Asia spending billions on tutors: study
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oxyleo:
I understand what you mean - reasonable. Just for the fun of argument, if there is such investment talk, I may indeed be tempted to sign up to find out more. After attending, I would consider and decide if the recommended investment makes sense and if it suits my risks profile before taking the plunge.Yes, I understand what you mean, but I think a lot of this has to do with relativity. Especially when you are talking about increasing trends, huge proportions, vs those that choose to do the contrary, that sort of thing.
Take for eg, if an increasing number of people around you have been attending this investment talk because it purportedly teaches people things that are exclusive, and this information allows you to make wise choices about investing, and you even hear that many who attended have benefited from it by making better investment choices, would you not sign up? Would it not be surprising that more begin to sign up?.oxyleo:
I agree it is good to level the playing field for everyone. However, as I said before, it is not easy. Banning tuition will make it even more difficult for those who are less privileged. My children are lucky because they could consult me if they have questions and I also teach them how to do self-study and be independent learners. Some other kids may be lucky in different ways, e.g. born with a very high IQ.I agree that as a parent, we need to make the best choice for our children, but parents are in a way also signing up their children for tuition because they feel they need to level the playing field for their child. That is a huge factor here.
A level playing field is a reason why in a beauty contest, anyone found with cosmetic surgery to attain artificial beauty is disqualified; why sportsman are tested for steroids/ doping before competing events. No one says you cannot do surgery if you are born with a cleft lip, or you cannot take painkillers if you are a sportsman in pain, but there are guidelines to competitions to ensure - A Level Playing field.oxyleo:
This is the only part I don't really agree. Yes, state should never be of zero control or regulation, but tuition industry is not one which I would ask for more regulation. But this is personal opinion. Just like whether public transport should be privatised, it is arguable.Lastly, about being a Nanny state -
Not wanting to be a Nanny State does not mean zero control or regulation or governance, or intervention at the right time. A good state would still require stewardship, guidance, management and balance.
When a child fights for independence, a good parent is happy, but also knows that it doesnt mean you disappear from his life. The parent says,\"I'll be here if you need me,\" and offers assistance when deemed necessary.
As a child and parent never ever decouple, neither does state and it's people.
Lastly, thanks for sharing your views. This is what the forum is about - sharing different views and perspectives in a friendly way. :lovesite: -
I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority. -
ksi:
Hey, I never look at it this way but I think that's a good guide. For my kids, it is 7-8 hours of sleep during weekdays with occasional afternoon nap, more during weekends. Falling ill 5 times a year sounds like a lot, it is none or 1-2 times at the most. Maybe the details are not very important, we know they are ok if they are generally healthy, happy, enthusiastic, not too tired nor stressed.I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority. -
Hi wonderm,
Likewise, I truly appreciate your sharing. Enjoyed reading it, and enjoyed how you shared it.
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oxyleo:
Just notice your child is much younger than mine.Hi wonderm,
Likewise, I truly appreciate your sharing. Enjoyed reading it, and enjoyed how you shared it.
All the best to his learning journey!
:hugs: -
ksi:
I agree with wonderm that it is not possible to ban tuition altogether, but I do not see why we cannot regulate the industry. Not to stamp it out, but to ensure good/ ethical business practices in line with what is expected of educators, both public and private perhaps?I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority.
I also agree that if anything, the place to start should be with what is within MOE's control. Just so I don't reignite the flames again, starting with MOE does not mean MOE is to blame for the current situation. Perhaps MOE should look at it this way. As a hirer of teachers that it painstakingly invests in, remunerates and trains, would it not be a concerning trend when it sees teachers making a beeline for the tuition industry? Whosoever/ whatsoever fault it may be due to, it would make sense to evaluate, and ask some tough questions as to why people are leaving the profession? If there are problems retaining staff, how can MOE ever meet the desired student-teacher ratio it hopes to arrive at? Also, are resources allocated to schools through KpIs really the most equitable way?
I am also of the view that standards being kept high is supposed to be a good thing if the school environment is sufficient in doing so. -
oxyleo:
Yes, I understand what you mean, but I think a lot of this has to do with relativity. Especially when you are talking about increasing trends, huge proportions, vs those that choose to do the contrary, that sort of thing.
Take for eg, if an increasing number of people around you have been attending this investment talk because it purportedly teaches people things that are exclusive, and this information allows you to make wise choices about investing, and you even hear that many who attended have benefited from it by making better investment choices, would you not sign up? Would it not be surprising that more begin to sign up?
I agree that as a parent, we need to make the best choice for our children, but parents are in a way also signing up their children for tuition because they feel they need to level the playing field for their child. That is a huge factor here.
A level playing field is a reason why in a beauty contest, anyone found with cosmetic surgery to attain artificial beauty is disqualified; why sportsman are tested for steroids/ doping before competing events. No one says you cannot do surgery if you are born with a cleft lip, or you cannot take painkillers if you are a sportsman in pain, but there are guidelines to competitions to ensure - A Level Playing field.
Lastly, about being a Nanny state -
Not wanting to be a Nanny State does not mean zero control or regulation or governance, or intervention at the right time. A good state would still require stewardship, guidance, management and balance.
