Population woes
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mum_sugoku:
Haha. If we have not enough \"talents\" at 3 millions; we have not enough \"talents\" at 4 millions, and we still have not enough \"talents\" at 5 millions, what's the likelihood that we would have enough \"talents\" at 6.. or 6.5 millions?3Boys:
[quote=\"WeiHan\"]If I may, I'll say that sustaining economic growth by increasing population is another form of kicking the can down the road. Just like how the present quantitative easings are kicking the can down the road for US (and European Union joining the party soon) financial problems. The only difference is that altering population density artificially creates a more permanent negative impact that may not be able to reverse at all.
There is scale, and there is scale. What is the optimal size for a country? Is it 2 people? 2000? 2 million?
Up to a point, size doesn't matter. No country can grow its population infinitely, and you will see that I have not argued that population be the end all and be all of economic growth, but rather, that we ought to be at a certain scale.
The more pertinent point is the availability of talent (foreign, if you will) to drive growth.
(When asked about the \"ideal\" population size, too bad that our PM had not said what you have said.. Instead, he said,\"We're gradually increasing our land area, and if we rebuild our older towns, then we can accommodate more people,\", \"Today our population is over five million. In the future, six million or so should not be a problem. Beyond that, we'll have to think more carefully\"..)[/quote]He has said exactly what I said. We can increase the population to the point that we have some scale. When a city like Shanghai is 20 million, being a city of 3 million is a disadvantage. Being a city of 6 million is still a disadvantage, but less so. He says beyond 6.5 million we will have to think more carefully, which means we will need to grow much more slowly if at all. -
3Boys:
Aren't we trying to compete on a resource that we naturally has a disadvantage? If increasing population and scale is an advantage, then we are doomed, Taipei, Shanghai, Seoul etc...can all increase scale much more easily than Singapore since their city size can expand easily within a hinterland but we can't.
He has said exactly what I said. We can increase the population to the point that we have some scale. When a city like Shanghai is 20 million, being a city of 3 million is a disadvantage. Being a city of 6 million is still a disadvantage, but less so. He says beyond 6.5 million we will have to think more carefully, which means we will need to grow much more slowly if at all. -
3Boys:
\"scale\" = max. capacity????! (Why, do you think, that PM said \"we have to think carefully beyond 6.5million\"?)
He has said exactly what I said. We can increase the population to the point that we have some scale. When a city like Shanghai is 20 million, being a city of 3 million is a disadvantage. Being a city of 6 million is still a disadvantage, but less so. He says beyond 6.5 million we will have to think more carefully, which means we will need to grow much more slowly if at all.mum_sugoku:
Haha. If we have not enough \"talents\" at 3 millions; we have not enough \"talents\" at 4 millions, and we still have not enough \"talents\" at 5 millions, what's the likelihood that we would have enough \"talents\" at 6.. or 6.5 millions?
(When asked about the \"ideal\" population size, too bad that our PM had not said what you have said.. Instead, he said,\"We're gradually increasing our land area, and if we rebuild our older towns, then we can accommodate more people,\", \"Today our population is over five million. In the future, six million or so should not be a problem. Beyond that, we'll have to think more carefully\"..)
Anyway I share WeiHan's sentiment
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WeiHan:
Chan Chun Sing, and others before him, have already said that not having a hinterland is a BIG disadvantage.
Aren't we trying to compete on a resource that we naturally has a disadvantage? If increasing population and scale is an advantage, then we are doomed, Taipei, Shanghai, Seoul etc...can all increase scale much more easily than Singapore since their city size can expand easily within a hinterland but we can't.3Boys:
He has said exactly what I said. We can increase the population to the point that we have some scale. When a city like Shanghai is 20 million, being a city of 3 million is a disadvantage. Being a city of 6 million is still a disadvantage, but less so. He says beyond 6.5 million we will have to think more carefully, which means we will need to grow much more slowly if at all.
So who's to say we are not doomed? But I'm not giving up without a fight
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mum_sugoku:
Which is?
Anyway I share WeiHan's sentiment . -
WeiHan:
Aren't we trying to compete on a resource that we naturally has a disadvantage? If increasing population and scale is an advantage, then we are doomed, Taipei, Shanghai, Seoul etc...can all increase scale much more easily than Singapore since their city size can expand easily within a hinterland but we can't.
Finally you understand the cards we have been dealt with. There is no resource we naturally have an advantage. What are we going to do about it? -
3Boys:
This..
Which is?mum_sugoku:
Anyway I share WeiHan's sentiment .WeiHan:
..and thisAren't we trying to compete on a resource that we naturally has a disadvantage? If increasing population and scale is an advantage, then we are doomed, Taipei, Shanghai, Seoul etc...can all increase scale much more easily than Singapore since their city size can expand easily within a hinterland but we can't.
WeiHan:
If I may, I'll say that sustaining economic growth by increasing population is another form of kicking the can down the road. Just like how the present quantitative easings are kicking the can down the road for US (and European Union joining the party soon) financial problems. The only difference is that altering population density artificially creates a more permanent negative impact that may not be able to reverse at all.
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pirate:
In other words, they have no solution.. except to keep reacting (yielding) to the situation..WeiHan:
Aren't we trying to compete on a resource that we naturally has a disadvantage? If increasing population and scale is an advantage, then we are doomed, Taipei, Shanghai, Seoul etc...can all increase scale much more easily than Singapore since their city size can expand easily within a hinterland but we can't.
Finally you understand the cards we have been dealt with. There is no resource we naturally have an advantage. What are we going to do about it? -
it is just a vicious cycle… ppl are getting mad with the garment inviting FT and NC, so they oppose them, while on the other hand the garment feels they are losing votes and keep inviting more FT and NC to vote them… so the cycle just continues…
if we could, do anything to ease the situation, is to vote our garment by outstanding majority votes so that they could drop or reduce the number of NC coming to sg…
if that is ever possible… -
verykiasumummy:
FT and NCs have no voting rights. Even PRs cannot vote. And that is definitely not the reason why the govt is importing more foreign labour, be they FW or FT.it is just a vicious cycle... ppl are getting mad with the garment inviting FT and NC, so they oppose them, while on the other hand the garment feels they are losing votes and keep inviting more FT and NC to vote them... so the cycle just continues...
if we could, do anything to ease the situation, is to vote our garment by outstanding majority votes so that they could drop or reduce the number of NC coming to sg...
if that is ever possible...
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