Real reason behind Singapore’s obsession with tuition
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Hi hokkiengirl,
Thanks for the clarifications and I agree with you about the importance of a good fit. -
hokkiengirl:
Nope, I definitely did not say that the IP and schools are hopeless. In fact, I said that most, if not all, have good programmes. Do they stretch the kids? Yes. Do they encourage thinking out of the box? Yes. Do kids learn more intensively and in greater depth and breadth? Yes. That is the ideal situation that happens for many kids who are SUITABLE for IP to begin with.verykiasu2010:
if the IP program and IP schools are so hopeless and useless, why then year after year the few IP schools produce the most number of A level distinctions in H2 and H3 subjects as well as getting the lion's share of all scholarships for uni courses ?
MOE states that IP school / program is meant for those who are clearly uni bound, by whichever route. The idea is to save time from O level preparation to do more meaningful stuff for the kids. It does not mean IP is lower standard or less rigourous
My point is that parents must know their children and make careful choices for them before enrolling them into the IP stream. This is because it truly IS for the brightest and cream of the crop in terms of expectations and work set. Do a great many end up with scholarships and doing very well? Yes, they do. This is because they really are very bright and motivated and the IP is a great fit for their independent learning styles and inquisitive attitudes. I am talking about the group which does not fare as well because they are not as disciplined (perhaps) or may not be able to adapt to such a 'free' and ''open' style of education. There are those kids around, you know. The ones who do much better in structured environments because of their learning styles. And there are the kids who need the 'wake-up call' of not-so-good O-level results to spur them on to reach their full potential.
I have not only 'interacted' with IP students; I have taught them for in IP schools, NOT merely at tuition centres. So I have formed my opinion based on what I have seen and experienced over the years.
Maybe I gave the impression that the IP is less rigorous. If so, I do apologise. That was not what I meant. My point was that there are kids in IP who just manage a pass every year. They are not doing badly enough to get asked to leave, but they are not thriving either. And schools of course do not want to come across as heavy-handed and high-handed by suggesting that these borderline cases should change course too early on. So what happens is that those who get a lot out of the programme excel, whereas there is a group that just barely makes it. Even if the programme is wonderful, there will be those who will not be able to get a great deal of benefit of it. Nothing wrong with the programme. Not always a question of laziness. Usually an issue of a GOOD FIT.
:goodpost: :thankyou:
Very insightful info from the experienced IP teacher/tutor! Thank you -
jtoh:
Hi, jtoh. No prob. To fully round up the discussion, let me say that the IP kids tend to leave the programme more willing to stand up and speak and are generally a confident bunch. They are fond of witty repartee and know how to present themselves well. They usually do brilliantly for PW. And the IP is customised to stretch learners. We were teaching them stuff that we only got to learn in Uni. So there is definitely a lot of good stuff going on there. Just not for every kid who qualifies. Phew. All this qualification is tiring.Hi hokkiengirl,
Thanks for the clarifications and I agree with you about the importance of a good fit.
Thanks, Chen, for helping me with clarifications, too! -
verykiasu2010:
On learning that your are retired, besides being able to tell fortune, my foot is also laughing.
you are so laughable !
trying so hard to slam me again ? FYI, I have never worked as civil servant although I am very civil. I am retired, by the way.
I was very clear in my writing from the outset. You did not read it properly and just went ahead to slam me ...... got errors now trying so hard to extricate yourself and say I am 'crafty' ? muahahahah, thanks for the compliments, though
We react differently to type of people. After learning that a snake is dangerous, we handle them with caution. In case you have forgotten our last sparring, attached is the thread
http://www.kiasuparents.com/kiasu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=6459&start=930
What you have posted you may have forgotten but others may remember. I am so free because I am really retired. -
hokkiengirl:
hello, thanks for the clarity on the matter discussed.
Nope, I definitely did not say that the IP and schools are hopeless. In fact, I said that most, if not all, have good programmes. Do they stretch the kids? Yes. Do they encourage thinking out of the box? Yes. Do kids learn more intensively and in greater depth and breadth? Yes. That is the ideal situation that happens for many kids who are SUITABLE for IP to begin with.verykiasu2010:
if the IP program and IP schools are so hopeless and useless, why then year after year the few IP schools produce the most number of A level distinctions in H2 and H3 subjects as well as getting the lion's share of all scholarships for uni courses ?
