GCE debate rages as study shows UK kid's maths woes
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optimistforum:
Optimistforum - thanks for sharing. Indeed you sound more like an Asianparent. Yes, you should come back to Singapore with your family then, to feel less out of place. Hahaha! Education is held in the highest regard here.Hi Oxylea
Do not worry about your questions, I find education fascinating. I will answer all. The point I made is that parents who have been through a rigorous educations (and remember it so) feel guilty when their off-spring go through the same. So in the UK, education was dumbed down in the 70s (slightly), 80s (greatly) and 90s onwards (completely dumbed-down). From 1945 to 1975 we had the best educational system in the world, but we also hada lot of functioanl illteracy and innumeracy for thsoe who did not sit O and A levels.
It galls me, as we had the best education system in the world. Our exam boards still provide high level O and A Levels to all countries except the UK.
Interestingly, my DS1 (who will be 9 tomorrow) is working on the vocab section of the EPH Book Complete Practice in Vocab, Grammar, Cloze and Comprehension. It is the first piece of written work I have given him since Easter (he has read since then). By the way he has just started the P5 book. Both my boys follow the MOE Primary Curricula at home. DS2 will be withdrawn from school homework in January.
I use old UK books (from the 50s) and the modern Singaporean assessment books. He find the latter challenging, however, I have yet to find any decent General Ability books from Singapore - those are what we need. He does not do school homework, as he has been using EPH P3 and P4 books all year. Re tutoring; with my Singapore books at my disposal, I do not need a tutor. The tutor is being used to hothouse my son to get into a local top private secondary school. My frustration is borne of the fact that my DS spends all evenings on the tutor's homework and does not have time for the important Singapore assessment book. I have come this far, that I find it difficult to let anyone else tutor him.
Anyway, do not dumb down your education - you will regret it in a generation's time. A civilised, increasingly affluent and socially responsible society tries to eschew discipline, and all other contemporary morays. We have lost these in the UK (spare the rod and spoil the child is so true of our culture) - this has led to poor governance and societal decline. The teachers we have are not that great, simply because they have no status and are paid comparatively less than other graduates (those who can't do, teach and those that can't teach, teach Phyisical Education - rings so true). Also, we have so many lone parent families, couples living together, marriage (between man/women) is falling and civil partnerships (marriage between man/man and woman/woman) is going up. They are now trying to force all religious institutions to allow gay marriage. Gay relationships are discussed in schools as now being acceptable (this is fine but heterosexual manrried parents cannot give a contrary view for fear of being labelled as bigots). The liberalisation of the 60s has steadily undermined and eroded family values. Quick book my DS a place in a MOE school for January 2013. :xedfingers:
I notice you mentioned your child is 9 tomorrow (Happy Birthday to him in advance!) and he is attempting P5 Assessment books? Wow! 9 year olds here are in P3 here, so that makes your child 2 years ahead academically?
congratulations! he must be very bright!
Thanks for sharing your observations about the UK. Indeed affluence has its ill effects in any society and where the gap is present between the haves and have-nots, the situation worsens. -
I don't see the point of out of school tutoring in Singapore; reason-being you have a plethora of wonderful assessment books (complete with model answers). That's all you need. My DC are testament to that. We use Singaporean assessment books and I do not feel the need to use a tutor. My functional literacy and numeracy has improved too (but can you telling from my spelling mistakes...I maen pselling msitkaes
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Hi Oxylea
Only P5 for English, he still struggles with P3/4 Conquering Cloze, and Maths only P3 Challenging Maths. He is not great at all. -
optimistforum:
Hi Melodies, cherryc
In answer to your questions.
I. No, I am not from Singapore, I am from the UK. I just steal from Singapore by using your books and getting my children to use them. I have spent thousnads of pounds over the last six years on this - but hey this is my only vice.
2. I do not home school. My children go to state primary. Instead of school homework (which I withdrawn DS1 from), they do Singapore Assessment books.
3. I do not provide home schooling as I need to work. I just do short challenging bursts of work from old UK books and current Singaporean books. DS1 got into trouble as he was always alte in doing school homework, as he was doing home enrichment instead.
4. By MOE, I mean Singapore. I envy your education system, even though I realise it is wholly reliant on out of school tutoring. But I do like the look of the school exam papers on MissKoh website - and we tend to practice the Nanyang school papers.
5. There is no meritocracy in UK schools. If you can afford it you send your DC to private schools. This is beyond the preserve of the middle class now. The best schools are private and the majority of candiadates to the best Universities originate from private schools.
