Intellect or Age Peer?
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2ppaamm:
ACS International and Hwa Chong International only offers a programme from secondary onwards so this article is talking about children getting into international schools mainly at the primary level which only goes by exception. I suppose that is why statistics from them are left out. At the primary level, MOE needs to be consulted before the children can get out of a local system whereas at secondary, from what I know of my friends' kids, their children can opt to go to the ACSInternational and HCInternational for an IB education without having to subscribe to a MOE secondary school at all.O, got a link that talks about this. Those 3 international arms of local schools are not considered 'international' schools. http://www.asiaone.com/News/Education/Story/A1Story20071122-37914.html
Found the quote from MOE so like MOE, \"But the MOE stressed that the Government prefers Singaporeans to attend local schools for the purpose of building a national identity.
'Singaporean children should be educated in an environment that embraces the history and culture of Singapore, in particular, the multi-racial and multi-religious characteristics of Singapore'
International schools are less multi-racial and multi-religious??? It is by now a common knowledge why Singapore government makes it so difficult for locals, especially gifted boys to enroll in international schools. They want to 'create that national identity' (brain wash?). So even when the kid has problems, it is very difficult to get approved for international school. Easier for girls.
However, it is interesting to note that going to international schools like SAS or UWC at secondary level needs letter from the doctor. -
ksi:
As far as I know or understand, every Singaporean international school applicant needs to get an MOE approval, even in SJI (btw, SJI has a primary school arm and still not covered in this article). The only difference is that the approval is 'automatic' compared to the international/international schools. For example, all the 3 local-international schools cannot accept students below 12 years old, this is laid down by MOE. Also, there is a 'quota' to how many Singaporeans they can take, and often, the kids are put on the waitlist not because they have no space, but because MOE refuse to increase the quota. The MOE is aware of the lack of control on the nationalistic education once a child is immersed in the international school culture. So while MOE does not necessarily control who goes to these local-international schools, it appears they do control the number of Singaporeans going there.
ACS International and Hwa Chong International only offers a programme from secondary onwards so this article is talking about children getting into international schools mainly at the primary level which only goes by exception. I suppose that is why statistics from them are left out. At the primary level, MOE needs to be consulted before the children can get out of a local system whereas at secondary, from what I know of my friends' kids, their children can opt to go to the ACSInternational and HCInternational for an IB education without having to subscribe to a MOE secondary school at all.2ppaamm:
O, got a link that talks about this. Those 3 international arms of local schools are not considered 'international' schools. http://www.asiaone.com/News/Education/Story/A1Story20071122-37914.html
Found the quote from MOE so like MOE, \"But the MOE stressed that the Government prefers Singaporeans to attend local schools for the purpose of building a national identity.
'Singaporean children should be educated in an environment that embraces the history and culture of Singapore, in particular, the multi-racial and multi-religious characteristics of Singapore'
International schools are less multi-racial and multi-religious??? It is by now a common knowledge why Singapore government makes it so difficult for locals, especially gifted boys to enroll in international schools. They want to 'create that national identity' (brain wash?). So even when the kid has problems, it is very difficult to get approved for international school. Easier for girls.
However, it is interesting to note that going to international schools like SAS or UWC at secondary level needs letter from the doctor.
All the 4 international schools (local-international and international-international) I asked told me that the MOE approval is hard to get for my son's (gifted boy) case from experience, but they welcomed a try ($$$ upon application and administration of entrance tests). My son was applying for grade 9, which is Sec 3. I'm not sure why there is a difference between your friend's case. Perhaps you can tell us more so that we can learn from it? I'd like to know more. What is 'subscribe to any MOE school'? I thought once you are in the international schools, you are out of the MOE system? Were your friend's kids overseas for 2 or more years? :?
Btw, MOE is not being consulted, they approve - ultimate authority. Without this approval, the international school cannot enroll the student. I know of a case where the Singaporean child has never attended a Singapore school, but is gifted because he had won many awards overseas, and studied overseas. When he came back, MOE disapproved him going to an international school. So he was forced to go to a local school, and he really could not get used to the Singapore system. So even for kids who were away for more than 2 years, it is difficult, especially if you are a gifted boy. -
Hi 2ppaamm, you were saying that gifted boys will find it especially hard to get approval to go to international schools. In your case do you think it was because your son would have skipped grades if he had gone to an international school and MOE frowns upon grade skipping?
