Punggol East By-Election coming ? MP steps down
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you get it, I am saying that there is no basis to support what pirate said. It seems more like we are seeing HDB flats transacting at close to a million $ & hence people think private at $1.5m is still very cheap. there are 7 cooling measures targeted at private & none for Citizens' HDB flats, may be govt targeted wrong segment & hence policy ineffective? But then again, probably they have fear of incurring anger for targeting the HDB? Have they become so soft & do what is popular to majority rather do what is needed?
Moonsun55:
It is easy to just quote such example but what likelihood is such scenario going to happen? We know very well that likelihood of your example happening is almost zero. you forgot that given that there are 80% HDB & 20 privat properties, there are 4 fighting for 1 private so by virtue of economic theory, private to HDB prices should be 4:1 (hypothetically).
Moonsun55:
Why private drop HDB will drop? I don't understand & can't see any logic. can explain?
pirate:
If 1,300 sf HDB flat cost $500k and 1,300 sf private condo in the same area also cost $500k, which one will you buy?
3Boys:
Errr......no. There is basis in economics for your example. It's like saying that a Lamborghini should cost 100,000 times more than a Honda.
pirate is saying HDB property prices are capped by private prices, and if you bring down private property prices, HDB prices 'should' follow. It's not a 100% correlation, but its there. -
Moonsun55:
you get it, I am saying that there is no basis to support what pirate said. It seems more like we are seeing HDB flats transacting at close to a million $ & hence people think private at $1.5m is still very cheap. there are 7 cooling measures targeted at private & none for Citizens' HDB flats, may be govt targeted wrong segment & hence policy ineffective? But then again, probably they have fear of incurring anger for targeting the HDB? Have they become so soft & do what is popular to majority rather do what is needed?
Moonsun55:
It is easy to just quote such example but what likelihood is such scenario going to happen? We know very well that likelihood of your example happening is almost zero. you forgot that given that there are 80% HDB & 20 privat properties, there are 4 fighting for 1 private so by virtue of economic theory, private to HDB prices should be 4:1 (hypothetically).
[quote=\"Moonsun55\"]Why private drop HDB will drop? I don't understand & can't see any logic. can explain?pirate:
If 1,300 sf HDB flat cost $500k and 1,300 sf private condo in the same area also cost $500k, which one will you buy?
3Boys:
[/quote]Ok, I get you.Errr......no. There is basis in economics for your example. It's like saying that a Lamborghini should cost 100,000 times more than a Honda.
pirate is saying HDB property prices are capped by private prices, and if you bring down private property prices, HDB prices 'should' follow. It's not a 100% correlation, but its there. -
toddles:
Anyone read Colin Tan's commentary in TODAY? \"Premature to dismiss housing market\"
Everytime I read news articles (under the guise of \"commentaries\") on the ppty market by real estate folks, it's just so blatantly obvious that they are trying to buoy/talk the market up! E.g. oh there is genuine demand, these cooling measures will have no effect, ppty market still heading up up up! :siao:
Totally self-interested! Wonder why they continually get published. Should be classified with Big Bold Header as \"ADVERTORIAL\".
Tragedy is that the man on the street might actually lend credence to their words when what they're saying is totally self serving.
Of COURSE he'll say that lah. He's working for a real estate consultancy, and it's to their interest to keep the market rocketing, no? -
Moonsun55:
you get it, I am saying that there is no basis to support what pirate said. It seems more like we are seeing HDB flats transacting at close to a million $ & hence people think private at $1.5m is still very cheap. there are 7 cooling measures targeted at private & none for Citizens' HDB flats, may be govt targeted wrong segment & hence policy ineffective? But then again, probably they have fear of incurring anger for targeting the HDB? Have they become so soft & do what is popular to majority rather do what is needed?
Since you put it this way, yah you are right. To keep HDB flats affordable, the government must target HDB flats, which the Minister has just said they have been doing since 2011 by keeping BTO prices stable instead of referencing resale prices and by increasing BTO supply.
But the market for private properties does have an effect on the HDB resale market, by driving buyer sentiments. Nobody would be chasing ever higher COV if the private property market is collapsing.
It is therefore important for the Minister to assure Singaporeans that BTO prices are somehow correlated to income and not to market sentiment. Yah, I know he does not want to say 'peg to median household income' because that's what the WP said so cannot agree right?