Your description of our situation in Point 4 is so apt! Yes you have indeed picked up all the right tips in terms of school papers and out of school tutoring. It is perplexing, but strangely, what's even more perplexing is that there are some parents who don't think there is any problem with our situation at all! :scratchhead: -
optimistforum:
I don't see the point of out of school tutoring in Singapore; reason-being you have a plethora of wonderful assessment books (complete with model answers). That's all you need. My DC are testament to that. We use Singaporean assessment books and I do not feel the need to use a tutor. My functional literacy and numeracy has improved too (but can you telling from my spelling mistakes...I maen pselling msitkaes
:rotflmao: hmm.. I spell pretty well, funny, didn't spot any at all! -
Oxylea stay online, I will pm you
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optimistforum:
I do not think that my kids will excel as I have have to force, cajole and offer inducements to get them to work. They prefer the Wii and TV anytime.cherryc:
Hi,
After doing all the SIngapore assessment books, i guess your kids will excel in UK education system ??!! I really hope the day won't come for us to declare that there is no meritocracy in our schools !
What do you think of the merits and weakness of our system ?
What is the main difference in teaching for the private schools vs public secondary school ? If a child is really smart but lack of resources, will he/she still be able to go Cambridge/Oxford in UK??
Merits of your system, seems most people are culturally predisposed towards a quality education. Please never lose that. Drawbacks, a lot of your learning seems rote based, and your quality education system is down to out of hours tutoring. Why can't they teach in schools what the tutors teach after school!!!
This touches on many raw nerves Optimistforum so much that we can't quite even have a decent debate about it, without drawing swords. And honestly, it is hard to see where those, who do not seem to want to change status quo, are coming from. I know that there are genuine concerns about the dumb down effect, like you've pointed out, but I find it highly unlikely that we will ever head that way. As it is, those far ahead seem to display extreme infuriation and appear offended even, at the mere mention of co-mingling children with different test band results, as they seem to see it as utterly unfair that the bright ones get slowed down. And we are talking about Pri School education here. Ah well.
My best friend's son is hopefully going to Oxford in the autumn. He needs two A* and one A. He gets 93 to 100% in his A Level assessments. You guessed right, it is not just an exam after two years but lots of mini assessments and resits. One person in 2010 resat 29 modules before he passed his A Level in Maths.
Only the posh kids get into Oxford, Cambridge, Imperial, Durham and Warwick. Quite alot from top state secondaries get in too. -
P5 is English, you mean English grammar? I suppose it is peanut for your DS1 since he is English! Open Cloze passage and Comprehension are the killing sections for most of the Children here in Singapore. BTW, for English, you can try RGPS, ACS, Methodist, SCGS & Cathodic High English exams papers.
One more question, are you trying to enroll your DS2 in Singapore primary school here soon?optimistforum:
Hi Oxylea
Only P5 for English, he still struggles with P3/4 Conquering Cloze, and Maths only P3 Challenging Maths. He is not great at all. -
Melodies:
P5 is English, you mean English grammar? I suppose it will be peanut for your DS1 since he is English! Open Cloze passage and Comprehension are the killing sections for most of the Children here in Singapore. BTW, for English, you can try RGPS, ACS, Methodist, SCGS & Cathodic High English exams papers.
One more question, are you trying to enroll your DS2 in Singapore primary school here soon?optimistforum:
Hi Oxylea
Only P5 for English, he still struggles with P3/4 Conquering Cloze, and Maths only P3 Challenging Maths. He is not great at all.
P5 for vocab, grammar and MCQ comprehension.
Well being English makes no difference, he does not read so the said books help him. For comprehension I use old MCQ O Level Books or FCE books. He does struggle with comprehension cloze - and that is the definer that determines if you can understand text or not.
I am not trying to enrol DS2 to Singapore. I would love to, as I am jealous of your results and discipline. Alas, we will stay in the UK and make do as best we can. -
Err.. Some parents think that those wonderful assessments are not good enough because they want their DC to score >91% n get A*. Scoring an average mark of A for 4subjects will just give you 220 for psle and you may not end up in top secondary but in neighborhood secondary. You need to score at least 250 (high 4A or low A*) to get into good school(not top school yet). hence, they subscribe their DC for those tuition which set very competitive n challenging questions n just hope to edge out other student. After all, psle t score is a relative score if compare u compare to other student
.optimistforum:
I don't see the point of out of school tutoring in Singapore; reason-being you have a plethora of wonderful assessment books (complete with model answers). That's all you need. My DC are testament to that. We use Singaporean assessment books and I do not feel the need to use a tutor. My functional literacy and numeracy has improved too (but can you telling from my spelling mistakes...I maen pselling msitkaes
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