I wasn’t aware that MOE approval was required for local students to attend SJI International and ACS International and that there was a quota on it. Quite a few of my friends have enrolled their kids in SJI International. They said they went for a test and interview at the school and were given offers conditional on their PSLE performance. -
It's because MOE wants to keep gifted kids in the local school system.
From MOE website:
The Ministry of Education (MOE) formally identifies the academically gifted and caters to the top 1% of the national cohort through the Gifted Education Programme (GEP), beginning at Primary 4. It also caters for the exceptionally gifted.
In meeting the needs of the exceptionally gifted, MOE is guided by the following principles. First, these children should be in our Singapore school system. Second, they should receive a well-rounded education. Cognitive development should not be achieved at the expense of the development in the moral, social, physical and aesthetic domains. Third, the recommended interventions would be made within the constraints of existing resources. -
jtoh:
2ppaamm, Yes this is the same experience of my friends and they got in after PSLE but they are girls, is that the difference? :?Hi 2ppaamm, you were saying that gifted boys will find it especially hard to get approval to go to international schools. In your case do you think it was because your son would have skipped grades if he had gone to an international school and MOE frowns upon grade skipping?
I wasn't aware that MOE approval was required for local students to attend SJI International and ACS International and that there was a quota on it. Quite a few of my friends have enrolled their kids in SJI International. They said they went for a test and interview at the school and were given offers conditional on their PSLE performance. -
2ppaamm:
Maybe I confuse you, what I mean is exactly what you think. Once they go international school, they are out of MOE system forever. And these children went to local primary school but switched to international school for secondary education.What is 'subscribe to any MOE school'? I thought once you are in the international schools, you are out of the MOE system? Were your friend's kids overseas for 2 or more years? :?
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Sorry, getting confused. I thought we are talking about primary school-aged kids entering international schools? For that, MOE’s approval is required. In 2ppaamm’s son’s case, he is below 12 years old right? Is this also the case for the boy who returned from overseas?
I do think MOE is getting smarter at crafting their rules. A lot of hedging so that they can continue to have a gatekeeping role.
(Ahh, just saw above post. cross-post) -
deminc:
No deminc, the discussion started because 2ppaamm's DS1's friend went to get doctor's letter to transfer to international at SECONDARY level. So I was asking why needed to do that since by secondary ALL kids with enough MOOLARS could go international school but 2ppaamm said not so easy....that is our discussion.Sorry, getting confused. I thought we are talking about primary school-aged kids entering international schools. For that, MOE's approval is required. In 2ppaamm's son's case, he is below 12 years old right? Is this also the case for the boy who returned from overseas?
I do think MOE is getting smarter at crafting their rules. A lot of hedging so that they can continue to have a gatekeeping role.
However, the control at PRIMARY level is VERY TIGHT to go international schools. -
Thanks ksi! I "catch the ball" now, haha! So 2ppaamm is saying that actually all applicants require approval, but for most, the approval is automatic. In this case, MOE exercised its gatekeeper role to keep the child in local education system, which I personally think is due to their very open stance that as far as possible, gifted children should be kept within MOE system.
Or did the ball roll away from me again?? -
ksi:
I only know from what the international schools tell me. At the point I asked a local-international school, their quota was up for Singaporean students, and they were waiting for MOE to increase the quota, secondly, they cannot admit anyone below 12 years old because MOE does not allow it.
2ppaamm, Yes this is the same experience of my friends and they got in after PSLE but they are girls, is that the difference? :?jtoh:
Hi 2ppaamm, you were saying that gifted boys will find it especially hard to get approval to go to international schools. In your case do you think it was because your son would have skipped grades if he had gone to an international school and MOE frowns upon grade skipping?
I wasn't aware that MOE approval was required for local students to attend SJI International and ACS International and that there was a quota on it. Quite a few of my friends have enrolled their kids in SJI International. They said they went for a test and interview at the school and were given offers conditional on their PSLE performance.
The gifted boy part is from the international-international schools. They told me that it is virtually impossible to admit my son, but they will try. From their experience, MOE will almost never approve gifted boys going to an international school.
For acceleration within the local-international schools, once you make the 12 year old mark, you can be accelerated within the school, MOE only regulates that they take in >12 years old. That's as far as I was told.
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