Are you ready for 7 million people on tiny Singapore?

[3Boys]

Dreamaurora:

Obviously any planned policies will not be able to get 100% approval from all citizens. Becoming totally populist is also bad for economy as we have seen from the example of welfare countries in Europe.

However, setting national policies is not similar to setting company policies. In a company, your employees have to follow whatever policies you set even if they have no say in it. And if they refuse to follow it, you can always fire them. But a democratic country such as Singapore is not like a company. If the citizens are unhappy emotionally, they can always vote the government out. I know some people think that a lot of local citizens are easily swayed emotionally and are unable to see the big picture. But seriously, when they experience unhappiness and discomfort caused by flawed execution of policies already in motion, do we really expect them to be able to trust whatever the government has planned and that their interests are still looked after?

The citizens have no moral obligations to vote PAP in the next round of elections, and the current sentiments are slowly tipping towards the oppositions. Yes, the solutions WP propose maybe made without full knowledge of how our economy actually works and may be not feasible. But they echo the ground sentiments and resonate with what people actually want. Even if some posters here choose to believe that WP is 'making mockery of their supporters', but they are ticking all the right points in advancing their causes politically.

If voters react emotionally to policies, at some point, they will get a government that panders only to emotions.

I've always said I fear the opposition supporters more than I fear the opposition parties.

Don't worry, you may get your wish soon.

[Just relax]

I think the Singapore electorate despite all the grumblings also realises that Singapore is among the most vulnerable countries in ASEAN simply by reason of having nothing but its people and good government to keep the country going.


Being a realistic and practical bunch, the grumblings is to alert the Govt. to the fact that not all of its policies are working or working effectively and to that end the Govt. being a political creation which needs to answer to the electorate every 5 years will take the necesssary corrective measures otherwise more of its MPs will be voted out.

The opposition is at a disadvantage as it does not really know what are the challenges the Govt. is facing and can only respond to what the opposition sees before it including the reaction of the citizens.

But LTK is also wise enough to know that it makes no sense to vote the PAP out of power at a time when there is insufficient opposition members of calibre who can provide policy ideas and lead the Govt.

The WP of all the opposition parties has the best chance at this time of providing some concrete and useful ideas to the Govt. because of its own experience of running its town councils including the difficulty of getting Singaporeans to do many of the low paying manual jobs in the town council as well as seeing how its constituents react to the FTs in the midst of their own constituencies.

The other opposition parties must step up with their own ideas of how to deal with the various problems as set out in the White Paper but it cannot just be motherhood statements or airy fairy hopes and aspirations of a good quality of life, better work-life balance etc.

There must be concrete proposals as to what must change now in a concrete way that will lead for example to an increase in the TFR or what must companies be encouraged to do in order for working mothers to have more children and yet not feel that their careers will be sidetracked. I am no longer interested in the same feel good statements that all opposition parties make that they are to provide an alternative voice etc. If the alternative voices are just noise then i can do without such alternative voices.

As for some opposition parties preaching greater human rights and democracy, all i say is thank you very much, next opposition party please.

[WeiHan]

Just relax:

As for some opposition parties preaching greater human rights and democracy, all i say is thank you very much, next opposition party please.

How can it be unrelated? Many advances follow in the west only after democracy was invented. How the mind thinks affect creativity and solutions for problems and it is partly molded by social circumstances etc...

I'll say that if we we have many creative people that invent and create competitive products that sell to the whole world, many of the problems can be solved. Our problem is partly that we are so beholden to the MNCs, more than Taiwan, Korea etc...

[limlim]

JannettLee:

Benefits of good growth of GDP are not cascaded down to many Singaporean but everyone got hit by the high costs of living/inflation.

Exactly!

[dorisp]

Just relax:

There must be concrete proposals as to what must change now in a concrete way that will lead for example to an increase in the TFR or what must companies be encouraged to do in order for working mothers to have more children and yet not feel that their careers will be sidetracked. I am no longer interested in the same feel good statements that all opposition parties make that they are to provide an alternative voice etc. If the alternative voices are just noise then i can do without such alternative voices.

Agree. It is easy to \"slap\" or criticize what you didn't like but how often are the alternate suggestions stronger and more effective than the first one.

Still anticipating.....


:skeptical:

[sleepy]

If there’s an election tomorrow, PAP will surely lose. Voters are of course emotional since day in day out they are feeling the squeeze and high cost of living.


But the election is 3 years down the road. So maybe the announcement of white paper is well timed because PAP has 3 years to redeem themselves.

If voters are convinced over the next 3 years that this decision is indeed for the greater good of future Singaporeans and infractructure can be improved & cost of living becoming more manageable, then majority will still stick with PAP.

[Just relax]

WeiHan:

Just relax:

As for some opposition parties preaching greater human rights and democracy, all i say is thank you very much, next opposition party please.

How can it be unrelated? Many advances follow in the west only after democracy was invented. How the mind thinks affect creativity and solutions for problems and it is partly molded by social circumstances etc...

I'll say that if we we have many creative people that invent and create competitive products that sell to the whole world, many of the problems can be solved. Our problem is partly that we are so beholden to the MNCs, more than Taiwan, Korea etc...

It is very strange to equate creativity or inventiveness to democracy. Just to debunk your statement, look at North Korea, one of the most repressive regimes in the world is on the verge of producing nuclear materials and has produced ballistic missiles, both of which involve very advanced sciences and great creativity especially when that country has no access to the advanced technologies of the West. Iran another repressive regime has made so many technological advances in its nuclear program despite crippling sanctions. That required creativity. Look at China, a communist state that has produced many technological advances despite not having democracy.

