Population woes

[3Boys]

WeiHan:

pirate:

Personally, I think Singaporeans are too addicted to cheap labour and pay too little to get other people to cook for them and wash their dishes anyways. I am a great fan of eateries increasing their prices if they find that they have more customers than they can handle. Singaporeans may grumble, but if the food is yummy enough, they will come back.

I am not sure how you think about this. I think in term of food, adjusted for food quality, Singapore no longer has an edge over place like Japan. In Tokyo, I can get a big bowl of super yummy bowl of extra miso pork noodle for approximately S$8-9. Yes. In absolute money term, it is higher than the S$4-5 fishball noodle that normally get in foodcourt. But the size is also about double! and it tastes alot better. The soup base is real poultry bones slow cook over many hours compare to the one in our food court that they add MSG.

In Japan, I can get high quality plate of fresh sashimi at ~S$30. I don't think this is possible in Singapore.

So I don't know what is missing....we have cheap labour to cook and the price is already quite high adjusted to food quality.

And why is Japan our economic model?

I didn't think sclerosis and decline were so fashionable.

High wages, high cost of living, low growth.......just what we wanted.......

[limlim]

3Boys:

\"A quick check in the heartland revealed that it isn't just the big players that are suffering. If anything, it is the owners of small businesses who seem to be the hardest hit.\"


http://www.soshiok.com/multimedia/photos/1623

Hit by what? High rental?

If we want to save the biz.. why only point to difficulty in hiring as the culprit? Why not point finger at the rental?

Why biz want to ask for govt help in getting workers..

Why cannot ask got govt help to deal with the rental cost?

[WeiHan]

3Boys:

And why is Japan our economic model?

I didn't think sclerosis and decline were so fashionable.

High wages, high cost of living, low growth.......just what we wanted.......

I am not comparing with their economic model. I am just saying that even when we have cheap labor in F&B industry and in addition, even if we assume that Japan model is so much inferior than ours, I am saying that we are losing out in term of food, both in term of quality and price and that is even after we have exploited the cheap labor advantage.

[pirate]

3Boys:

\"A quick check in the heartland revealed that it isn't just the big players that are suffering. If anything, it is the owners of small businesses who seem to be the hardest hit.\"


http://www.soshiok.com/multimedia/photos/1623

The foreign worker dependency ratio, with its quota and sub-quotas for this that and the other actually works against small businesses more than large corporations. Why? Because the number is rounded down.

limlim:

Hit by what? High rental?

If we want to save the biz.. why only point to difficulty in hiring as the culprit? Why not point finger at the rental?

High retail rent is also problem. Plus, many REITs now operate on a rent + percentage of turnover formula. On the other hand, some strata-titled commercial buildings are so badly managed that nobody wants to go there even if the retail rent is as low as office rent. For this, owner occupiers must also bear some responsibility.

But when it comes to the restaurant trade, the other problem is that it is perceived to be unglamorous. It is also hard work. Hence, many children of the restaurant owners do not wish to continue with the trade. Although in some cases, graduate children are able to take over and grow the business. But they appear to be the minority. Many youngsters prefer the comfort of a fixed income job to the heat of the kitchen.

[WeiHan]

pirate:

3Boys:

\"A quick check in the heartland revealed that it isn't just the big players that are suffering. If anything, it is the owners of small businesses who seem to be the hardest hit.\"


http://www.soshiok.com/multimedia/photos/1623

The foreign worker dependency ratio, with its quota and sub-quotas for this that and the other actually works against small businesses more than large corporations. Why? Because the number is rounded down.

limlim:

Hit by what? High rental?

If we want to save the biz.. why only point to difficulty in hiring as the culprit? Why not point finger at the rental?

High retail rent is also problem. Plus, many REITs now operate on a rent + percentage of turnover formula. On the other hand, some strata-titled commercial buildings are so badly managed that nobody wants to go there even if the retail rent is as low as office rent. For this, owner occupiers must also bear some responsibility.

But when it comes to the restaurant trade, the other problem is that it is perceived to be unglamorous. It is also hard work. Hence, many children of the restaurant owners do not wish to continue with the trade. Although in some cases, graduate children are able to take over and grow the business. But they appear to be the minority. Many youngsters prefer the comfort of a fixed income job to the heat of the kitchen.

I just feel that Singapore is heaven of assets rich owners ( property owners, property developers, government etc...) but hardly reward creativity sufficiently.

