Some students fail to thrive on Integrated Programme scheme
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FanFanX:
This is ridiculous! You don't go to RI to end up in poly! :siam:
Raffles Institution said it was looking into starting an O-level class. Principal Lim Lai Cheng said that if this happens, it will be 'to open up options' for those wanting to go to polytechnics or abroad.
Actually these top notch IP school where every student is academically streched in an accelerated environment should set up some kind of minimum TScore(240? 250? the school can decide based on past experience) for those DSAed. In such an environment, it does not make sense to say that as long as you have a confirmed offer we welcome you with open arms even if u score 201(express eligibility). Aren't the schools being greedy to get these students in just to bring medals and glory to the school at the cost of the child?
From now on I guess parents should approach this DSA thingy with caution. -
tisha:
It takes two hands to clap. If you know your kid's academics aren't that strong why apply for RI where most everyone's T-score is >260?
This is ridiculous! You don't go to RI to end up in poly! :siam:FanFanX:
Raffles Institution said it was looking into starting an O-level class. Principal Lim Lai Cheng said that if this happens, it will be 'to open up options' for those wanting to go to polytechnics or abroad.
Actually these top notch IP school where every student is academically streched in an accelerated environment should set up some kind of minimum TScore(240? 250? the school can decide based on past experience) for those DSAed. In such an environment, it does not make sense to say that as long as you have a confirmed offer we welcome you with open arms even if u score 201(express eligibility). Aren't the schools being greedy to get these students in just to bring medals and glory to the school at the cost of the child?
From now on I guess parents should approach this DSA thingy with caution. -
jtoh:
It takes two hands to clap. If you know your kid's academics aren't that strong why apply for RI where most everyone's T-score is >260?[/quote]Agree with you jtoh. It is ultimately the parents responsibilty to choose the best for thier kids. After all it is out child's life/future that is at stake and not the school's students. I mean it is we parents who worry for our children's future not the school.
This is ridiculous! You don't go to RI to end up in poly! :siam:tisha:
[quote=\"FanFanX\"]
Raffles Institution said it was looking into starting an O-level class. Principal Lim Lai Cheng said that if this happens, it will be 'to open up options' for those wanting to go to polytechnics or abroad.
Actually these top notch IP school where every student is academically streched in an accelerated environment should set up some kind of minimum TScore(240? 250? the school can decide based on past experience) for those DSAed. In such an environment, it does not make sense to say that as long as you have a confirmed offer we welcome you with open arms even if u score 201(express eligibility). Aren't the schools being greedy to get these students in just to bring medals and glory to the school at the cost of the child?
From now on I guess parents should approach this DSA thingy with caution.
What I'm trying to say is that, it is OK for non-IP schools to admit DSA students if they meet the express eligibility. But should IP schools go buy the same 200 Tscore rule, knowing very well how demanding their curriculum is?
Since you say it takes two hands to clap, you do acknowledge the school's role right? -
tisha, I agree that 200 is a bit low for top schools who have demanding curriculum. My understanding though is that the GAT and HAST tests are supposed to give an indication on whether the sports kids have the potential to cope with the school’s curriculum. So I suppose those who were admitted are supposed to have the potential. But potential may not pan out to actual scores because these students are so busy training and competing, it’s tough on them to balance their academic grades with their CCA commitments. Something for the schools to finetune as the IP programme hasn’t been around for that long, and something for the parents to think about carefully before applying to top IP schools.
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Actually, I think RI is doing the right thing by considering the ‘O’ level class.
(1) It is being responsible to students whose talents are in Sport, and in order to be able to keep in top form, they need to put in the hours. The DSA is a transaction. That is clear. The child gets a place in RI, in return for his extraordinary skill at a sport. Once entered into this contract, it behooves BOTH sides to demonstrate commitment. By starting an ‘O’ level class for such students, RI is demonstrating commitment and a willingness to stand by their students (even if academically less strong than desired).
(2) Not ALL DSA students with heavy CCA commitments fare poorly academically. I’ve known students with COP higher than my DD’s who did poorly. These are students who performed at the PSLE purely on parent and tutor drive. Themselves, they felt forced and coerced… punished, pushed… through to PSLE. In secondary school such students rebel and go the other way. It is no use telling them that results are important, far more important to them is breaking free from parental slavery. These students grades can drop very far below their potential.