MOE states that IP school / program is meant for those who are clearly uni bound, by whichever route. The idea is to save time from O level preparation to do more meaningful stuff for the kids. It does not mean IP is lower standard or less rigourous
My point is that parents must know their children and make careful choices for them before enrolling them into the IP stream. This is because it truly IS for the brightest and cream of the crop in terms of expectations and work set. Do a great many end up with scholarships and doing very well? Yes, they do. This is because they really are very bright and motivated and the IP is a great fit for their independent learning styles and inquisitive attitudes. I am talking about the group which does not fare as well because they are not as disciplined (perhaps) or may not be able to adapt to such a 'free' and ''open' style of education. There are those kids around, you know. The ones who do much better in structured environments because of their learning styles. And there are the kids who need the 'wake-up call' of not-so-good O-level results to spur them on to reach their full potential.
I have not only 'interacted' with IP students; I have taught them for in IP schools, NOT merely at tuition centres. So I have formed my opinion based on what I have seen and experienced over the years.
Maybe I gave the impression that the IP is less rigorous. If so, I do apologise. That was not what I meant. My point was that there are kids in IP who just manage a pass every year. They are not doing badly enough to get asked to leave, but they are not thriving either. And schools of course do not want to come across as heavy-handed and high-handed by suggesting that these borderline cases should change course too early on. So what happens is that those who get a lot out of the programme excel, whereas there is a group that just barely makes it. Even if the programme is wonderful, there will be those who will not be able to get a great deal of benefit of it. Nothing wrong with the programme. Not always a question of laziness. Usually an issue of a GOOD FIT.
appreciated !
btw, you taught hokkien or not ? or just hokkien songs ? -
atutor2001:
oh yeah, thanks for bringing it up. And if you think you your estimates are good, so be it, but please don't mislead other parents. Your estimates may be close but without basis. That is just your thoughts on it.
On learning that your are retired, besides being able to tell fortune, my foot is also laughing.verykiasu2010:
you are so laughable !
trying so hard to slam me again ? FYI, I have never worked as civil servant although I am very civil. I am retired, by the way.
I was very clear in my writing from the outset. You did not read it properly and just went ahead to slam me ...... got errors now trying so hard to extricate yourself and say I am 'crafty' ? muahahahah, thanks for the compliments, though
We react differently to type of people. After learning that a snake is dangerous, we handle them with caution. In case you have forgotten our last sparring, attached is the thread
http://www.kiasuparents.com/kiasu/forum/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=6459&start=930
What you have posted you may have forgotten but others may remember. I am so free because I am really retired.
For a long time, I refused to acknowledge that we are given a few cohort's raw scores of the prelim (without names) for a number of years and these were tiredlessly worked into the t-score formula and the school database (not MOE database) and the prelim t-scores were compared with the kids' actual t-score after PSLE, and the school could say with confidence at every Pri 6 briefing that every year, their actual is better than prelim by between 5 to 70 points. The numbers I quote on the school are based on actual data. -
I am intrigued by the PSLE and how it is scored. Is there a link where I can find some information, please?
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atutor2001:
Fortune telling my foot. I have been following the PSLE scene since the 1900s.[/quote]Hi atutor2001, can you please tell us again - since when have you been following the PSLE scene?
fortune telling :siam:verykiasu2010:
[quote=\"Imami\"]
Really??
Your earlier post - An average kid (quite hardworking) without tuition or supplementary exercises from parents will be very lucky to get 220 in PSLE, generally will be less than 210. Any normal playful kid without tuition or supplementary exercises from parents is guaranteed 200 and below. Relevant extra work is definitely needed to achieve 240 and above. Perhaps tutors know better in what is relevant. My figures are from \"thin air\".
The scores seem very low. As a parent, by reading the above para, it makes me think this way - to get beyond 220, my child need tuition or additional help. -
[quote=\"verykiasu2010] hello, thanks for the clarity on the matter discussed.
appreciated !
btw, you taught hokkien or not ? or just hokkien songs ?[/quote]
Glad it's all cleared up.
Oh, I taught Higher Studies in Hokkien poetry and Conversational Hokkien 101. I just burst into song in class on occasion on a sleepy afternoon. -
hokkiengirl:
Glad it's all cleared up.[quote=\"verykiasu2010] hello, thanks for the clarity on the matter discussed.
appreciated !
btw, you taught hokkien or not ? or just hokkien songs ?
Oh, I taught Higher Studies in Hokkien poetry and Conversational Hokkien 101. I just burst into song in class on occasion on a sleepy afternoon. :)[/quote][/quote]
I wanna sign up.