Primary school maths: A vicious circle (from TODAY May 8)

[Chenonceau]

sean wife:

To all experienced parents out here….what would be your best advice for parents whose kids are still not in primary school education yet?


If a kindergarten child can handle say P1 basic maths questions, should they continue to practice more on those challenging P1 questions (i.e. higher order thinking kind), or proceed to do basic P2 syllabus...?

Thanks.

Ummmm... I rather think that early does not mean better. Some skills need to be taught only after others are mastered or else the child has a weak foundation. In languages, I think it is better to focus on increasing vocabulary and mastery of sentence structure before emphasizing inferencing. In Science, kids must understand and remember Science facts and relationships before we teach them answering techniques. In Math, they need to be fast and accurate with basic manipulation of large numbers (add, subtract, multiply) before we teach them heuristics.

This is because the higher order skills make use of the simpler skills. If the simpler skills are not in place, then the child will have problems using the higher order skills. This is de-motivating. Once the child loses motivation, 3/4 of the battle is lost.

Early is not always better. You wouldn't feed a slab of beefsteak to your 6 month old baby? You wouldn't try to teach yachting before you've taught swimming and basic sea safety.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that you must proceed by AGE. Kids don't all develop at the same pace. You STILL can teach a K2 kid higher order skills provided that he/she has mastered the necessary component skills... and there are kids who do. Best to observe your own kid and keep pace with his/her readiness.

[jesschan]

I have read so often in this forum that - schools set very high standards in their examinations and test things that are not taught in class such that most of the children in the top class do not do well - and I always wonder is this the norm for most schools in Singapore or is it happening only in elite/popular schools. (I define such schools as those that have limited vacancies at P1 Registration Phase 2C.)

[atutor2001]

blessed777:

.....
Dont be confused, model drawing is only 1 of Heuristics approach. N if im not wrong MOErecommended 11 problem solving Heuristic for primary school level. As for my dd school p6 sa1 there are 7 problem solving Heuristic to be tested including MD....
....Onsponge bk shows solution for complex more/less than (using model drawing) but i find it easier to teach dd using tabulation..... \"

Yes model is only 1 of the many heuristic approach. However, it is ironical to draw model because if someone can understand the logic/approach, he/she can solve without the models. Why spend time drawing the model? If one does not have the slightest idea of how to solve, drawing the models the wrong way will not help either. There are many ways to draw models but weak students usually only know how to draw simple comparison model of A & B. They can stare at them for the entire duration of the exam and nothing will surface.

The impression given by many teachers and tutors is that drawing model will show us the way to the solution for most problem. To make matter worse, many teachers go to the extent of threatening their students that marks will be deducted if they don't use model. (because they only know how to determine if working is correct or wrong as answer keys used model).

To further complicate matter, many innovative individuals would do their best to apply/promote \"model method\" to all kinds of problem sum, including those that can be easier solved with other methods. A typical example is to represent the value of money in 4 units of $10 notes, with a rectangle divided into 4 rows and 10 columns.

Model concept has been abused. I have experimented with kids who failed miserably using model. Just teach them simple algebraic manipulation and simultaneous equations, they can solve most, if not all, the conventional problem sums by P6.

[sean wife]

Chenonceau:

sean wife:

To all experienced parents out here….what would be your best advice for parents whose kids are still not in primary school education yet?


If a kindergarten child can handle say P1 basic maths questions, should they continue to practice more on those challenging P1 questions (i.e. higher order thinking kind), or proceed to do basic P2 syllabus...?

Thanks.

Ummmm... I rather think that early does not mean better. Some skills need to be taught only after others are mastered or else the child has a weak foundation. In languages, I think it is better to focus on increasing vocabulary and mastery of sentence structure before emphasizing inferencing. In Science, kids must understand and remember Science facts and relationships before we teach them answering techniques. In Math, they need to be fast and accurate with basic manipulation of large numbers (add, subtract, multiply) before we teach them heuristics.

This is because the higher order skills make use of the simpler skills. If the simpler skills are not in place, then the child will have problems using the higher order skills. This is de-motivating. Once the child loses motivation, 3/4 of the battle is lost.

Early is not always better. You wouldn't feed a slab of beefsteak to your 6 month old baby? You wouldn't try to teach yachting before you've taught swimming and basic sea safety.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that you must proceed by AGE. Kids don't all develop at the same pace. You STILL can teach a K2 kid higher order skills provided that he/she has mastered the necessary component skills... and there are kids who do. Best to observe your own kid and keep pace with his/her readiness.

