GEP Preparatory Program
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KSmom8:
O Nowadays, most enrichment classes/tuition (e.g. TLL, mindst..../) have GEP materials la. Aiyo, those didn't go for tuition but their parents prep them at home wa (can search a lot of materials nowadays). The same wa. Either the parents can help or you get helps from outside.
Aiyoh! There's a difference between GEP preparatory classes and tuition / enrichment / parental guidance. The former is designed with the aim to get the child into GEP. As for the latter, well, almost all kids have it nowadays, since Pri 1, for various reasons: child is behind peers, parents' / child's kiasuism, schoolteachers' laziness / incompetence, etc.teddy:
Err.. majority GEP kids are doing well la.. As you rightfully pointed out, only a small handful of kids who are struggling with the GE program la
At the end of the day, parental supports (e.g. monetary or direct helps) are crucial to do well in GEP. Some of them are even paying (can dump many thousands) to get someone to write reports or do their perceived useless social studies works
Those kids who did not perform are not getting rigorous supports (no money from parents and their parents can't help la) from parents la..
You are outdated la... majority of the kids have gone for prep classes to make it for GEP program nowadays.. In my dc' school, I have not heard a kid who does not go for tuition/prep/enrichment classes but still make it. Almost 100% of them have attended some kind of \"classes\" de. :yikes: Also, almost all of them has at least 1 SAHP. What does it tell us? :evil:
Aiya, mainstreams are also preparing PSLE in Jul too. Are you saying that MOE should let GEP kids to prepare PSLE earlier than mainstreams?
I know for a fact, that many students in GEP, don't have tuition / enrichment classes before primary 4. Whilst I don't consider them gifted ( I agree, a truly gifted person is rare), they are bright and academically inclined, some have other talents ( musical, artistic, etc ). A child who is \"artificially prepared by GEP prep classes\" for GEP will find it an uphill task to keep up with his GEP peers and with the program, in my opinion.
I also don't see nor hear of any GEP parent doing the child's work or engaging another to do their projects. Parents do offer suggestions / comments, but aren't all parents ( GEP or mainstream ) concerned and more involved nowadays? I believe that the GE kids do the work themselves, which is supported by the many drafts they have to submit to the teacher for their many projects. Wah, if so perfect, why have drafts after drafts, before the final submission? These kids work very hard for their projects and deserve that recognition. (Btw, the GEP kid who is bottom of the school GEP cohort comes from rich family and has many tuition, so performance cannot be due to lack of financial support.)
GEP students START preparation for PSLE in July. Mainstream students start as early as primary 4 or 5. The GE program is focused on projects mainly. The teachers start to fine tune answering techniques for PSLE in July in primary 6. They still have to study for their social studies exam in August. These kids are bright and academically inclined which is why majority do well in PSLE eventhough it's only 3 months of preparation. The not-so-bright have to struggle due to the short preparation time.
I hope that fellow parents reconsider before sending their children to GEP preparatory classes.... It's not the norm...and it might do more damage than good for the child.
I don't know which GEP school that your dc are in but all of us (including many GEP teachers that I had spoken to) knew very well that you can engage someone to do the project. What you have mentioned may be a very rare case le. May be the rich one got someone to help dc in all the projects and learnt nothing at the end and hence can't do well.
Many told me they don't have tuition but still caught them in some of the enrichment classes like TLL..then they said this is not tuition but rather enrichment!!! :faint:
Now, I understand why many GEP kids (<270) can't do well despite the fact that they are better prepared and exposed for PSLE. Some GEP kids scored very well (>270) because they have been doing consistent works since P4-5 like some mainstream students.
Only GEP kids are bright? Give me a break la. Top 20% are bright and academically inclined if they wanted to.
After 4 decades in this world (from east to west and in academics all my life)...1 have only 1 conclusion, those who did well in academics not because they are smart but because they have positive attributes.
If only GEP kids are smart, how to explain those late boomers during my time but still can excel eventually in academics and overtaking those early boomers (aka GEP kids).
Anyway, from then to now, no change in pattern too... I knew many GEP kids were faded away eventually in Secondary and JC la..very sad but this is the fact. :censored: -
Thank you for substantiating my point. GEP is only the start of the education journey...it's only primary school! There are opportunities for all, not just the top 1% or top 20%, but even the bottom 10%, to do well in their studies and in life. Yes, the correct attitude and other positive attributes will get a person far in life. So why do parents feel this need to send their kids for GEP prep classes? I mentioned the few who struggle in GEP as an example and to show a different perspective. I do believe that if these kids had stayed in mainstream, they would be happier, have higher self esteem, and perhaps a higher t-score in PSLE and get into their secondary school of choice.
