slmkhoo:

kamom:

Interesting, very interesting indeed. I wonder if the scholar/s sitting in a cushy office coming up with all kinds of policies can see the way you all see.


The best way is to do away with T-score and follow the \"O\" levels way...

A* - 1
A - 2
B - 3
C - 4
D - 5
E - 6

Easy and completely transparent.

Not really, because where they draw the lines between the grades is still unknown. They could still use a bell curve or other method to decide how many get each grade. I would prefer the US system of percentiles. That very clearly shows ranking within the cohort, and is not dependent on the difficulty of the exams.

I take a middle path, a percentile ranking within the subject and scoring system on the grades as by karmom would be better than the current T-score which distorts the weights.

all day happy day:

Hi All,

Please find the below links to have better understanding about T-score.......
http://www.edgefieldpri.moe.edu.sg/wbn/slot/u2208/Parents_Link/Understanding%20PSLE%20T-scores.pdf

The distribution shown in the MOE's slides are all based on a nice normal distribution balanced on both sides of the mean.
What happens if it is skewed left or skewed right because of the cohort's profile?
There is more leverage if you are strong in the subjects skewing left than if you are strong in the subjects skewing right.
I am making a guess that perhaps English appears to be the least \"weighted\" amongst all the subject.
Perhaps also thats why the primary schools with a heavier emphasis in Chinese score well consistently especially the Hokkien Clan Schools.

My advice is to follow the forum thread on EEIS cut-off and 10% cut off and compare with last year's.

You can guage your chance but also keep in mind that there are more ip school places available this year. However given that most of the principals of these new ip schools know the trick of maintaining a high COP by constraining the size of the intake, the effect of the new ip \"may be diluted\".
Hope that helps.

emoh:

4_my_son:

Hi,
I need some advice. DS got 250+1.
Would this be enough for an IP programme? Any school to recommend?

It seems 250+1 is good enough for many good schools e.g. SJI, VS, CHS, ACS(I) under the O-level track, but falls short of the cut-off point for IP programme A-Level track. So near, yet so far........

Any help is very much appreciated. Thanks.

From a concerned dad.

perhaps u can try first choice IP programme of a secondary school then the second choice is the O level programme of the same secondary school, in this way if the child does not get the IP programme, the child can still go to the same dual programme secondary school and try again at the end of sec 2 for admission into sec 3 IP.

LovingDadSG:

I beg to differ with you. The secondary school booklet published by MOE already provides cutoff of past PSLE scores. If MOE is not releasing comprehensive data re: PSLE top score, second guessing based on unverified information here doesn't help. In any case when you apply for school, you can put multiple choices - so whatever it is, your children gets the best available choice based on his/her results and availability.

last year's cohort performance is different from this year. For those whose points hover around the cut off, the information is important so as not waste the choices. Of course if your child's score is 270+ as you have indicated, you wouldnt have bothered

LovingDadSG:

It is one thing for parents to motivate their children to do best but it is completely unnecessary obsession with getting into top schools that is the real root of the problem.

Having the information to decide wisely does not mean that you are obssessed with getting into top schools. You have indicated that your kids are in the top schools.
I have 2 kids as well and I am also glad that they are in IP schools. However I cannot persuade myself to hold moral highground and tell others not to be \"obsessed\" with the better schools when we know that the schools are differentiated and thats the reality. On what grounds can we persuade others that all schools are the same, when we put our children into the IP schools?

I dont agree with all of the above.

My experience with the posting here is that this is a good form of sharing information, nothing to do with boasting or comparing or adding stress to the children.
Most the postings in the past were really trying to dissect the profile of the cohort given the already little amount of information. An example is where the top 3% cut off line is so that the parents and students can make an informed decision in the schools to choose.
Blacking out the information is not the way to go. MOE should instead focus on raising the standards of the neighbourhood schools so that there is less premia in the "branded schools".

SAHM_TAN:

Now it's a bit different than 30 yrs ago. Whether it's a good change or not, I don't know yet.

I do agree that it's more difficult to catch-up.