Thanks for your thoughts…For languages, at least for now, I am not relying much or doing much assessment books…my thoughts are that at least up to lower pri level, reading is still the main way to improve on language skills. Thus I find that we spend a disproportionately huge amount of time on teaching and practising of maths concepts, and when we have covered the basic concepts, there seems to be so many variety of challenging questions found in various assessment books…

[kitty2]

Chenonceau:

Sun_2010:

I am not sure why it is being assumed it is the parent's role to teach academics (if needed learn and teach)

It is the teacher's role to teach. If i as a parent can or want to do it then great! But what about the child who has parents who have no time, no competence, no means to affortd tutions ?
My parents did not teach me Nor did parents of most of my classmates. Yet we did well. Well enough .

Not so for todays kids - if more than half the kids in the class fail - that means something is gravely wrong - it is the failure of the teaching.( I did not say teachers). It means children have not been taught the right stuff, or they have not been taught the right way or the material is beyond the potential of the children. Miraculously the children score well in PSLE. So how?
Public education is about educating all. If the schools feel half their pupils need tution it means they are admitting they are not discharging their duties.

In fact schools should not be focusing on PSLE. It is a competitive exam, but Primary schooling isnt just about T-score. It is about getting strong foundations in learning both academic n character.

Its funny how it has come to be the norm for us parents to put our career to help the child score well in PSLE.
The time parents spend with kids gets streamed into the study time.
We dont give our household kids chores - they dont have the time.
So much so we land up helping them pack, etc etc during the rush period - bcoz they dont have the time.
Character building cant be done with a timetable

Thank you for writing so cogently. I am too distraught to write well. :goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:

:goodpost: :udawoman: :salute:

[Mychildren]

My P3 DS always came back with his school work with \"modals ?\" on his math worksheet. For I knew that he is lazy to draw them and he can solve the problem by just thinking in his mind and writing the number sentences like _ x _ = _ etc.


I don't know what to say to this boy as he can also get the answer without even showing his working. But this is require by the teacher and he always had to redo his work again because of that. Many times, explain it is require by the teacher but he still won't do it. Sigh..... Think he is lazy to spend time using ruler to draw neat and tidy rectangle boxes.

Actually, time is spend on drawing those boxes. Will this slow down the speed and so some may not finish the paper in time just because of that. I understand that the models helps to better explain some questions for those children that need to visualize the questions. But for those that can do without it, this is like additional and waste of time for them like this no.2 DS.

Just sharing. :lightrod:

[coast]

Dear parents,


A simple suggestion that might (or might not) help to stop the vicious circle.

http://www.kiasuparents.com/kiasu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35434

[kitty2]

Pris.tang:

Suz855:

Sorry, I cannot agree w u, our children drink expensive milk powder wit DHA ...etc .... They are suppose to help in brain development blah blah blah .. So how can their brain grow smaller


:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

Dont say my kids drink all this so expensive milk powder my granny been telling everyone i drink s26 when i was small so my brain also cannot be growing smaller

:goodpost:

[coast]

sean wife:

To all experienced parents out here….what would be your best advice for parents whose kids are still not in primary school education yet?


If a kindergarten child can handle say P1 basic maths questions, should they continue to practice more on those challenging P1 questions (i.e. higher order thinking kind), or proceed to do basic P2 syllabus...?

Thanks.

Develop his passion in Maths (in general any subject). Kids tend to do well when they are self-motivated. You do not have to follow any syllabus. Go by topic and make a particular topic interesting by incorporating games, real-life examples. There is really no limit when a child is keen to learn something. But be aware of questions that are vague or play around with \"words\" (especially in assessment books) ... don't kill the child's passion by insisting every question has to be learnt and answered.

[coast]

Mychildren:

My P3 DS always came back with his school work with \"modals ?\" on his math worksheet. For I knew that he is lazy to draw them and he can solve the problem by just thinking in his mind and writing the number sentences like _ x _ = _ etc.


Sigh..... Think he is lazy to spend time using ruler to draw neat and tidy rectangle boxes.

Actually, time is spend on drawing those boxes. Will this slow down the speed and so some may not finish the paper in time just because of that.
Just sharing. :lightrod:

Just sharing too ... a model ruler might help You can get it from Popular (less than $2?) or ask him to check if his school bookshop sells it.