I suppose if there's a willing buyer, there's always a willing seller. I suppose that one can pay another to do a child's project. But I do believe that this is very rare, if it has happened at all. Surely, the teachers, including the many GEP teachers you have spoken to, are alert enough to distinguish the difference in standard of work for projects and those done in class? Don't these teachers have a duty to report and investigate? Why have we not heard news of this?
I think that as parents and teachers, including those in academics, we should give credit where it is due. The kids have worked hard for their projects....all the research...brainstorming...doing many drafts under their teacher's guidance before final submission. Question them and you'll find that they can substantiate their source of information and discuss points with you. The teachers are not stupid nor sleeping on job, surely they can tell and check if the project is the child's work???
For your information: I don't think the \"rich one\" paid for someone to do child's project, otherwise, would have a better grade for project work.
I still stand by what I said, i know of many GEP kids who don't have tuition / enrichment before primary 4. However, I do know of some who have tuition / enrichment after they join GEP. Why? Parents' / kids' kiasuism, schoolteachers' incompetences / ineffectiveness, etc. I suppose each would have their own reason.
And ahem, where did I say that ONLY GE kids are bright? Have been reading and reading and cannot find... :shock:
The focus of GEP is not the PSLE. GE kids are not better prepared nor exposed for PSLE compared to other children. A lot of time is spent stretching them in other aspects. What does analysing stories, writing stories and poems, discussions on various social issues, on mathematical theorems, on scientific theories, etc, have to do with PSLE? A fair amount of what is done in GEP is not tested in PSLE. -
I agree that children should not go for GEP prep classes and that the people offering such courses are doing a disservice to the parents and the children who attend such courses. It is sad to see such parents and children exploited. Yes I say exploited for profit. Regrettably parents who send their children for such classes are usually none the wiser and do not understand what the GEP program is about.
Having my children go through and still going through the GEP program from my personal POV it is to offer different sorts of challenges to children who have been identified early as academically bright. There will always be late bloomers and for them the mainstream is fine as they are bright enough to do well without really losing out as they usually will shine at the ‘O’ levels, ‘N’ levels, Poly, JC or eventually the Uni.
The issue in this forum is whether the GEP classes are useful or whether it may actually mislead the parents and children as to their natural ability. Being in the GEP gives additional opportunities that mái streamers do not get. The many projects done are completely irrelevant to the PSLE yet much time and effort is required. This same time is used by mainstreamers to study, reinforce and strengthen their weak areas.
So it makes sense that if a child shows academic ability early such a child should not be made to study at the pace of the average or late bloomer and correspondingly the average or late bloomers should not be forced artificially to study at the pace of the child who shows early academic ability.
The GEP is not a magic bullet to solve the difficulties of dealing with the pressures and expectations of the PSLE. It is not designed for that and parents should be given enough information and should not be tempted by "all-knowing" enrichment and tuition centers to simply hope that their child if an average or late bloomer can and will exploit the benefits of the GEP if they attend such prep classes. Therein lies the exploitation of ignorant but well-meaning and anxious parents. Each parent must make the effort to know their child and then to understand if the GEP fits the personality and needs of the child. Such parents should not play "tikam" with their child’s educational development. -
The way I see it, GEP is the 'enrichment' class.
PSLE is the goal and it make sense to stay tuned to mainstream syllabus even if kids are in GEP.
One of the ways to do this is through mainstream tuition. Not that they need tuition to help in GEP syllabus but more so to stay in tune with PSLE format & syllabus.
Instead of spending 30 hours per week studying mainstream syllabus (5 days x 6 hours daily) which most likely will not stretched these kids, gep kids can replicate their study of mainstream/psle syllabus over 6 to 8 hours (assuming 2 hours weekly tuition for 3 to 4 mainstream subjects).
Hence, the weekly 30 hours of gep syllabus during school hour is in fact extended hours 'enrichment' class to keep them engaged and challenged them so they are stretching themselves more.
They don't need to spend so much time studying mainstream syllabus anyway so weekly 6 to 8 hours to stay tune is sufficient. -
Just relax:
:goodpost: :goodpost: :goodpost:I agree that children should not go for GEP prep classes and that the people offering such courses are doing a disservice to the parents and the children who attend such courses. It is sad to see such parents and children exploited. Yes I say exploited for profit. Regrettably parents who send their children for such classes are usually none the wiser and do not understand what the GEP program is about.
Having my children go through and still going through the GEP program from my personal POV it is to offer different sorts of challenges to children who have been identified early as academically bright. There will always be late bloomers and for them the mainstream is fine as they are bright enough to do well without really losing out as they usually will shine at the 'O' levels, 'N' levels, Poly, JC or eventually the Uni.
