GCE debate rages as study shows UK kid's maths woes

[3Boys]

verykiasu2010:

jtoh:

[quote=\"verykiasu2010\"]
there are also many non-GEP background who stopped working with the arrival of the kids - doctors, pharmacist, dentist, accountants, engineers, architect, etc....

That's why they admit very few girls to medicine faculty.

and have seen quite many girls doing medicine in US, OZ, and UK, and not coming back ![/quote]The quota system has been stopped, for quite a while already.

[Laura02]

verykiasu2010:

jtoh:

[quote=\"verykiasu2010\"]
there are also many non-GEP background who stopped working with the arrival of the kids - doctors, pharmacist, dentist, accountants, engineers, architect, etc....

That's why they admit very few girls to medicine faculty.

and have seen quite many girls doing medicine in US, OZ, and UK, and not coming back ![/quote]
There used to be a cap on girls entering medicine. Not any more. The cap was abolished a few years ago. There are now almost equal numbers of boys and girls going into medicine now.

[jtoh]

Laura02:

There used to be a cap on girls entering medicine. Not any more. The cap was abolished a few years ago. There are now almost equal numbers of boys and girls going into medicine now.

Hurray! There's hope for my daughter now. Wait. She's not of that calibre. :rotflmao:

[corneyAmber]

Laura02:

I think they have the 11+exams in UK for entry into their secondary schools. The popular public schools may also hold interviews and auditions.


But more importantly, I remember hearing somewhere that their employers are complaining that their graduates lack basic academic skills to tackle the jobs. Here, it seems that our employes have a different grouse.

In other words, we are all on the extreme of the spectrum. No one is on the balance point yet.

[tutormum]

jtoh:

verykiasu2010:

do they really put on a cap for the girls ? then the screening test is not objective then?

Like I said, the ratio of boys to girls are similar every year. They may not put a cap on the number of girls, but the ratio is very similar year after year. Always more boys than girls and always in a certain ratio.

I don't agree there's a cap. Students are admitted based on their merits. They went through 2 screening tests. I would say that there are more boys cos boys are good in Maths and I think, Maths carry more weight. Boys are better in Science and Maths while girls are good in languages, remember? DS3 told me that the Maths paper was easy to him though some of the questions were only taught in sec level. I overheard many children complaining that the paper was very difficult. There were many IQ based questions that even P6 children may have problem answering. My goddaughter who is in the programme finds Maths the most challenging subject.

[jtoh]

tutormum:

jtoh:

[quote=\"verykiasu2010\"]
do they really put on a cap for the girls ? then the screening test is not objective then?

Like I said, the ratio of boys to girls are similar every year. They may not put a cap on the number of girls, but the ratio is very similar year after year. Always more boys than girls and always in a certain ratio.

I don't agree there's a cap. Students are admitted based on their merits. They went through 2 screening tests. I would say that there are more boys cos boys are good in Maths and I think, Maths carry more weight. Boys are better in Science and Maths while girls are good in languages, remember? DS3 told me that the Maths paper was easy to him though some of the questions were only taught in sec level. I overheard many children complaining that the paper was very difficult. There were many IQ based questions that even P6 children may have problem answering. My goddaughter who is in the programme finds Maths the most challenging subject.[/quote]I don't know if Math carries more weight than the English and General papers. I do know that there are GEPpers who are rather weak in Math. Not just GEP Math. They're still weak in Math in secondary school.

As I said, I don't think there's a cap as such, but a ratio which they adhere to year after year after year.

[SAHM_TAN]

verykiasu2010:

SAHM_TAN:

I don't understand primary 1 model mathematics but does that means the std is high or that my kid is more intelligent then me? In this case nope, it's just that I was not taught model method. I complain why must change method, especially when it will not be used in sec school and some kids solved the questions without using models and oh the best part can even don't use it during PSLE. But to help kids visualise the problem sums and since now other countries also praise the model method, no way school will abandon it. How I manage? Learn the method on my own when i have time later on because cannot depend fully on tuition centre. Not waiting for school because my dd1's school will only touch on it in P3 which I think it's too late.

don't think pri 1 has got model method for math

someone did a nice summary of the model method : basic algebra in pictorial form

Some schools are teaching model towards end of P1 or starting of P2. Same for heuristics. My school will teach in P3 and heuristics in P4 I think if I remember correctly. Not becos other schools are teaching earlier but I really think it's a bit late to start at P3. So many new stuff coming in for P3. I have no problem with the school, it has it's own timeline. I feel it's a bit late, so I will manage it at my end.

Thanks for the infor abt the summary. I have a book about it. I just need time to learn.

[SAHM_TAN]

3Boys:

SAHM_TAN:

So to sum up I'm not angry at the difficulty level of PSLE. I'm angry that schools do not believe all kids with normal IQ and ability can manage it. This is primary education, how can normal kids cannot handle? When MOE, schools and teachers believe not all normal kids can handle the academic demands of PRIMARY education, then they will not be given a fair fighting chance. In a nation whereby the only resource is her pple, I don't understand why the kids are not treasured more in the education journey.

What is your definition of 'normal'? Or do you mean 'average'? The problem is that a lot of people use 'normal' and 'average' interchangeably, leading to confusion.

Here are some numbers for you to mull over --> http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/IQBasics.aspx

If say 'normal' encompasses 2 standard deviations from the mean, then the 'normal' IQ range can span from the low 70s up to 130+. That is a big range, and yes, low 70s are represented in the mainstream schools, and up to 5% of our students will be at that level or lower. And yes, this group, (up to 5% or more, or about 2 students per class of 40), will struggle, sometimes significantly with basic P-school content and syllabus. The 'average' student, on the other hand, I believe has no trouble managing the P-school syllabus.

This corresponds very nicely with statistics --> http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/singaporelocalnews/view/1167372/1/.html

Between 95-97% of each P-school cohort will pass PSLE. So I really can't see where the assertion that P-school kids are assumed not to be able to manage P-School syllabus comes from, since 97% or them, when tested, actually passed the exam.

Is there a differentiated syllabus? Well, of course, unless you are saying that's a bad thing too......I would shudder to think what would happen if our brighter students lost motivation or switched off if they did not feel challenged by the subject matter.

Honestly, I am having a hard time understanding what the grouse is.[/quote]

It's ok. Let me try again tonite when the kids are asleep to try to explain in another post to this thread. My intention is not to try to convince you but to explain my stand better. I am not suggesting kids who are able to score all As to be neglected or slowed down. That's not my stand. I'm also not against GEP. I will try again tonite.

[3Boys]

SAHM_TAN:

It's ok. Let me try again tonite when the kids are asleep to try to explain in another post to this thread. My intention is not to try to convince you but to explain my stand better. I am not suggesting kids who are able to score all As to be neglected or slowed down. That's not my stand. I'm also not against GEP. I will try again tonite.

Alright, don't mean to stress you, but good definitions make for a good discussion yes?

[optimistforum]

Here in the UK the opposition Labour party wants to use former/existing armed forces personnel to staff schools and to enforce discipline and to raise educational standards.....You can't make it up: :?


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/9387642/Labour-plan-to-set-up-Service-Schools-staffed-by-soldiers.html