2021 PSLE Discussions and Strategies (Children born in 2009)

[okie]

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048464\" time=\"1637854774\" user_id=\"30663:

okie\" post_id=\"2048462\" time=\"1637854383\" user_id=\"44307:

[quote=Veyron post_id=2048400 time=1637847975 user_id=30663]

NJC COP for 2020 was 254 or AL7. Under AL system, AL8 can go as low as 247 if there is an AL5 subject in the mix.
Very low chance for NJC partly also due to its centralized location.

In the west, better choose RVHS

Just wondering, how do u know AL8 can be as low as 247? The lowest permutation i can get is 251 (65 + 90 + 90 + 90 )/4*3

your 3/4 raw to tscore conversion is incorrect[/quote]Can you share the source of data that al8 can be as low as 247? Also pls share the correct calculation method, thanks

[Veyron]

okie\" post_id=\"2048603\" time=\"1637902256\" user_id=\"44307:

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048464\" time=\"1637854774\" user_id=\"30663:

[quote=okie post_id=2048462 time=1637854383 user_id=44307]


Just wondering, how do u know AL8 can be as low as 247? The lowest permutation i can get is 251 (65 + 90 + 90 + 90 )/4*3

your 3/4 raw to tscore conversion is incorrect

Can you share the source of data that al8 can be as low as 247? Also pls share the correct calculation method, thanks[/quote]Lowest possible raw score for AL8 is AL 1 1 1 5 ( 90+90+90+65) = 335
If we translate that to 2020 t-score it will be around 246.4

The reason why its so low is because AL5 cover a wider score band of 65 to 74.

[chervin]

[list][/list]

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048601\" time=\"1637901824\" user_id=\"30663:

chervin\" post_id=\"2048597\" time=\"1637900296\" user_id=\"8802:

If ESIS is not by raw score and all AL5 and better will get it, how then can it be top 3%. Unless the no. Of AL5 and better falls so nicely to be the top 3%. Then, moving forward whatever no. (Top 3%) that meets that particular year’s ESIS cut off would have to fall nicely within that cutoff AL. Hence I wonder if MOE takes the top 3% of raw score and not based on AL.

Is there any AL5 students who didnt receive ESIS?
Is there an AL6 student who receive ESIS?

If the answer above is No and No, then we can say that ESIS COP will be determined by AL and not combined raw score.

Will that be top 3%? I think so because mini score for AL5 is 90 90 90 85 which is around t-score 261. And of course, it will not be top 3.00000% just like under t-score, it cannot be 3.0000%

So that means AL5 is the fixed cut off for ESIS every year since minimum AL5 is around t-score 261 and ESIS is usually around that t-score for previous years?

[JanelleTan]

My daughter scored 8(M) and has affliation to NYGH whose indicative COP is 8(M) for affliated students. May i ask what are her chances? Do affliated students get priority over other students who scored better AL scores? Appreciate any insights.

[floppy]

Lowest possible raw score for AL8 is AL 1 1 1 5 ( 90+90+90+65) = 335

> This is correct.

If we translate that to 2020 t-score it will be around 246.4
> This is iffy.

Without knowing the mean1 to mean4, as well as sigma1 to sigma4, this is only speculative and purely guesswork.

[Veyron]

floppy\" post_id=\"2048609\" time=\"1637902769\" user_id=\"97579:

Lowest possible raw score for AL8 is AL 1 1 1 5 ( 90+90+90+65) = 335
> This is correct.

If we translate that to 2020 t-score it will be around 246.4
> This is iffy.

Without knowing the mean1 to mean4, as well as sigma1 to sigma4, this is only speculative and purely guesswork.

You can use the below information provided by MOE to determine the iffyness of my calculation. it may not be 0.001 precision but it shouldnt be far.

Indicative COP / actual t-score cop for 2020
AL6\t257-261
AL7 254-257
AL8\t251-255
AL9\t250

ESIS = 261
ESIS = AL5

[AHsDad]

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048611\" time=\"1637902995\" user_id=\"30663:

floppy\" post_id=\"2048609\" time=\"1637902769\" user_id=\"97579:

Lowest possible raw score for AL8 is AL 1 1 1 5 ( 90+90+90+65) = 335
> This is correct.

If we translate that to 2020 t-score it will be around 246.4
> This is iffy.

Without knowing the mean1 to mean4, as well as sigma1 to sigma4, this is only speculative and purely guesswork.

You can use the below information provided by MOE to determine the iffyness of my calculation. it may not be 0.001 precision but it shouldnt be far.

Indicative COP / actual t-score cop for 2020
AL6\t257-261
AL7 254-257
AL8\t251-255
AL9\t250

ESIS = 261
ESIS = AL5

Is the above (iffy part) really from MOE? I may have missed this announcement, as all the while I understood that was calculated by your assumed Tscore factor (Eg 0.73xx to 0.74xx)?

[Option]

Pegasus08\" post_id=\"2048580\" time=\"1637896922\" user_id=\"41264:

Option\" post_id=\"2048561\" time=\"1637894755\" user_id=\"185249:

We did away with tuitions and started language preparations in the lower primary. I agree with 678Yess that language preparations is something that cannot be rushed.
The preparations for language oral components were low because we started bilingual communications at home when they were young, and freed time for other areas. Granted that Pegasus08's 2nd child is moving to P5, in the interests of time, consider oral communications in both languages at home (even if the child has tuition). Then played by ear to regulate the intensity. Our communication arrangements were weekdays in English and weekends in Chinese.