The difference is nowadays, the children are competing not on their own but with the resources from tuition centers and tutors and parental guidance making the playing field extremely uneven. Especially in the light of the type of testing from MOE that require you to master exam taking techniques and out of syllabus content. Add that to DSA preparatory workshops and GEP preparation.

It does not take much to make a judgement.

SAHM_TAN:

kamom:

[quote=\"SAHM_TAN\"]Will a student who score 220 be able to thrive in RI? Assuming that 220 is consistent with the child's academic performance in school.

A child with a T-score of 200 can get into their feeder school.
A child wth a T-score of 220 can't get in cos' no \"connection\".

If a T-score of 220 cannot thrive in the school, how can a T-score of 200 survive???

Dunno if can survive but will affect the O level results. Maybe that's why there seem to be a trend of increasing COP for affiliated students bah.[/quote]I dont agree that admitting a 220 will necessarily pull down the '0' levels score.I was in RI thirty years ago when everyone has to take '0'. The bottom 10% or more could not make it to top tier JCs losing out to neighbourhood school students despite the fact that all of us are top 1,2,3 from our primary schools.

Even then at University, I saw some of my cohort from the top 10% in RI crash and burn while some neighbourhood school graduates flourish.

The problem is that somehow our education system is too 'stratified\" nowadays with GEP, PSLE/DSA, IP so that it does not give late bloomers and those from slightly less supportive family background the chance to level up. It is a \"long, long flanking exercise\" to level up from normal academic, ite, polytechnic then university not to mention the fact that doors to prestigious scholarship and entrance to medicine, law etc will be shut to you unless you are extremely brilliant and managed to overcome all the obstacles and the negative branding and perception.

kamom:

The T-score for feeder schools is always lower for their own kind but higher for 'outsiders'. I always wonder if it is fair.


A child with a T-score of 200 can get into their feeder school.
A child wth a T-score of 220 can't get in cos' no \"connection\".

If a T-score of 220 cannot thrive in the school, how can a T-score of 200 survive???

Feeder School System is not a fair system. No matter how one might argue about preserving culture or parents' contribution to the school as most parents and students who benefit will proposition.

It is not fair because it is not available as an option to the entire cohort no matter the background. Take those born to poorer families for example.

Likewise for DSA. Although my child benefitted from it. I will say without hesitation that it is not fair as it is not an option for those whose parents lack the means, knowledge and resources to go through the exercise.

I am disappointed with last week's talking point on whether DSA is fair. An MP whose child successfully DSAed into a top school went on to contend that it is fair and good because it takes away the stress for his child who may fumble in PSLE. I cannot see how the fact that there is a majority out there for whom DSA is not an option could be ignored.

kamom:

The T-score for feeder schools is always lower for their own kind but higher for 'outsiders'. I always wonder if it is fair.


A child with a T-score of 200 can get into their feeder school.
A child wth a T-score of 220 can't get in cos' no \"connection\".

If a T-score of 220 cannot thrive in the school, how can a T-score of 200 survive???

Feeder School System is not a fair system. No matter how one might argue about preserving culture or parents' contribution to the school as most parents and students who benefit will proposition.

It is not fair because it is not available as an option to the entire cohort no matter the background. Take those born to poorer families for example.

Likewise for DSA. Although my child benefitted from it. I will say without hesitation that it is not fair as it is not an option for those whose parents lack the means, knowledge and resources to go through the exercise.

I am disappointed with last week's talking point on whether DSA is fair. An MP whose child DSAed into a top school, went on to contend that it is fair and good because it takes away the stress for his child who may fumble in PSLE. I cannot see anyone could have ignored the fact that there is a majority out there for whom DSA is not an option.

Rhetoric has limited effect. Taking away the banding and telling people that every school has its merit is not going to work. In finance and economics lingo, the market is always efficient. The price of entry into a school aka "PSLE Tscore" will always reflect the demand. You cannot create enough market noise to convince someone with 260+ to forsake RI and go to "Adams Road School" and let someone with 220 try and get into RI in place.

Of course if desired, you can always "do central planning and allocation" ie hold a lottery for the placement of students into secondary schools. (if the assumption that all schools are equal holds). All pressure and stress will be gone then.