these countries have that is missing in Sg's opening strategy
The vulnerable ones in Singapore are just beginning to be exposed to the virus and it seems like for some of them are not going to make it despite the vaccination. I am getting the feeling that the MTF is trying to find a sweet spot for a combination of restrictions that would keep the case number at a stable number instead of a continual increase. But seriously, with basically most of the world trying to go the endemic route, the virus is going to be around years from now.[/quote]Agree -
Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2039345\" time=\"1632500010\" user_id=\"38907:
I agree that Singapore is right to try to avoid the big sudden increase that \"freedom days\" caused, and put hospitals under great strain. So if this is the price we have to pay for slowing the increase, I guess we have to suck it up for the sake of our medical workers.
Yes, a lot of Western countries had high fatalities among the vulnerable groups earlier on.
The vulnerable ones in Singapore are just beginning to be exposed to the virus and it seems like for some of them are not going to make it despite the vaccination. I am getting the feeling that the MTF is trying to find a sweet spot for a combination of restrictions that would keep the case number at a stable number instead of a continual increase. But seriously, with basically most of the world trying to go the endemic route, the virus is going to be around years from now.
However, I do want to point out that this latest HA (even if they refuse to call it that) is just to slow the increase, not intended to reduce the number of cases. The no. of cases will increase anyway, and the MTF is not trying to reduce the no. of people catching Covid. And if some of those people are vulnerable, they will get sick, and also some will die, whether in the next month, or spread out over a few months. I think they have to say this loud and clear enough times so that people don't think that we are still trying to get a low no. of cases and preventing all sickness and deaths. The no. of cases will peak at whatever no. (they currently estimate around 6000 per day) one day, which could be in Oct, or in Dec, but it will happen. By that time, hopefully the MTF will have the sense to stop counting (or at least stop publishing) the total case count each day.
I think they should stop testing asymptomatic cases, stop doing RRT except for those who deal closely with the vulnerable (like medical, care, and social work personnel), and stop encouraging those without symptoms to do frequent ART. Knowing who they are is really unnecessary, and the case count just frightens everyone. Then they can free up a lot of community care beds, and some of the hospitalised can be moved out once they get over the initial symptoms. The impact on society by all the QO and HCW will also be reduced. It just requires the MTF to have the courage of their convictions. -
slmkhoo\" post_id=\"2039356\" time=\"1632529715\" user_id=\"28674:
I agree with you slmkhoo!
I agree that Singapore is right to try to avoid the big sudden increase that \"freedom days\" caused, and put hospitals under great strain. So if this is the price we have to pay for slowing the increase, I guess we have to suck it up for the sake of our medical workers.Dreamaurora\" post_id=\"2039345\" time=\"1632500010\" user_id=\"38907:
Yes, a lot of Western countries had high fatalities among the vulnerable groups earlier on.
The vulnerable ones in Singapore are just beginning to be exposed to the virus and it seems like for some of them are not going to make it despite the vaccination. I am getting the feeling that the MTF is trying to find a sweet spot for a combination of restrictions that would keep the case number at a stable number instead of a continual increase. But seriously, with basically most of the world trying to go the endemic route, the virus is going to be around years from now.
However, I do want to point out that this latest HA (even if they refuse to call it that) is just to slow the increase, not intended to reduce the number of cases. The no. of cases will increase anyway, and the MTF is not trying to reduce the no. of people catching Covid. And if some of those people are vulnerable, they will get sick, and also some will die, whether in the next month, or spread out over a few months. I think they have to say this loud and clear enough times so that people don't think that we are still trying to get a low no. of cases and preventing all sickness and deaths. The no. of cases will peak at whatever no. (they currently estimate around 6000 per day) one day, which could be in Oct, or in Dec, but it will happen. By that time, hopefully the MTF will have the sense to stop counting (or at least stop publishing) the total case count each day.
I think they should stop testing asymptomatic cases, stop doing RRT except for those who deal closely with the vulnerable (like medical, care, and social work personnel), and stop encouraging those without symptoms to do frequent ART. Knowing who they are is really unnecessary, and the case count just frightens everyone. Then they can free up a lot of community care beds, and some of the hospitalised can be moved out once they get over the initial symptoms. The impact on society by all the QO and HCW will also be reduced. It just requires the MTF to have the courage of their convictions.
They are simply wasting a LOT of time & resources dealing with the 98% of cases who are asymptomatic. No wonder they have a gigantic backlog.
If they can just focus their precious resources on the 2% who truly need the help (medically, as well as other support Eg for their affected families), then the whole country wouldn’t be under so much pressure.
The ones who are not vaccinated are responsible for their own lives. Let them decide their own comfort level for stepping out of the house, for meeting people, for dining out etc. It’s silly to curb 86% of the population just for the 14% unvaccinated. And not all the 14% are in the vulnerable category. -
zac's mum\" post_id=\"2039358\" time=\"1632530641\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2039358 time=1632530641 user_id=53606]
Just have to wait & see how long it takes before the MTF comes to this inevitable conclusion...slmkhoo\" post_id=\"2039356\" time=\"1632529715\" user_id=\"28674:
I agree with you slmkhoo!
I agree that Singapore is right to try to avoid the big sudden increase that \"freedom days\" caused, and put hospitals under great strain. So if this is the price we have to pay for slowing the increase, I guess we have to suck it up for the sake of our medical workers.
