How to tell if a child is gifted?

[2ppaamm]

simple2005:

2ppaamm:

[quote=\"venuschan\"]All Parents,


Sharing here an interesting BUT important article on what is gifted/precococious child and its correlation in life.

Cheers.

http://www.alternet.org/culture/can-genius-really-be-detected-infancy?page=0%2C0&akid=9378.1085969.JwpXas&rd=1&src=newsletter708628&t=18

Very interesting article, and I like the writer's tone and the way things are put. How true, even with IQ this level, it does not mean anything at all. There are so many more things in life to worry about and to take care of. Sometimes, I do think it is a bigger blessing to have an IQ slightly lower, about 130 (or top 1%) and have a bigger EQ. EQ of 159. Also, the kind of expectation can be hard to live up to. People expect you to know everything, and behave 10 years older. They forget that the child is only high IQ. To get into uni, an average 18 year just need to be better than their peers, but a younger child needs to score full marks.

Having a high IQ is not necessarily a big blessing, there are other things in life so much more important - zeal, enthusiasm, passion, life skills. All these make people successful. IQ is just one small, small component people focus too much on. PLUS, heh heh... IQ tests are so biased, and doesn't say much about us as people. So even at this kind of IQ level, it means nothing.

Said many times and will say again. It is about doing extraordinary things. A genius is one who does things others don't even dream about. Not one who is born with more and does little with whatever given him.

If I so may use a clip from a movie, The park bench scene from the movie \"Good Will Hunting\", I think it epitomises the difference between wisdom and intelligence, experience and knowledge. IQ scores and intellectual achievements are good to have, but never forget other things in life, and how one should learn to appreciate it, live it, experience it.

Such is the possibility that a child who is caught up academically may lose sight of other important things, and possibly even more so for one so gifted that they cannot fathom taking the trouble to find out about the other, because what he/she is gifted in is so easy to achieve.

As parents, it is important not to lose sight of things once we become too focus on certain objectives.

Cheers.[/quote]This one?
\"I don't see an intelligent, confident man. I see a cocky, scared shitless kid.\"
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBjWHfBHKos][/youtube]

I actually like this scene at the Harvard bar a lot, and I can relate to it... it tells of how the education system just have us thinking we know everything by teaching us how to regurgitate and not teach us how to think.... even in Harvard. (But no... I have a very good opinion of Harvard.) Be careful what our children are taught...
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnZ0Y4rvz6E][/youtube]

[simple2005]

You're right about the video I mentioned. I don't think much about the Harvard scene though, it's an age-old problem where a 'bright' student is able to regurgitate and get him/herself in a good school. And in a way, both of them were pretty much 'regurgitating', just that someone had the ability to absorb more from reading outside of the syllabus


I have no particular opinions about Harvard or any of those ivy league universities, never had a chance to know them to have any opinion

I'm not sure if there's a good way to teach the masses the way you think we should all be taught, the keyword here being 'masses'. So yes, I can agree you can teach a good number of them, but to reach out to have a good level of education for a good portion of the population, certain choices have to be made.

I'm not so worried about what they are being taught, more concerned about how they are being taught. And whether a child with potential is spotted and nurtured, or is he/she being stifled and pressed back to conformance.

I'm definitely not as knowledgeable/experienced as you about teaching and nurturing talents and on academic topics, so what I express here are just my personal views and based on what I have experienced and observed.

Cheers.

[2ppaamm]

simple2005:

I'm not sure if there's a good way to teach the masses the way you think we should all be taught, the keyword here being 'masses'. So yes, I can agree you can teach a good number of them, but to reach out to have a good level of education for a good portion of the population, certain choices have to be made.

I'm not so worried about what they are being taught, more concerned about how they are being taught. And whether a child with potential is spotted and nurtured, or is he/she being stifled and pressed back to conformance.

These days, I am wondering as well. Even those among us who were sent to good universities on our taxpayers' money are sometimes disappointing with their views and personalities. Many lack depth and empathy, definitely not knowledge and scholarship. They write with fluency and accuracy, but their essays lack souls. They can quote Socrates, educated in the wisdom of man, but they lack understanding. They spend time writing with a thesaurus in their hands, but they forget to search the meaning of their experiences. Unfortunately, good schools can only teach so much.

Most children will NOT be spotted and nurtured in a society such as ours. Fortunately, I managed to find other societies which are much more willing to identify and nurture those who do not fit a narrow definition of giftedness to make them worthy of opportunities. Often, it is those who are different who need attention. It is also those who refuse to respect status quo who will make a difference, and therefore transform from just head knowledge to change the world. This is the direct opposite of conformance, that which is valued highly in any education institution. These folks are also the hardest to teach and nurture. In fact, no one can really teach them. As parents and educators, we can only facilitate and not teach. Sometimes, all they need are opportunities, and often even these are robbed from those who are the most vulnerable, and therefore who need them the most.

