6thisnthat9:

Divergent 2:

Hi Jetsetter
I think you totally mis-read my intention. I agree with you that the primary education will not be an important factor in future employment. What I mean is the transfering of school from here and there, then go back, does not look good on records. Most importantly, I want to stress whether to enter the program or not need to be considered in a serious manner. I admit I may be overly worried because I am actually considering letting one of my child return to mainstream. Whether to remain or return is also not an easy decision.

By saying society as a whole, it is very real. Those who are not in the program will never understand the challenges that both child and parent face as gep group belongs to a minority. They would not understand that it is not a failure but a choice should they choose to return. The labelling and eye-rolling (on child and parent) is there even when the child joins the program. Do you think the labelling and eye-rolling will be gone if child return to ms?

Thanks for sharing your experience, must be not easy for you to acknowledge. Hi divergent_2,
Many parents would just bite the bullet and keep it to themselves, esp in sg. Only good news are shared. These are life experiences that would make us grow wiser, yes, we parents too.
Could I ask which school is your child in? It may not be applicable for me now but it may not be possible to locate you in future by the time I needed more information. or could you share via PM instead?

Hi Divergent 2,

Agreed that the experience was not easy and such bad experiences are usually kept to themselves. Was at the briefing today, perhaps my understanding was wrong, but the baseline of 70% was meant to ensure the child is benefiting from the program. The program was not supposed to be easy and the child is expected to work hard to achieve it. However it was not told that below and \"you are out\". Besides the drop out rates were very, very low for the last two years, and it was expressly mentioned: not due academic achievement.

Specifically, such cases will involve the in-school counsellor, the teachers, the parents as well as GEB officers and counsellors. And the options they mentioned were either change to ms in the gep school or back to their previous ms school if there are vacancies, but like you mentioned either way, the stigma could be real. Having said that, not that your concerns are unfounded, and with the very little that you have mentioned in the posts, I may be wrong but noticed that you have mentioned only interactions between teachers in the school. Perhaps you want to approach the counsellors or even GEB to discuss your problems or options. The burden seems heavy and it really is not fun to bear it with the start of the long holidays.
May not be applicable in your case, dd toughest year was P4 due to the jump in the standard, it became easier in P5, perhaps because we are used to her \"surprises\"... But may again read too intensely and schools are different, but in dd class, only the stronger in maths are \"selected\" for the MO training.... Hang in there and good luck on whatever path your dd takes...

Personally don't think going back to ms is a sign of failure or weakness on child or parent, every child is different and parents would only choose the best path for the child.... we are not equipped to judge....

Em:

suku:

But you highlighted an important point. Typically nyps offers 4 ge classes of 100 kids. Heard that it is very popular and some got turned away. Next year intake there are only 3 classes, ie 75 kids.. and there is 40 nyps kids, leaving about 35 for outsider. This compares to previous year's 100 kids, 34 from nyps, leaving about 66 for outsider. The percentage of space left is almost halved... it is going to be very tough... hmmm not enough time to be parent volunteer or change address.... sigh... must be more pious again much like 3 years ago...

didn't think I could be facing this situation again after P1

hahaha... joking lah .... \"all gep schools are good schools\" this one I think is true lah.. afterall the kids are taking the same tests and syllabus wherever they are, supervised by a common GEB. While we tends nitpick which school is better, I think the academic standards are very similar. The key is perhaps the different characteristics of the school. Some is SAP with strong HCL, some provides slack in academic requirement meaning less call to parents, some is single gender school, some is holistic mission school, some prefers large school, some prefers cosy small school where the attention is individual. It boils down to what the child is, and what the parents prefers.
So any of the choices has its strong points and weaknesses, no perfect school. But with the reduced spaces, we just have to be more serious on our choices, and indicates wisely our preferences. So even if we cannot get the lucky first choice, we hope to get the better second. Distance and transportation consideration is important, as there is more staying back in school.
May our questions be answered tomorrow and good luck with a pleasant, fruitful journey in the next three years.

lee_yl:

dimsum:

Number of kids offered is reduced (in terms of percentage is reduced).

I don't know the exact. Heard is around 40.