The issue in this forum is whether the GEP classes are useful or whether it may actually mislead the parents and children as to their natural ability. Being in the GEP gives additional opportunities that mái streamers do not get. The many projects done are completely irrelevant to the PSLE yet much time and effort is required. This same time is used by mainstreamers to study, reinforce and strengthen their weak areas.
So it makes sense that if a child shows academic ability early such a child should not be made to study at the pace of the average or late bloomer and correspondingly the average or late bloomers should not be forced artificially to study at the pace of the child who shows early academic ability.
The GEP is not a magic bullet to solve the difficulties of dealing with the pressures and expectations of the PSLE. It is not designed for that and parents should be given enough information and should not be tempted by \"all-knowing\" enrichment and tuition centers to simply hope that their child if an average or late bloomer can and will exploit the benefits of the GEP if they attend such prep classes. Therein lies the exploitation of ignorant but well-meaning and anxious parents. Each parent must make the effort to know their child and then to understand if the GEP fits the personality and needs of the child. Such parents should not play \"tikam\" with their child's educational development. -
sleepy:
The way I see it, GEP is the 'enrichment' class.
PSLE is the goal and it make sense to stay tuned to mainstream syllabus even if kids are in GEP.
One of the ways to do this is through mainstream tuition. Not that they need tuition to help in GEP syllabus but more so to stay in tune with PSLE format & syllabus.
Instead of spending 30 hours per week studying mainstream syllabus (5 days x 6 hours daily) which most likely will not stretched these kids, gep kids can replicate their study of mainstream/psle syllabus over 6 to 8 hours (assuming 2 hours weekly tuition for 3 to 4 mainstream subjects).
Hence, the weekly 30 hours of gep syllabus during school hour is in fact extended hours 'enrichment' class to keep them engaged and challenged them so they are stretching themselves more.
They don't need to spend so much time studying mainstream syllabus anyway so weekly 6 to 8 hours to stay tune is sufficient.
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KSmom8:
GEP teachers told me that they have to treat it as their works and mark accordingly... They can't do anything.Thank you for substantiating my point. GEP is only the start of the education journey...it's only primary school! There are opportunities for all, not just the top 1% or top 20%, but even the bottom 10%, to do well in their studies and in life. Yes, the correct attitude and other positive attributes will get a person far in life. So why do parents feel this need to send their kids for GEP prep classes? I mentioned the few who struggle in GEP as an example and to show a different perspective. I do believe that if these kids had stayed in mainstream, they would be happier, have higher self esteem, and perhaps a higher t-score in PSLE and get into their secondary school of choice.
I suppose if there's a willing buyer, there's always a willing seller. I suppose that one can pay another to do a child's project. But I do believe that this is very rare, if it has happened at all. Surely, the teachers, including the many GEP teachers you have spoken to, are alert enough to distinguish the difference in standard of work for projects and those done in class? Don't these teachers have a duty to report and investigate? Why have we not heard news of this?
I think that as parents and teachers, including those in academics, we should give credit where it is due. The kids have worked hard for their projects....all the research...brainstorming...doing many drafts under their teacher's guidance before final submission. Question them and you'll find that they can substantiate their source of information and discuss points with you. The teachers are not stupid nor sleeping on job, surely they can tell and check if the project is the child's work???
For your information: I don't think the \"rich one\" paid for someone to do child's project, otherwise, would have a better grade for project work.
I still stand by what I said, i know of many GEP kids who don't have tuition / enrichment before primary 4. However, I do know of some who have tuition / enrichment after they join GEP. Why? Parents' / kids' kiasuism, schoolteachers' incompetences / ineffectiveness, etc. I suppose each would have their own reason.
And ahem, where did I say that ONLY GE kids are bright? Have been reading and reading and cannot find... :shock:
The focus of GEP is not the PSLE. GE kids are not better prepared nor exposed for PSLE compared to other children. A lot of time is spent stretching them in other aspects. What does analysing stories, writing stories and poems, discussions on various social issues, on mathematical theorems, on scientific theories, etc, have to do with PSLE? A fair amount of what is done in GEP is not tested in PSLE. Anyway, they will do well in the project components.
You missed the point. I did not substantiate your point.
In fact, during the time when I was schooling, there are opportunities for all because there were not have all kinds of funny schemes like GEP/DSA/IP/etc, not just the top 1% or top 20%, but even the bottom 10%, to do well in their studies and in life!! BUT not for now anymore with all these funny schemes now!!!
That's why everyone has gone crazy to pump their kids such that their kids can make it for GEP program and enjoy all the BENEFITS. IT is no longer level playing field.