You are right that we cannot expect the masses to get the kind of education akin to that provided by the Ivies, they are truly of a different league. My hope is not that the masses go to Ivy Leagues, but for the educators to be educated enough to provide similar education to the masses. Perhaps it is too tall an order, but it does not harm dreaming and hoping. And if we reach there, it really does not matter whether any child is gifted or not, because each will be given the opportunity to be respected, and his potential maximized. I guess it does not harm to start by believing that day is coming soon.

[simple2005]

2ppaamm:

These days, I am wondering as well. Even those among us who were sent to good universities on our taxpayers' money are sometimes disappointing with their views and personalities. Many lack depth and empathy, definitely not knowledge and scholarship. They write with fluency and accuracy, but their essays lack souls. They can quote Socrates, educated in the wisdom of man, but they lack understanding. They spend time writing with a thesaurus in their hands, but they forget to search the meaning of their experiences. Unfortunately, good schools can only teach so much.

This is what was pointed out in the park bench scene, that, despite his genius, his words lack depth and wisdom, and it showed.

2ppaamm:

Most children will NOT be spotted and nurtured in a society such as ours. Fortunately, I managed to find other societies which are much more willing to identify and nurture those who do not fit a narrow definition of giftedness to make them worthy of opportunities.

It is good that you managed to find such a place, and be able to move there. Many do not have the opportunity. And even in the very same society that offers this, I believe there are still a good number that gets missed out for various reasons. I'm not able to comment about the 'Most' in your words, because I don't have the knowledge (nor experience) to back up any claims.

2ppaamm:

As parents and educators, we can only facilitate and not teach. Sometimes, all they need are opportunities, and often even these are robbed from those who are the most vulnerable, and therefore who need them the most.

As parents, we have to try to understand the child and not expect the 'experts' to give advice that we have to follow faithfully. If that's the case then children and people in general are no better than robots that can be trained by a set of rules. At the end of the day, a doctor, educator can only give advice based on their observation of majority of cases they have seen, but it is the caregivers, parents who will know, is this the 'normal' behavior, is there something underlying, not easily noticed by that few short moment of professional analysis, but only through a long process of bonding, and understanding, can that sparkle be seen.

You are right, we can facilitate, educate, but not teach.

2ppaamm:

You are right that we cannot expect the masses to get the kind of education akin to that provided by the Ivies, they are truly of a different league. My hope is not that the masses go to Ivy Leagues, but for the educators to be educated enough to provide similar education to the masses. Perhaps it is too tall an order, but it does not harm dreaming and hoping. And if we reach there, it really does not matter whether any child is gifted or not, because each will be given the opportunity to be respected, and his potential maximized. I guess it does not harm to start by believing that day is coming soon.

Actually I wasn't really referring to education akin to the ivys , but education that caters to these 'special needs' for the masses. But I do agree that the educators need to be aware and understand the underlying intention of an education, and not just by mere 'teaching' is their job done.

But I do hold the believe that the biggest responsibility lies with the parents, whether they are able to understand their children, and their needs, how best they can achieve their potential and yet be able to enjoy life's experiences. And if necessary, pursue a road less travelled in order to facilitate their growth mentally, healthily.

As of now, what I can observe, is that our society as a whole, is not in a healthy state. But I have come across very good individuals, who, as teachers, are able to bring about a sense of perspective when it comes to bringing up children, and education for the young. And that gives me a sense of hope.

Cheers.

[2ppaamm]

simple2005:

2ppaamm:

These days, I am wondering as well. Even those among us who were sent to good universities on our taxpayers' money are sometimes disappointing with their views and personalities. Many lack depth and empathy, definitely not knowledge and scholarship. They write with fluency and accuracy, but their essays lack souls. They can quote Socrates, educated in the wisdom of man, but they lack understanding. They spend time writing with a thesaurus in their hands, but they forget to search the meaning of their experiences. Unfortunately, good schools can only teach so much.

This is what was pointed out in the park bench scene, that, despite his genius, his words lack depth and wisdom, and it showed.

2ppaamm:

Most children will NOT be spotted and nurtured in a society such as ours. Fortunately, I managed to find other societies which are much more willing to identify and nurture those who do not fit a narrow definition of giftedness to make them worthy of opportunities.

It is good that you managed to find such a place, and be able to move there. Many do not have the opportunity. And even in the very same society that offers this, I believe there are still a good number that gets missed out for various reasons. I'm not able to comment about the 'Most' in your words, because I don't have the knowledge (nor experience) to back up any claims.

2ppaamm:

As parents and educators, we can only facilitate and not teach. Sometimes, all they need are opportunities, and often even these are robbed from those who are the most vulnerable, and therefore who need them the most.