When a child fights for independence, a good parent is happy, but also knows that it doesnt mean you disappear from his life. The parent says,\"I'll be here if you need me,\" and offers assistance when deemed necessary.
As a child and parent never ever decouple, neither does state and it's people.
:goodpost: oxyleo, you put it so aptly -
wonderm:
Hey, I never look at it this way but I think that's a good guide. For my kids, it is 7-8 hours of sleep during weekdays with occasional afternoon nap, more during weekends. Falling ill 5 times a year sounds like a lot, it is none or 1-2 times at the most. Maybe the details are not very important, we know they are ok if they are generally healthy, happy, enthusiastic, not too tired nor stressed.ksi:
I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority.
notice I put it as at most as a max. limit I could accept, sometimes things like food poisoning is out of our control. Yes, the detail can vary from child to child depending on their own personal health indicator. Most important is to look at the symptoms to estimate if school is really too tough for the majority.
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oxyleo:
Maybe I am not seeing what you can see. Can you share what is to be regulated?
I agree with wonderm that it is not possible to ban tuition altogether, but I do not see why we cannot regulate the industry. Not to stamp it out, but to ensure good/ ethical business practices in line with what is expected of educators, both public and private perhaps?ksi:
I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority. -
oxyleo:
:goodpost: I share the same view and glad that somebody can put it down in words.
I agree with wonderm that it is not possible to ban tuition altogether, but I do not see why we cannot regulate the industry. Not to stamp it out, but to ensure good/ ethical business practices in line with what is expected of educators, both public and private perhaps?ksi:
I too do not believe in regulating the tuition industry. It is all about demand and supply. The demand will diminish significantly if the majority of the children are not finding it hard to keep up with the standards and enjoy learning. However, if majority of the parents are rich and want to put their children to enrichment or tuition just to push them to a grade that they expect, then that is their call and their self-imposed stress.
The words in bold is a problem statement, if the demand persists due to majority finding it hard to cope.
If we do want MOE to do anything, it should be something within their span of control such as the teachers and the school, not the tuition industry nor the parents' aspirations.
I also believe in us keeping our education standards high but how high is high? In today's context, some of the accelerated learning could be stretching the children too much until they are lack in sleep and often falling ill. The schools and teachers have expectations as well so streaming kind of limit the stress to the high ability classes. We need to look out for such symptoms. My personal guide is my child must have at least 9-10 hours of sleep, no dark rings, no eye bags, running about cheerfully daily with a stress less face and fall ill at most 5 times a year. Then I know the rigours of academic is not taking a toll on her.
So if we really want to understand if the children are coping in Singapore, just walk around and look at their faces and observe what you see in the majority.
I also agree that if anything, the place to start should be with what is within MOE's control. Just so I don't reignite the flames again, starting with MOE does not mean MOE is to blame for the current situation. Perhaps MOE should look at it this way. As a hirer of teachers that it painstakingly invests in, remunerates and trains, would it not be a concerning trend when it sees teachers making a beeline for the tuition industry? Whosoever/ whatsoever fault it may be due to, it would make sense to evaluate, and ask some tough questions as to why people are leaving the profession? If there are problems retaining staff, how can MOE ever meet the desired student-teacher ratio it hopes to arrive at? Also, are resources allocated to schools through KpIs really the most equitable way?
I am also of the view that standards being kept high is supposed to be a good thing if the school environment is sufficient in doing so.
For one thing, it has become more and more attractive for an NIE-trained teacher/ex-HOD/ex-GEP teacher/ex-Award winning teacher to get out of the public schools and start his/her own tuition centre. Look at the hourly rate he/she can command outside, it can be $40-$100 per pax (can be a student or a parent). If the teacher is taking a class of 10, the earning is multiplied 10x and he/she can earn $400-$1000 per hour! These excellent teachers/trainers are highly sought after, they know it. And with the high demand of such expertise, they can increase their hourly rates, work less hours, and still get a very high income at the end of each month.
The rest of the tutors are not stupid. When they know that the top guys in the market are priced so highly, they will also start to increase their own hourly rate. This phenomenon is not new. Remember how years ago BreadTalk set the benchmark for pork-floss buns and soon all the neighbourhood bakeries started to set prices lower-than-BreadTalk but big jump from what they used to charge?
The demand and supply thingy has been going on for too long. We are already seeing the problems of not monitoring the situation earlier. It doesn't help that there are many parents in Singapore who have lots of money to spare. It also doesn't help that many have made a pile from the property market.
If all our policemen can find alternative related jobs such as highly paid personal investigators/ body guards (let's say lah), and then we have less policemen to fight crimes, and we have to live in constant fear of day-light robberies, would you still say that \"it's demand and supply lor, too bad for us\"?
I also do not have a solution. I just hope that MOE recognises that somewhere in the equations, there are areas they can control and do better. I think many teachers (especially good ones who can afford to throw in the towels) are frustrated with the piling of workloads and stress on them by the school management to produce good PSLE showings. I know many good teachers who cannot have work-life balance (esp. those who reach the stage of setting up a family of their own). Giving tuitions can offer them that.
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