Last year there were 34 from NYPS selected into GEP right? If this year's figure is around 40 and since the annual intake of students is the same, the percentage selected should have gone up and not down as claimed

If the overall intake for geppers increases for this year, then I wonder cutting NYPS GE classes from 4 to 3, would it be enough to meet demand? Hmmm....

err not dimsum, so reckon a guess (kiasu can be kaypo, sometimes it comes hand in hand).
dimsum was replying to sean_wife:
1) \"the reason for reduction in number of classes\" is the number of kids offered is reduced. From perhaps 2 years ago before the cut in classes (percentage with the base as cohort of students, live birth in 2007- 39,490), hence this percentage of total ge student offered as a function of total student cohort is reduced.
2) \"for nyps, do you know the number of their own children offered GEP?\" heard is around 40.
so dimsum was not comparing the percentage of nyps gep kids offered in nyps alone, which like you mentioned should have increased.

I think you mentioned \"overall intake for geppers increases for this year\" is referring to nyps alone? Overall, with the reduction in numbers of ge kids starting last year, I think if this year no further decrease, can \"偷笑\" leow, it shouldn't have increased. We may know the exact figures tomorrow (last year I \"read\" it was not announced), if GEB is not classifying it as \"official secret\" ....

But you highlighted an important point. Typically nyps offers 4 ge classes of 100 kids. Heard that it is very popular and some got turned away. Next year intake there are only 3 classes, ie 75 kids.. and there is 40 nyps kids, leaving about 35 for outsider. This compares to previous year's 100 kids, 34 from nyps, leaving about 66 for outsider. The percentage of space left is almost halved... it is going to be very tough... hmmm not enough time to be parent volunteer or change address.... sigh... must be more pious again much like 3 years ago....

Debby:

For those of us doing the school selection, is there any way of knowing how \"popular\", the school that we have chosen is? ie based on previoust years' selection outcome ?

We are keen on Raffles Girls' Pri but I have heard that its highly popular and very slim chance of being selected as it is one of the most popular choices, coupled with their own P3 cohort being selected which gets priority. Also heard that since last year, thier enrollment has been slashed to 2 classes ( lowering the chances for girls to be selected for Gep as compared to boys?)
Hope not to waste my choices - although I know that there is an avenue for appeals. Hope to keep that as a last resort.
Appreciate any advice. Thanks in advance

Hi Debby, the selection criteria can be found here https://www.moe.gov.sg/faq/education/gifted-education-programme/gep-schools.
But generally if the student is not already in or has a sibling in the gep school, then
the distance from the pupil’s home to the school of choice;
the type of school the child was from (e.g. SAP, mission or single-gender);
and the vacancies available in the school of choice.

So it really depends on ur dd current school and address. Perhaps you can ask the school on sat's briefing to get details on \"chances\".

Also the reduction in RGPS is due to falling enrollment inline with lower birthrate, and not to lower the chances for girls, although it seems there are more boys than girls selected. Good Luck in your choice and it is a good school. Lovely teachers. :rahrah: :rahrah: :rahrah:

wittlewabbit:

@jedamum To rectify,my child got selected for the programme- just trying to play devil's advocate now before making decisions. I used to be an ex Gep teacher actually but I left the service a while back,so wondering if there are any changes.

Hmm... interesting to hear from the horse's mouth. With your previous experience teaching in gep and probably some in ms, will the program benefits all identified students, or perhaps better for some to remain in ms? After all, despite all the claims of how rigorous the selection tests are, it does not mean a top student will definitely gets in, nor a student in a weaker mixed ability class will not be selected, in the same school. This probably contributes to our thinking that the selection exists an element of luck, and the question of will my child cope...

Also, do you mind sharing if you will accept or reject? After all, with your intimate knowledge of the program as a former gep teacher, it does provides a boost of confidence or a need for deeper consideration on our decision.

Divergent 2:

suku:

[quote=\"Divergent 2\"]Hi

Not everything is FOC. On the contrary, most of the extra enrichments need to pay. Maths olympiad lessons need to pay, even some CCAs need to pay. If stay in the ms school, may not have to pay for these. Plus pay high fees for the basic school bus alone. It is higher cost overall.

Thought that you picked a gep centre based on distance, so why has to \"pay high fees for the basic school bus\", unless the previous school is within walking distance? Besides, confusing to note that the extra enrichment need to be paid only in gep? Meaning that if attend similar enrichments in MS don't have to pay for these (really)? Anyway, just like sleepy said, \"MO in p6, paid $80 for dd1, free for dd2\", to have a feel in the quantum of cost. DD's enrichment was paid using Edusave which govies gives $200 per annum, so actually didn't remember we had to pay out of pocket.