As parents, we have to try to understand the child and not expect the 'experts' to give advice that we have to follow faithfully. If that's the case then children and people in general are no better than robots that can be trained by a set of rules. At the end of the day, a doctor, educator can only give advice based on their observation of majority of cases they have seen, but it is the caregivers, parents who will know, is this the 'normal' behavior, is there something underlying, not easily noticed by that few short moment of professional analysis, but only through a long process of bonding, and understanding, can that sparkle be seen.

You are right, we can facilitate, educate, but not teach.

2ppaamm:

You are right that we cannot expect the masses to get the kind of education akin to that provided by the Ivies, they are truly of a different league. My hope is not that the masses go to Ivy Leagues, but for the educators to be educated enough to provide similar education to the masses. Perhaps it is too tall an order, but it does not harm dreaming and hoping. And if we reach there, it really does not matter whether any child is gifted or not, because each will be given the opportunity to be respected, and his potential maximized. I guess it does not harm to start by believing that day is coming soon.

Actually I wasn't really referring to education akin to the ivys , but education that caters to these 'special needs' for the masses. But I do agree that the educators need to be aware and understand the underlying intention of an education, and not just by mere 'teaching' is their job done.

But I do hold the believe that the biggest responsibility lies with the parents, whether they are able to understand their children, and their needs, how best they can achieve their potential and yet be able to enjoy life's experiences. And if necessary, pursue a road less travelled in order to facilitate their growth mentally, healthily.

As of now, what I can observe, is that our society as a whole, is not in a healthy state. But I have come across very good individuals, who, as teachers, are able to bring about a sense of perspective when it comes to bringing up children, and education for the young. And that gives me a sense of hope.

Cheers.

All the best to you! I'm sure the journey will be fruitful and gratifying.

[simple2005]

2ppaamm:

All the best to you! I'm sure the journey will be fruitful and gratifying.

Thank You.

[venuschan]

I chance upon this article and I feel I'm obligated to provide the link in case you too have interest to read/know more......In that article, it has a short sentence that compares gifted child in Japan, Hungary as well as Singapore with US...I think those who've gone through the so called IQ assessment, if all being equal, would likely feel the pinch as mentioned in the article if we're not cautious enough.


Happy Reading!

http://www.earlyentrancefoundation.org/peep/articles/2007/failinggeniuses.html

[safetyfirst]

interesting

[rawafish]

I read all the previous comments and have this strange feeling of excitement in me. I don’t know why.


The reason why I came here was because a friend mentioned that my 4.5yo might be gifted. I don’t think she is though. Bright, yes, but gifted, no. She is bored with K1 and finds her brother’s K2 work easy. She doesn’t have many friends in school (or at all) and went through crying episodes of refusing to go to school. It gets better but I can tell if given a choice she will choose home anyday. She is very mature for her age, reads a lot, very motivated, and does well for everything that is being taught without even trying too hard. I don’t do a lot with her at home and we don’t go for enrichment classes coz’ 1) No time (3 young kids, no maid, travelling husband) 2) don’t believe in it.

I have been thinking about pulling her out from preschool. It just doesn’t seem to make sense - she is not learning anything new there and not making new friends. The only reason to keep her there is to expose her socially since this is a department she is doing poorly in. But I wonder if it will help her at all.

Quite unsure at this moment. Perhaps I should get the school to consider letting her accelerate to K2? Will they allow that?

Anyone has any thoughts, do share. Would really appreciate it.

[mashy]

rawafish:

I read all the previous comments and have this strange feeling of excitement in me. I don't know why.


The reason why I came here was because a friend mentioned that my 4.5yo might be gifted. I don't think she is though. Bright, yes, but gifted, no. She is bored with K1 and finds her brother's K2 work easy. She doesn't have many friends in school (or at all) and went through crying episodes of refusing to go to school. It gets better but I can tell if given a choice she will choose home anyday. She is very mature for her age, reads a lot, very motivated, and does well for everything that is being taught without even trying too hard. I don't do a lot with her at home and we don't go for enrichment classes coz' 1) No time (3 young kids, no maid, travelling husband) 2) don't believe in it.

I have been thinking about pulling her out from preschool. It just doesn't seem to make sense - she is not learning anything new there and not making new friends. The only reason to keep her there is to expose her socially since this is a department she is doing poorly in. But I wonder if it will help her at all.

Quite unsure at this moment. Perhaps I should get the school to consider letting her accelerate to K2? Will they allow that?

Anyone has any thoughts, do share. Would really appreciate it.

If u manage to find a school that let her accelerate to K2, what are u going to do after she's done with k2 and yet still not of the age to enrol for primary school? Perhaps the school that u enrolled her in isn't challenging enough for her? Can u find one that will keep her at the same level but expose her to more challenging things so that she always has something to learn? Enrichment has its purpose besides 'tuition'. Some enrichment like music, arts and dance can help to develop a more well rounded child. Others when based on acad challenges the child to more problem solving skills too. So if she's under challenged in preschool, look for more things for her to learn. If extra classes is out, and you can afford the time, teach her yourself.