[3Boys]

limlim:

3Boys:

\"A quick check in the heartland revealed that it isn't just the big players that are suffering. If anything, it is the owners of small businesses who seem to be the hardest hit.\"


http://www.soshiok.com/multimedia/photos/1623

Hit by what? High rental?

If we want to save the biz.. why only point to difficulty in hiring as the culprit? Why not point finger at the rental?

Why biz want to ask for govt help in getting workers..

Why cannot ask got govt help to deal with the rental cost?

I see, so the government should subsidise rents with taxpayer's money so that companies can pay higher wages to the same people who pay those taxes?

High-salary, High-tax, High-cost of living environment, a-la Nordic countries.

[3Boys]

WeiHan:

3Boys:

And why is Japan our economic model?

I didn't think sclerosis and decline were so fashionable.

High wages, high cost of living, low growth.......just what we wanted.......

I am not comparing with their economic model. I am just saying that even when we have cheap labor in F&B industry and in addition, even if we assume that Japan model is so much inferior than ours, I am saying that we are losing out in term of food, both in term of quality and price and that is even after we have exploited the cheap labor advantage.

Your baseline assumption is flawed, you divide the cost by the size of the portions to arrive at your comparison. The portion size is not the only driver of costs, labour is a big part too. So if the market in Singapore can stand a $10 bowl of noodles, I think you can get the equivalent or better quality.

Also, please compare apples to apples. Sashimi is an indigenous dish to Japan, they can obviously deliver better quality at lower cost than Singapore. Try getting a plate of chicken rice in Tokyo.....

[WeiHan]

3Boys:

WeiHan:

[quote=\"3Boys\"]

And why is Japan our economic model?

I didn't think sclerosis and decline were so fashionable.

High wages, high cost of living, low growth.......just what we wanted.......

I am not comparing with their economic model. I am just saying that even when we have cheap labor in F&B industry and in addition, even if we assume that Japan model is so much inferior than ours, I am saying that we are losing out in term of food, both in term of quality and price and that is even after we have exploited the cheap labor advantage.

Your baseline assumption is flawed, you divide the cost by the size of the portions to arrive at your comparison. The portion size is not the only driver of costs, labour is a big part too. So if the market in Singapore can stand a $10 bowl of noodles, I think you can get the equivalent or better quality.

Also, please compare apples to apples. Sashimi is an indigenous dish to Japan, they can obviously deliver better quality at lower cost than Singapore. Try getting a plate of chicken rice in Tokyo.....[/quote]There are Japanese restaurant in malls that sell equivalent noodles that I was talking about. The price will be approximately S$15-$18 in these malls in Singapore. In Tokyo which i mentioned above, similar bowl of noodle will cost S$8-S$10.

I love to use Tokyo as a comparison to make the point that food in Singapore is no longer cheap when compare with one of the most expensive Asian city. Don't even need to mention our neighbor north of us.

Talking about chicken rice and the irrelevance of comparing Sashimi,their fried pork rice taste so good and cheap.

I hypothesise that the problem is that no talented people want to take up food businesses in Singapore. one of the reason being that when their business is good, the land lord want to increase the rental. There is no way they beat the game. It is just not worth the effort. It is better to own a property and just rent out for passive profit rather than making money through hard work and creativity.

[limlim]

3Boys:

limlim:

[quote=\"3Boys\"]\"A quick check in the heartland revealed that it isn't just the big players that are suffering. If anything, it is the owners of small businesses who seem to be the hardest hit.\"


http://www.soshiok.com/multimedia/photos/1623

Hit by what? High rental?

If we want to save the biz.. why only point to difficulty in hiring as the culprit? Why not point finger at the rental?

Why biz want to ask for govt help in getting workers..

Why cannot ask got govt help to deal with the rental cost?

I see, so the government should subsidise rents with taxpayer's money so that companies can pay higher wages to the same people who pay those taxes?

High-salary, High-tax, High-cost of living environment, a-la Nordic countries.[/quote]I didn't suggest that.

They can ask workers to bite the bullet.. can't they ask the landlords to bite the bullet? if the biz fold, who is going to rent from them?

[3Boys]

limlim:

3Boys:

I see, so the government should subsidise rents with taxpayer's money so that companies can pay higher wages to the same people who pay those taxes?

High-salary, High-tax, High-cost of living environment, a-la Nordic countries.

I didn't suggest that.

They can ask workers to bite the bullet.. can't they ask the landlords to bite the bullet? if the biz fold, who is going to rent from them?

So what exactly should the government be telling the landlords?

Sink your funds in the property, take all the risk, take all the headache of managing a property, but make lower returns than you can from sticking the money in a bank......