However, I do want to point out that this latest HA (even if they refuse to call it that) is just to slow the increase, not intended to reduce the number of cases. The no. of cases will increase anyway, and the MTF is not trying to reduce the no. of people catching Covid. And if some of those people are vulnerable, they will get sick, and also some will die, whether in the next month, or spread out over a few months. I think they have to say this loud and clear enough times so that people don't think that we are still trying to get a low no. of cases and preventing all sickness and deaths. The no. of cases will peak at whatever no. (they currently estimate around 6000 per day) one day, which could be in Oct, or in Dec, but it will happen. By that time, hopefully the MTF will have the sense to stop counting (or at least stop publishing) the total case count each day.
I think they should stop testing asymptomatic cases, stop doing RRT except for those who deal closely with the vulnerable (like medical, care, and social work personnel), and stop encouraging those without symptoms to do frequent ART. Knowing who they are is really unnecessary, and the case count just frightens everyone. Then they can free up a lot of community care beds, and some of the hospitalised can be moved out once they get over the initial symptoms. The impact on society by all the QO and HCW will also be reduced. It just requires the MTF to have the courage of their convictions.
They are simply wasting a LOT of time & resources dealing with the 98% of cases who are asymptomatic. No wonder they have a gigantic backlog.
If they can just focus their precious resources on the 2% who truly need the help (medically, as well as other support Eg for their affected families), then the whole country wouldn’t be under so much pressure.
The ones who are not vaccinated are responsible for their own lives. Let them decide their own comfort level for stepping out of the house, for meeting people, for dining out etc. It’s silly to curb 86% of the population just for the 14% unvaccinated. And not all the 14% are in the vulnerable category.[/quote] -
The issue is why some seniors excluding those medically unfit not vaccinated
I hv a colleague who refused the jab and choose to resign.
The jab is no longer a choice for us. -
starlight1968sg\" post_id=\"2039369\" time=\"1632533830\" user_id=\"14025:
You could ask the same question about other issues: Why do some seniors choose to cross busy roads by dodging traffic instead of using nearby pedestrian crossings? Why do some seniors still go around in crowded public places when they know there is a flu outbreak in the city? Why do some seniors refuse to change their eating habits even when they have high cholesterol/diabetes? Why do some people choose not to use seatbelts in cars? etc etc.
The issue is why some seniors excluding those medically unfit not vaccinated
I hv a colleague who refused the jab and choose to resign.
The jab is no longer a choice for us.
Policymakers have to decide what to make mandatory (how? - fine them? have people on the watch constantly? refuse them social services unless they comply? make them pay for medical bills as a consequence of their choice?) or just leave them to make personal choices and accept the consequences. Now that vaccination is so widespread, if some choose not to be vaccinated, they are putting themselves at risk more than putting others at risk. So I guess we have to allow some freedom to choose or impose some penalty - but this is a political choice. In general, I think more people will accept the necessity of curbs on behaviour when there is a public interest reason, but not when the consequences are more personal. -
sevenseals\" post_id=\"2039327\" time=\"1632491962\" user_id=\"124401:
They do have one thing in common. Their vaccination programmes all do not rely almost exclusively on mRNA vaccines.
Not true.Zappy\" post_id=\"2039314\" time=\"1632486142\" user_id=\"134817:
But now we have 23 ICU cases and already we are going back to tighter restrictions. If so, when or rather, what conditions would be deemed safe enough for Singapore to get back to some form of a normal life - cases below 100/ day, and zero ICU? That's realistically never going to happen as long as this thing is around and we attempt to open up to the world.
In fact,
Some form of normal life is happening in Denmark, Sweden, Qatar, UAE, Italy, France, Germany where they are on the mend after opening, or approaching flattening of curve.
There might be something these countries have that is missing in Sg's opening strategy
Make that two. They also do not test asymptomatic people like crazy.
:siam: -
The new measures don’t really help the vulnerable 2%. The seniors can still come out to shop and eat at hawker centres. Yesterday I saw 4 uncles at a coffeeshop, although occupying 2 tables, the 4 seniors sat near one another and chit chatted non-stop over a cup of coffee. Ban dining in for old folks, no dining for them means they have less incentive to go out and will likely stay at home. Among the 1600 cases yesterday, 391 were seniors, that’s a lot and it’s accumulative.
Regarding the backlog of cases, in my view, MOH should not expend resources on that as the new cases are still coming in at an accelerated rate until at least 1-2 weeks later. Over the next 3 days, we probably have 1700, 1800, 1900 daily new cases consecutively and that’s like 5K cases coming.
Better to devote attention on the avalanche of new cases going forward and when resources permit then go back to clear the backlog. Last In First Out. -
The new norm is going to be 4 weeks on and 4 weeks off until enough of the rest of the world opens, because we are always waiting to see other people's data. We lead by following other people. :faint:
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To me, all are just excuses. The main reason is that we are already facing a bottleneck at the hospital wards. 23 cases in ICU is still very far from 1000 or 300. The new measures are also not specifically targeted to protect the vulnerable seniors. If we don’t have a bottleneck that overburdens the healthcare system, why do we need all these new measures now?
MOH hopes the new measures can slow down the daily cases, but in reality it might also not help much. I am now at TPY and the neighborhood here is just as crowded as before. Singaporeans are embracing endemic living!
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