In fact, majority kids are being pumped one way or another to reach the top 1% la. Hence, I neither encourage nor discourage anyone to enrich/prep their kids since the system is set up in this way to benefit those kids. So, if their kids can make it? why not? Afterall, schools do make a difference! You got into good schools, you are better prepared for exams and exposed to many attractive programs!
I won't even say all of them are academically gifted since only English and Maths are tested for selection. Many researches already proved that IQ tests are not a good guide anyway. The ability/intellectual level of a kids can't be just determined by these English and Maths!!! You didn't say only GEP kids are bright, I was just trying to tell you that not just gep kids are bright, many mainstreams' kids are bright too. I knew that many of GEP kids didn't do well because their parents can't help them and hence they suffered in GEP program though they were selected.
It is not up to you to believe or not. what I said is the fact: some \"rich one\" paid for someone to do child's project, hence, they have a better grade for project work. Those in rich GEP schools knew this very well!!
I have to stress one more time that, those who didn't go for tuition/enrichment/etc, they are prep by their own parents at home one way and another since parents can find all sort of materials for their kids.
your quote\"A lot of time is spent stretching them in other aspects. What does analysing stories, writing stories and poems, discussions on various social issues, on mathematical theorems, on scientific theories, etc, have to do with PSLE?\" -- exactly all these are done in GEP prepared them better for PSLE. Do you know that PSLE have many questions that required you to have all these training/exposure/exercises to do well?
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Just relax:
What is natural ability? Sadly, up to now, there is no a foolproof scheme to identify natural ability? certainly not by only English and Maths and high ability papers. If a kid can be trained/hot-housed to be selected, what make you think they don't have natural ability?I agree that children should not go for GEP prep classes and that the people offering such courses are doing a disservice to the parents and the children who attend such courses. It is sad to see such parents and children exploited. Yes I say exploited for profit. Regrettably parents who send their children for such classes are usually none the wiser and do not understand what the GEP program is about.
Having my children go through and still going through the GEP program from my personal POV it is to offer different sorts of challenges to children who have been identified early as academically bright. There will always be late bloomers and for them the mainstream is fine as they are bright enough to do well without really losing out as they usually will shine at the 'O' levels, 'N' levels, Poly, JC or eventually the Uni.
The issue in this forum is whether the GEP classes are useful or whether it may actually mislead the parents and children as to their natural ability. Being in the GEP gives additional opportunities that mái streamers do not get. The many projects done are completely irrelevant to the PSLE yet much time and effort is required. This same time is used by mainstreamers to study, reinforce and strengthen their weak areas.
So it makes sense that if a child shows academic ability early such a child should not be made to study at the pace of the average or late bloomer and correspondingly the average or late bloomers should not be forced artificially to study at the pace of the child who shows early academic ability.
The GEP is not a magic bullet to solve the difficulties of dealing with the pressures and expectations of the PSLE. It is not designed for that and parents should be given enough information and should not be tempted by \"all-knowing\" enrichment and tuition centers to simply hope that their child if an average or late bloomer can and will exploit the benefits of the GEP if they attend such prep classes. Therein lies the exploitation of ignorant but well-meaning and anxious parents. Each parent must make the effort to know their child and then to understand if the GEP fits the personality and needs of the child. Such parents should not play \"tikam\" with their child's educational development.
If really does not want many parents to exploit the system, then scrape those schemes to drive well-meaning and anxious parents nuts. -
To prep or not to prep .... let each parents decide. The important thing is let the child enjoy the learning PROCESS.
With or without GEP, will not guarantee success in life.
If we want success in our children's life ... play our part as parents to coach them and let God takes over.
Noble Group (SGX listed company) once said in an interview that >50% of deals are \"incidental\" deals (not pre-planned). It is about being at the right place at the right time and all conditions were right and the deal is closed.
It can be best said by this quote from an ancient book:
\"I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but TIME and CHANCE happeneth to them all.\" -
Trapwithin:
We can preach all we want but if these parents already set their minds on getting their children into GEP, all this preaching matters little.To prep or not to prep .... let each parents decide. The important thing is let the child enjoy the learning PROCESS.
With or without GEP, will not guarantee success in life.
If we want success in our children's life ... play our part as parents to coach them and let God takes over.
Noble Group (SGX listed company) once said in an interview that >50% of deals are \"incidental\" deals (not pre-planned). It is about being at the right place at the right time and all conditions were right and the deal is closed.
It can be best said by this quote from an ancient book:
\"I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but TIME and CHANCE happeneth to them all.\"
Same same if people donch believe in this ancient book, no one will care about the quotation.
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