Perhaps some will even claim tuition is much more expensive... that is probably true as tuition catered for ge syllabus are limited to certain centres, but then happy with average dd's average result, didn't go for that, so saved a tonne......, ironically heard some of these classes has non-ge students..... so it is really your choice lah...

Hi
I don't know why there is a need for you to question me on these. I am simply responding to another forumer asking about the costs. I am giving my honest answer comparing the costs between the gep school and the previous ms school. In terms of distance the ms school is nearer. Even though the gep school is the nearest to where we stay, it is still a distance away, hence the huge increase in costs. As for extra things like MO training and CCAs, I am not comparing across different schools, only between their previous ms school and the gep school. Maybe other ms schools also charge, I don't know. I would not respond to any further comments on this point.[/quote]Noted that you will \"not respond to any further comments on this point\", but responding to \"why there is a need for you to question me on these\". I am simply confused as it appears to suggest that there are extra charges applicable only to GEP school, but not to MS. Now with your clarification \"only between their previous ms school and the gep school\" which I also infer P3 and below in MS, and P4 onwards in GEP, this makes it very clear. Thanks for clarification, now I understand the basis of comparison. Apologies if I have read too intensely on the postings..

Divergent 2:

Hi

Not everything is FOC. On the contrary, most of the extra enrichments need to pay. Maths olympiad lessons need to pay, even some CCAs need to pay. If stay in the ms school, may not have to pay for these. Plus pay high fees for the basic school bus alone. It is higher cost overall.

Thought that you picked a gep centre based on distance, so why has to \"pay high fees for the basic school bus\", unless the previous school is within walking distance? Besides, confusing to note that the extra enrichment need to be paid only in gep? Meaning that if attend similar enrichments in MS don't have to pay for these (really)? Anyway, just like sleepy said, \"MO in p6, paid $80 for dd1, free for dd2\", to have a feel in the quantum of cost. DD's enrichment was paid using Edusave which govies gives $200 per annum, so actually didn't remember we had to pay out of pocket.

Perhaps some will even claim tuition is much more expensive... that is probably true as tuition catered for ge syllabus are limited to certain centres, but then happy with average dd's average result, didn't go for that, so saved a tonne......, ironically heard some of these classes has non-ge students..... so it is really your choice lah...

merkon:

Is there an option to drop to standard Chinese instead of HCL?

This is dependent on the school. DD school offers both HCL and CL. In fact the acceptance letter has the option with the normal or higher chinese. Do choose wisely as I remember reading somewhere where a parent wanted to change their mind after indicating normal chinese and it became a hassle. Heard some school even have students without Chinese due to some conditions, although it is harder to get exemption nowadays. But like hquek mentioned earlier, the Chinese seems to be harder than in mainstream, although it is easier to switch from HCL to CL subsequently, but not vice versa.

sembgal:

Personally I know of a friend who purposely sent her child to prep class to prepare for GEP as early as 1 year in advance at MS. Privately, she engaged private tutor, an ex-teacher, to tuition the child every day in advance of the syllabus the child suppose to learn in school. Yes, her child is in GEP in P4 this year in a top school. With money, you can get results. Therefore, a lot of affluent parents will not admit they send their children to prep class. FYI, the child has been trained for GEP from as early as his preschool days with daily private tuition as what I have mentioned.


After her child gained entry into GEP, she heeded my advice to transfer her son from MS Gifted class to TLL class and her son finds the lessons more challenging and interesting. But that price is exorbitant. Not forgetting that the child has a private home tutor who comes daily to help with the work. With such affluent parents, the child will not struggle but remained ahead of his peers in current P4 GEP class.

Perhaps we may be too casual in attributing the child's success due to the affluent parents and the daily private tuition in addition to the exorbitant TLL. But what if the child originally had the x-factor? Or for the matter, as GE syllabus is already quite time consuming and fast pace, won't these extra tuition require much commitment and determination on the child? This child is definitely a hardworking one....

Ironically some parents were complaining in the PSLE thread that there were not sufficient practices to deal with the maths paper, particularly a maths question on lamp posts and intervals. This was subsequently debunked as similar questions were found in past prelim/psle papers. These practices would likely be done in the supplementary classes and can be beneficial especially to those weaker or without tuition.


I suppose different folks different strokes, but the classes should be allow to continue, if the parents are not keen, perhaps they should just keep their child away. To be fair, such "free" supplementary classes require much extra burden to the school and the dedication of the conducting teachers.