HDB's previous policy of pricing BTO flats by referring to resale prices is actually letting the tail wag the dog. -
pirate:
good points. bto, as basic public housing, should keep pace with income, rather than inflation and private housing market forces.
It is therefore important for the Minister to assure Singaporeans that BTO prices are somehow correlated to income and not to market sentiment. Yah, I know he does not want to say 'peg to median household income' because that's what the WP said so cannot agree right?
HDB's previous policy of pricing BTO flats by referring to resale prices is actually letting the tail wag the dog. -
The difficulty is that Govt. has allowed the impression that you can continually upgrade although u should start small with a 3room flat. The problem with upgrading is that as the flats to upgrade to are in the resale market and seem to track pte prop. prices so boh pian current house must try and sell at much higher price or else cannot upgrade. So every owner thinks that way and the house price mechanism becomes a self-fulfilling and self-perpetuating monster.
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Just relax:
The difficulty is that Govt. has allowed the impression that you can continually upgrade although u should start small with a 3room flat. The problem with upgrading is that as the flats to upgrade to are in the resale market and seem to track pte prop. prices so boh pian current house must try and sell at much higher price or else cannot upgrade. So every owner thinks that way and the house price mechanism becomes a self-fulfilling and self-perpetuating monster.
So maybe one solution is to allow people to trade in their 3-room to the HDB, and top up $x for a BTO 4 or 5-room? HDB can then release that 3-room again to somebody else, whether as a rental or sale of balance flats unit? Working out what that $x is could be a problem, but I suppose it is not unsolvable. Whether that will dry up the supply of 3-room flats in the resale market is another question. -
What you said has truth as supported by below ST letter about taking almost 6 years before their HDB flats TOP vs 2-3 years for private & yet HDB flats are stacked up structure & should be faster!
Even newer BTO HDB flats still need 3-4 years!
http://www.straitstimes.com/premium/...jects-20130202
Straits Times Forum
Published on Feb 02, 2013
Speed up work on older BTO projects
THE Government encourages married couples to have babies. My husband and I do want to have children, but we cannot do so at the moment because we have no home to call our own.
I have been married for more than three years, and all this while, I have been living with my in-laws.
My husband and I do not plan to have children yet because of space constraints in my in-laws' home.
We applied for a Build-to-Order (BTO) project, SkyVille@Dawson, in December 2009.
The Government has said that more affordable new housing would be provided with shorter waiting times (\"Buying HDB flats: Easier, more affordable\"; March 4, 2011). But this is not the case for older projects that were launched before the announcement.
The estimated completion date of our BTO flat is between the third quarter of 2015 and 2016.
If we were to wait till then, we would have been married for six years before we can start thinking about having children.
By then, it would be harder for us to conceive because of our age.
I urge the Government to speed up older BTO projects such as Skyville@Dawson to help couples like us start families earlier.
Jaslin Huang (Ms)JannettLee:
Indeed, I am actually the one that have thought so deeply about the largest picture, apparently much more so than the govt, that is why I know that they should instead be focusing on solving the over-priced HDB flats problems that affects majority of Singaporeans by:
1) Make new HDB flats cheap
2) Make new HDB flats available quickly within 1-1.5 years
3) Make resale HDB flats cheap, by re-instating a previous policy where people buying private properties must sell their HDB flats within 6 months.
4) Ban all rental of HDB flats. Owners must stay in the HDB flats.
I believe the above would be welcomed by majority of singaporeans looking for affordable housing both in terms of new HDB flats and resale HDB flats. Public properties are heavily subsidized by govt and hence should be reserved for residents' own consumption, and not to milk for profit via rental. -
yet i recall one report where the married kids moved back to their parents house because they needed someone to mind their babies and rented out their own hdb flats. i recall being impressed by so many pp squeezing in one flat.
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Not necessary to stay with in-laws. HDB actually provides married couples who are waiting for HDB a rental apartment. They can rent as long as they got the key and renovated the new apt. Why not making use of HDB’s consideration.
We booked in 1996 got only in 2001 also waited for 5 yrs what. Actually we started to book in 1994, along the way change location, penalty 1 year. Again change the apt size, penalty again. We learnt through thick and thin together as a young couple.
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