In any event apart from a \"western\" democracy being irrelevant to creativity, which really depends on individuals and their innate creativity and the coming together of various different expertise, why would anyone equate voting for the opposition as allowing for greater creativity :?

[Dreamaurora]

3Boys:

Dreamaurora:

Obviously any planned policies will not be able to get 100% approval from all citizens. Becoming totally populist is also bad for economy as we have seen from the example of welfare countries in Europe.

However, setting national policies is not similar to setting company policies. In a company, your employees have to follow whatever policies you set even if they have no say in it. And if they refuse to follow it, you can always fire them. But a democratic country such as Singapore is not like a company. If the citizens are unhappy emotionally, they can always vote the government out. I know some people think that a lot of local citizens are easily swayed emotionally and are unable to see the big picture. But seriously, when they experience unhappiness and discomfort caused by flawed execution of policies already in motion, do we really expect them to be able to trust whatever the government has planned and that their interests are still looked after?

The citizens have no moral obligations to vote PAP in the next round of elections, and the current sentiments are slowly tipping towards the oppositions. Yes, the solutions WP propose maybe made without full knowledge of how our economy actually works and may be not feasible. But they echo the ground sentiments and resonate with what people actually want. Even if some posters here choose to believe that WP is 'making mockery of their supporters', but they are ticking all the right points in advancing their causes politically.

If voters react emotionally to policies, at some point, they will get a government that panders only to emotions.

I've always said I fear the opposition supporters more than I fear the opposition parties.

Don't worry, you may get your wish soon.

Personally I don't think any opposition parties including WP will be able to groom enough quality candidates to form a strong parliament by the next election. So I think at least for this decade it would be better for PAP to be still in power but with WP securing slightly more seats to provide strong alternative voice in parliament.

I think recent PE by-election has demonstrated that empty rhetoric do not sit well with most voters. Voters would still want someone who is in touch with the ground and present him/herself well. WP won because it has laid sufficient groundwork and well, LLL is the most likable out of all candidates. If voters are so easily swayed emotionally, they would have voted for DL or KJ instead. But I do not deny that emotion do play part in tipping the balance towards WP victory.

I agree with you that some opposition supporters can be very irrational, delusional, and not open to any views other than their supported parties, but those are probably in the minority now. My wife just said to me today she noticed that her facebook friends' reaction towards this White Paper is pretty strong, and these are your regular citizens without any affiliation towards any political party.

I don't think I will see PAP becoming an opposition party anytime soon, but I hope the recent setbacks is enough to effect a change inside the party.

[Dreamaurora]

Just relax:

WeiHan:

[quote=\"Just relax\"]

As for some opposition parties preaching greater human rights and democracy, all i say is thank you very much, next opposition party please.

How can it be unrelated? Many advances follow in the west only after democracy was invented. How the mind thinks affect creativity and solutions for problems and it is partly molded by social circumstances etc...

I'll say that if we we have many creative people that invent and create competitive products that sell to the whole world, many of the problems can be solved. Our problem is partly that we are so beholden to the MNCs, more than Taiwan, Korea etc...

It is very strange to equate creativity or inventiveness to democracy. Just to debunk your statement, look at North Korea, one of the most repressive regimes in the world is on the verge of producing nuclear materials and has produced ballistic missiles, both of which involve very advanced sciences and great creativity especially when that country has no access to the advanced technologies of the West. Iran another repressive regime has made so many technological advances in its nuclear program despite crippling sanctions. That required creativity. Look at China, a communist state that has produced many technological advances despite not having democracy.

In any event apart from a \"western\" democracy being irrelevant to creativity, which really depends on individuals and their innate creativity and the coming together of various different expertise, why would anyone equate voting for the opposition as allowing for greater creativity :?[/quote]Hmm, you are assuming that these repressive regimes invent these technologies by themselves. Have you considered the possibilities that they may have acquired these technologies through espionage or black market? China is well known to acquire technologies from the West and reverse engineer them, so are they actually creative?

[WeiHan]

Just relax:

It is very strange to equate creativity or inventiveness to democracy. Just to debunk your statement, look at North Korea, one of the most repressive regimes in the world is on the verge of producing nuclear materials and has produced ballistic missiles, both of which involve very advanced sciences and great creativity especially when that country has no access to the advanced technologies of the West. Iran another repressive regime has made so many technological advances in its nuclear program despite crippling sanctions. That required creativity. Look at China, a communist state that has produced many technological advances despite not having democracy.

In any event apart from a \"western\" democracy being irrelevant to creativity, which really depends on individuals and their innate creativity and the coming together of various different expertise, why would anyone equate voting for the opposition as allowing for greater creativity :?

Firstly, I did not equate voting for opposition as allowing for greater creativity. You get me wrong. What I meant was a more open social atmosphere.

All advances in the west did not come about during the dark age when people and idea was oppressed. Note that I am NOT (edited, I don't know why the word not isn't in there although I thought I have checked that it was there) saying that we are oppressed under PAP and need an opposition party.

As for the three examples of North Korea, Iran and China you quoted above. North Korea and Iran has part of the technology from former soviet scientists. China hasn't has alot of technological advances relative to an economy size that we should expected. Even the space technology has critical component technologies that they somehow gotten from German chinese scientists that have worked in Germany for many years. many of their \"advances\" violate copyrights. Besides, one or two technological pinnacle is not sufficient to prove that widespread creativity is present in their society. Alots of creativity including areas of technologies, management, business practice is required to lift the living standard of people once a saturation is reached.