(3) In contrast, there are DSA students who did not make the cut off but did so very well that they get into the top schools’ top classes and niche acceleration programmes. These are students who were independent learners in primary school (but because of lack of tuition, and lack of time to study, they did poorly at PSLE). I do know of such a girl who did very well academically. In her A level year, she put her all into her sport, KNOWING that she would suffer academically. But she REALLY wanted that gold for herself, not just for the school. In this case, the child (and parents) made a choice to develop one area first, without feeling any trauma nor shame. Why? Because sport is age dependent. After a certain age, you cannot compete in that category anymore. ‘A’ levels is not age dependent.
(3) It wouldn’t do to have all our top brains go into "thinking" professions. I see nothing wrong with an RI boy choosing to go to the polytechnic because he is enthused by a course that is not offered at any university. If that boy decided to be a Creative Writer for New Media, he is more than likely to push up standards in that industry. In a time where few RI boys chose religion as a career, Reverend Ming Yi and Pastor Kong Hee did (disregarding the respective scandals, both have changed the way the 2 religions are perceived and managed in Singapore). Dennis Foo is an old RI boy who also made waves on the clubbing and entertainment scene. The top of every profession pays well. It is easier to rise to the top when all the other RI boys have gone to compete amongst themselves in Law or Medicine. The way I see it, if an RI boy chooses the poly route, it is a short term paper loss but a long term real gain… because as far as brain power goes, he has no cut throat competition to stop him from rising to the top.
It may not be wrong to generally assume that all our sport champions have high IQ and formidable work ethic. You won’t find a Wimbledon champion with an IQ of 70, and you really can’t be champion if you don’t work hard at your sport. These people do badly academically not because they’re dumb, but because they have no time. This makes the poly route very attractive because it allows these children to catch up on the years lost to the sport. -
phankao:
Agree. IP - so independence is key. And good time management, ability to juggle studies with CCA and other commitments, resilience in the midst of exceptional classmates and very important, high EQ.
If they are mature enough to be working on their own, plan their own schedules, work well with others in a team. -
Snow Crystal:
I can't stress enough on independent learning. I think the t-score is less important than this criteria. If the child has a high t-score because he/she has had her entire PSLE steps defined by parents and tutors... then it is likely his/her grades will plummet in IP.
Agree. IP - so independence is key. And good time management, ability to juggle studies with CCA and other commitments, resilience in the midst of exceptional classmates and very important, high EQ.phankao:
If they are mature enough to be working on their own, plan their own schedules, work well with others in a team. -
Chenonceau:
I can't stress enough on independent learning. I think the t-score is less important than this criteria. If the child has a high t-score because he/she has had her entire PSLE steps defined by parents and tutors... then it is likely his/her grades will plummet in IP.[/quote]I agree.
Agree. IP - so independence is key. And good time management, ability to juggle studies with CCA and other commitments, resilience in the midst of exceptional classmates and very important, high EQ.Snow Crystal:
[quote=\"phankao\"]
If they are mature enough to be working on their own, plan their own schedules, work well with others in a team. -
Chenonceau:
I can't stress enough on independent learning. I think the t-score is less important than this criteria. If the child has a high t-score because he/she has had her entire PSLE steps defined by parents and tutors... then it is likely his/her grades will plummet in IP.
Well said. I won't be surprised if some of those who dropped out even before taking the A levels (5% according to Sandra) scored above 265 due to intensive tuition.
But then, even in the old system, there are people who fail to complete two years of JC or flunk their A levels from the top 5 JCs. Just not sure what the percentage is and if we can make a meaningful comparison between then and now.
On another note, there is no mention of the number of students who are 'retained'. If I'm not wrong, each student can be 'retained' or repeat up to two years in their 6 years of secondary education. Meaning, once in first 4 years and once in JC. I'm sure there are quite a number who suffered that fate in the IP as well. Hope the MOE can give us these figures too. -
SAHM_TAN:
I'm wondering what's education all about...
what is primary education about?
what is secondary education about?
what's post-secondary education about?
To me, it's about
1.learning to developing a questioning an exploratory mind
2.learning to learn
3.learning to make decisions
4.developing socio-emotional competencies.
5.learning to compete which should come say upper sec and later.
It's not just about exams and grades.
This requires a lot of trust and faith in our children.
This story from my dd's GEP teacher. His ex-student from GEP was then a photo journalist came back to visit.
Student: Are you proud of me? (meaning I'm not some high flyer that they expect of a GEP kid)
Teacher: Are you happy?
Student: Yes, I love what I'm doing and I'm happy.
Teacher: Then I'm very proud of you.
I think at the end of the day, we hope our kid will find something he love to do for his living. Something that he feel can help him fulfill his purpose. A good education environment should help him to discover his purpose.
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