We didn't get our children to complete all questions in any past year paper (I know this can be unnerving), only those deemed as tricky ones and in particular application-based ones for science. Our original concerns stemed from the fact that rushing the child to finish every question in every past year paper would mean he/ she has less time to absorb what went wrong, or even rest.
We accepted the risks that important questions/ concepts could be inadvertently omitted, and had less understanding how the children will handle actual papers within time limits.
Not sure if the uneasiness is due to 'being out of IP range' limits certain school choices that psle children may opt for. My DD and DS are doing reasonably ok in OP and IP respectively so perhaps as parents, be conscious not to give a child the impression that being out of IP range = not as good.

Thank you both. I guess I wasn't too prepared for the new system, going the old way and just trying to score for best subjects rather than adopt to the new system to put equal emphasis on all subjects. I enrolled my younger one in English writing class a few months ago and she is already in berries. That's a good suggestion regarding oral, it's actually a very high percentage of the total score. When you mention oral communications, is it just talking normally at home or do you go through oral questions with your kids?

For the past year papers, how did you know which one are application type questions that need to be worked on? Did you try out the paper yourself or you pick randomly?

Yeah, I know not getting into an IP school is not an end-all scenario but just with the hopes and expectations and knowing that she can do better is just disappointing. Weirdly, I'm more affected than her 😝 ask her what school she wants, she still says anything. How to motivate her. Sigh. Telling her it's for her future is too abstract for her as well. Any tips on motivating children?

In the lower primary, it was normal conversations at home. It was a new system for us too but we made sure everyone adhered to the arrangements. In addition for Chinese, when one of us forgot (and spoke in English over weekends), the standard phrase : 今天是周末 (jin tian shi zhou mo) became a gentle reminder. We started mixing oral questions with normal conversations in P3. Oral questions began as a natural progression from home conversations. We only knew some exam questions went along similar lines later. We knew of children who were given thick \"oral manuals\" to cover before psle and they walked into IP schools (please consider if this is what you want). One more point, when your children are stringing sentences together, refrain from mixing different languages in the same sentence (at least in the long run).
Your case could be slightly different because in P5, you need to cater for substantial content gaps between P4 and P5 subjects. But your child is likely to have a more refined thought process than a typical child in P3. If you want to \"play safe\" in the beginning, start a few normal conversations and see how things pan out. You have implementation upsides for oral questions.

We looked through their P4 work (school test and exam papers). If the child is weak in certain concepts, then beef them up first before getting them to attempt application questions. In some cases, we ran hands on work for the children to strengthen the understanding. In the beginning, we tried the questions for maths and science, 3 sets each from top schools. You can say that we picked the top school papers 'randomly' but we screened the questions in them. The school also had their past year questions but on and off, if we came across some good questions, we would expose them.

I am not sure if “anything\" is an entirely bad sign (maybe a bit debilitating for you...). It could be because she doesn't know enough, or she knows that you subtly want her to opt for IP and doesn't want to leave you disappointed. Maybe you should ask her why the response is \"anything\"...... Our children came from a pre-Covid psle environment and we physically visited open houses of 7 schools. Their understandings were quite different from what one tried to glean from virtual environments. Then we accorded our children weightage in choice of school.

You have more straightforward paths if you know what her areas of interests are. Your starting point for academic motivation does not have to begin with an academic area (I know you are concerned with how much time is left). If she doesn't have an area of interest, then perhaps capitalise on the remaining holdiays to explore something with her. It's my view that overall developments (including non academic ones) should start early. Hope this helps.

[jkorompis]

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048502\" time=\"1637881166\" user_id=\"30663:

jkorompis\" post_id=\"2048481\" time=\"1637857789\" user_id=\"193874:

[quote=Veyron post_id=2048257 time=1637824736 user_id=30663]

Unfortunately, that is the reality of the new AL system. Under this system, 90 is the new 100, there are no extra points for anything above 90. e.g. a student with a raw score of 99 99 99 89 will still be ranked lower than 90 90 90 90 in S1 posting.

The goal of the AL system is not to chase after every last marks, hence its unlikely MOE will use raw score marks to determine COP for ESIS., while using AL score for S1 posting. Between the 2, which do you think is more important? S1 posting or ESIS?

yes, goal of AL system is not to chase after every last mark, but ESIS is not something the general population of pupils/parents will chase after. your rationale is based on the fact that people will start chasing for last mark if ESIS is based on raw scores. it could just be an internal protocol, not made known to the cohort taking psle.

Unfortunately, anything that can be used as an indicator to compare or benchmark a child academic performance will always be of interest to parents and students alike.

So using a selection process that is completely opaque to parents will be confusing and upsetting. this will certainly lead to parents writing into MOE for explanation and requesting raw scores for verification.

Under t-score, I believe 261 is the benchmark. Under the AL system, I believe it's AL5.

To do well under AL system, students need to be good at all 4 subjects. Whereas under t-score, students can afford to achieve high t-score even with 1 or 2 weaker subjects. Which is better or more deserving I think that is very subjective.[/quote]another parent has posted that AL5 is the cop for ESIS based on info on ACSI admission chatbot. and i thank him/her for the clarification. can close this discussion and move on. apologies if any comments confused or upset anyone

[okie]

Veyron\" post_id=\"2048604\" time=\"1637902505\" user_id=\"30663:

okie\" post_id=\"2048603\" time=\"1637902256\" user_id=\"44307:

[quote=Veyron post_id=2048464 time=1637854774 user_id=30663]

your 3/4 raw to tscore conversion is incorrect

Can you share the source of data that al8 can be as low as 247? Also pls share the correct calculation method, thanks

Lowest possible raw score for AL8 is AL 1 1 1 5 ( 90+90+90+65) = 335
If we translate that to 2020 t-score it will be around 246.4

The reason why its so low is because AL5 cover a wider score band of 65 to 74.[/quote]Ok thanks