Parents, let's solve this problem for our kids
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DesertWind:
The gahmen should try to stop the brain-drain and also welcome citizens to come back home! Give a big invitation for our fellow-men to come back with their heads held high. Do not call them names. There could be many wanting to come back but held back by fear of discrimination rejection. I do not know what is the current stand now since I hardly come across any talks about this anymore after the debate in the 80s. I hope whatever hard-stand they adopt will be changed given the current disminishing population.
Was there really any known discrimination? From the govt? I know of common folks making snide remarks about people whom they know gave up their citizenship only to find that they may have to try to come back. I find myself guilty of that sometimes. But government discriminating, so far have not really heard of any. I have also personally encountered people who gave up their citizenship and trying to come back but are peeved that they are not given obvious priority over the next non-ex-singaporean PR applicant. The moment their application gets rejected, they say they are being discriminated because they gave up their citizenship before.
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When DH and I were seriously considering fertility treatment to try for #3, we were told that if we require financial assistance, we need to go to govt hospitals. My first thought was why? If you are going to provide financial assistance up to a certain amount, just provide that amount, leave the choice of which doctor or which hospital to the parents to be. I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
Make abortions less convenient. I don’t know what it is like right now. But I have, unfortunately, seen a couple of friends through some abortions when I was much younger. There isn’t much counselling done, no cool off period, no consultation about possible options. It is clinical. You want to abort? Ok, you are this far along, you are not a minor, sign this form. And watch this video.
Stop discriminating against single/unwed parents. Extend the same subsidies and financial assistance to them. If anything, they need all the help they can get to face the challenges of bringing up the kid on their own.
Make adoption more acceptable. Why do we have people promoting pet adoption but adoption of children seem like such a taboo subject. -
Funz:
:goodpost:When DH and I were seriously considering fertility treatment to try for #3, we were told that if we require financial assistance, we need to go to govt hospitals. My first thought was why? If you are going to provide financial assistance up to a certain amount, just provide that amount, leave the choice of which doctor or which hospital to the parents to be. I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
Make abortions less convenient. I don't know what it is like right now. But I have, unfortunately, seen a couple of friends through some abortions when I was much younger. There isn't much counselling done, no cool off period, no consultation about possible options. It is clinical. You want to abort? Ok, you are this far along, you are not a minor, sign this form. And watch this video.
Stop discriminating against single/unwed parents. Extend the same subsidies and financial assistance to them. If anything, they need all the help they can get to face the challenges of bringing up the kid on their own.
Make adoption more acceptable. Why do we have people promoting pet adoption but adoption of children seem like such a taboo subject. -
Funz:
Sure.. It is your choice.. a personal choice.. you are fully entitled to choose freely which hospital to go to.I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
It is also your choice whether to accept financial assistance. -
limlim:
Perhaps there are are special donations done directly through govt hospitals and to save on additional administrative work? Personally, I had the same gynae throughout my visits at KK. It is making the choice right from the beginning. However, now, she is no longer there, and if I were to go back to KK, chances are I will need to choose a different gynae.
Sure.. It is your choice.. a personal choice.. you are fully entitled to choose freely which hospital to go to.Funz:
I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
It is also your choice whether to accept financial assistance.
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Funz:
I think the gov't is being fair. All why should an ex-Singaporean be given priority over others non-ex-Singapore ? By virtue of being ex-Singaporean ? They will scratch their head and ask \"why give up in the first place?\" A dog does not return to its vomit, as the saying goes. May be the Chinese saying sounds less curt : good horse does not eat the grass that has passed overDesertWind:
The gahmen should try to stop the brain-drain and also welcome citizens to come back home! Give a big invitation for our fellow-men to come back with their heads held high. Do not call them names. There could be many wanting to come back but held back by fear of discrimination rejection. I do not know what is the current stand now since I hardly come across any talks about this anymore after the debate in the 80s. I hope whatever hard-stand they adopt will be changed given the current disminishing population.
Was there really any known discrimination? From the govt? I know of common folks making snide remarks about people whom they know gave up their citizenship only to find that they may have to try to come back. I find myself guilty of that sometimes. But government discriminating, so far have not really heard of any. I have also personally encountered people who gave up their citizenship and trying to come back but are peeved that they are not given obvious priority over the next non-ex-singaporean PR applicant. The moment their application gets rejected, they say they are being discriminated because they gave up their citizenship before. -
limlim:
Is it truly our choice? It is a choice with strings attached. I think I can fathom your stand on whether people who choose private should be entitled to the same financial assistance.
Sure.. It is your choice.. a personal choice.. you are fully entitled to choose freely which hospital to go to.Funz:
I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
It is also your choice whether to accept financial assistance.
If it is budgeted for such a purpose, let it be used for that purpose, whether it be a private or govt hospital should not have any bearings. If any criteria is to be set, it should be income based, not pte or govt hospital. -
Funz:
Is it truly our choice? It is a choice with strings attached. I think I can fathom your stand on whether people who choose private should be entitled to the same financial assistance.
Sure.. It is your choice.. a personal choice.. you are fully entitled to choose freely which hospital to go to.limlim:
[quote=\"Funz\"] I mean, I found a gynae whom I am comfortable with and I do not wish to consult anyone else. To put it bluntly, he/she will be looking up my most private parts and will be privy to the most physically intimate part of my relationship with DH so I say finding one whom you trust and are comfortable with is very important. Couples who are willing to spend tens of thousands of dollars on fertility treatment want a child/children. They should be encouraged, supported, not thrown more hurdles.
It is also your choice whether to accept financial assistance.
If it is budgeted for such a purpose, let it be used for that purpose, whether it be a private or govt hospital should not have any bearings. If any criteria is to be set, it should be income based, not pte or govt hospital.[/quote]Sorry Funz, disagree with you here. All choices have strings attached, all choices have consequences. Generally if one makes a choice, one should bear the consequences of it, and not expect society to shoulder it. Otherwise it creates a moral hazard, i.e. I can do whatever I want because at the end of the day, someone else will pick up the pieces for me. -
Funz:
I don't see there being any taboo about adoption at all. The issue with adoptions is the same here as it is anywhere in the world, namely, supply, and ensuring a safe environment for the adopted child.
Make adoption more acceptable. Why do we have people promoting pet adoption but adoption of children seem like such a taboo subject. -
3Boys:
No need to say sorry lah. Difference in views are inevitable. No right or wrong.
Sorry Funz, disagree with you here. All choices have strings attached, all choices have consequences. Generally if one makes a choice, one should bear the consequences of it, and not expect society to shoulder it. Otherwise it creates a moral hazard, i.e. I can do whatever I want because at the end of the day, someone else will pick up the pieces for me.Funz:
Is it truly our choice? It is a choice with strings attached. I think I can fathom your stand on whether people who choose private should be entitled to the same financial assistance.
If it is budgeted for such a purpose, let it be used for that purpose, whether it be a private or govt hospital should not have any bearings. If any criteria is to be set, it should be income based, not pte or govt hospital.
Agree totally that choices will always come with strings attached. It is the type of strings attached that I am hoping can be less restrictive.
Also agree that there are consequences to everything. I am not saying for the govt to pick up the tab for the entire treatment, but to extend to those who want this treatment the same subsidy regardless of hospitals, to ease some of the decision making process for these people who truly want to have children. We are afterall short of made by Singaporean babies. And we have to assume that people who make the decision to pay that much money for fertility treatment would be sensible enough to not make rash decisions.
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