Any Updates As To When PSLE T-Scores Will Be Scrapped?
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pirate:
No lah. I think some of them are asking what if my 5 points is actually better than your 4 points?
I don't think the issue is with 'what if my 4 points is better than your 4 points', but more with 'I work as hard as you to get that 4 points, why should I be denied of that dream school while you got in just because your are luckier than me?'mum_sugoku:
[quote=\"Sun_2010\"]Well said grimm!
The idea of AL points is to remove granularity. But we still have people talking what if my 4 points is better than your 4 points. The concept that the 4 pointers are in same band of performances is hard to digest.
[/quote]And the 5-pointer who poses this question to his 4-pointer friend may not be wrong after all :shock:
Supposedly, for PLSE, the 4-pointer's scores were E:90, M:90, S:90, MT:90, his total score would be 360 marks.
And if the 5-pointer's raw scores were E:92, M:100, S:99, MT:89, his total (raw) score would be 380 marks, a good 20 marks higher than his 4-pointer mate!
Let's say both had set their eyes on RI, the one with 360 marks (raw scores) will have no problem getting in, whereas the one with 380 marks will have to fight with other 5-pointers for a (slim?) chance to get in, or simply give up his dream of going there
..
And it's all because the 4-pointer had scored just 1 mark higher than his friend in that 1 single subject!
A scenario like this will never happen under our current t-score system; the 5-pointer, together with his 4-pointer friend, will have no problem getting into RI. :imcool: -
Sun_2010:
How can he choose \"wisely\"? To do that, (a) he would need to know the number of spots left in RI (which means, knowing how many spots to begin with, how many DSAs (assuming the scheme still survives), how many taken up by AL4 band, and then (b) knowing how many in AL5 are interested in RI, and (c) he also needs to consider his 2nd choice because he could jolly well end up with 3rd or 4th choice. If we can't get exact numbers, can't we at least get a range? A probability? There are so many moving parts, how does one \" choose wisely\"?
That would depend on the choice of school.
Eg. if RI has a cutoff point as 5, then most of the seats will be taken up students who scored 4 points. There will be a fraction of the seats left over. Now no of students who 5 points will be more in number compared to 4 pointers. If a student wants to put in RI as his first choice, then not only he will have to ballot , the odds are low too. However if he chooses a 6 point cut off school, there will be no balloting for him. He has a choice , he has to choose wisely. -
Irrelevant:
Can I add on to thatMinister says: less than 10% of kids will face the ballot.
Since not all schools are created equal, not all schools require balloting. Imagine if just 20% of the schools (almost certainly the popular ones) require balloting, does than imply that 50% of all those applying for such schools would face balloting? Life become just a gamble?
... Imagine a child who came from an affiliated pri school versus another. Same scores, same ability. Now imagine that MOE allowed an arbitrary discount (to be decided by the affiliated school), and the child that came from an affiliated primary school gets in without balloting while the other one would have to compete for fewer spots left (because well, there are these affiliated children ahead of her) so the odds are even worse for those children whose grandparents or great grandparents did not have the 20/20 foresight of enrolling their parents/grandparents into an affiliated primary school...
So the kid from the affiliated school probably escaped balloting at P1 registration and would escape balloting at secondary school... Anecdotally, parents (alumni or otherwise) hate balloting. But now, conceivably, only a select few would have immunity... -
mum_sugoku:
Actually, maybe my 7 points better than your 4 points. I got 389 leh. :siam:
And the 5-pointer who poses this question to his 4-pointer friend may not be wrong after all :shock:pirate:
No lah. I think some of them are asking what if my 5 points is actually better than your 4 points?
Supposedly, for PLSE, the 4-pointer's scores were E:90, M:90, S:90, MT:90, his total score would be 360 marks.
And if the 5-pointer's raw scores were E:92, M:100, S:99, MT:89, his total (raw) score would be 380 marks, a good 20 marks higher than his 4-pointer mate!
Let's say both had set their eyes on RI, the one with 360 marks (raw scores) will have no problem getting in, whereas the one with 380 marks will have to fight with other 5-pointers for a (slim?) chance to get in, or simply give up his dream of going there ..
And it's all because the 4-pointer had scored just 1 mark higher than his friend in that 1 single subject!
A scenario like this will never happen under our current t-score system; the 5-pointer, together with his 4-pointer friend, will have no problem getting into RI. :imcool: -
Blurryburger:
Easy, don't choose RI, don't have stress now or later
How can he choose \"wisely\"? To do that, (a) he would need to know the number of spots left in RI (which means, knowing how many spots to begin with, how many DSAs (assuming the scheme still survives), how many taken up by AL4 band, and then (b) knowing how many in AL5 are interested in RI, and (c) he also needs to consider his 2nd choice because he could jolly well end up with 3rd or 4th choice. If we can't get exact numbers, can't we at least get a range? A probability? There are so many moving parts, how does one \" choose wisely\"?Sun_2010:
That would depend on the choice of school.
Eg. if RI has a cutoff point as 5, then most of the seats will be taken up students who scored 4 points. There will be a fraction of the seats left over. Now no of students who 5 points will be more in number compared to 4 pointers. If a student wants to put in RI as his first choice, then not only he will have to ballot , the odds are low too. However if he chooses a 6 point cut off school, there will be no balloting for him. He has a choice , he has to choose wisely.
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grimm:
Easy, don't choose RI, don't have stress now or later
How can he choose \"wisely\"? To do that, (a) he would need to know the number of spots left in RI (which means, knowing how many spots to begin with, how many DSAs (assuming the scheme still survives), how many taken up by AL4 band, and then (b) knowing how many in AL5 are interested in RI, and (c) he also needs to consider his 2nd choice because he could jolly well end up with 3rd or 4th choice. If we can't get exact numbers, can't we at least get a range? A probability? There are so many moving parts, how does one \" choose wisely\"?Blurryburger:
[quote=\"Sun_2010\"]
That would depend on the choice of school.
Eg. if RI has a cutoff point as 5, then most of the seats will be taken up students who scored 4 points. There will be a fraction of the seats left over. Now no of students who 5 points will be more in number compared to 4 pointers. If a student wants to put in RI as his first choice, then not only he will have to ballot , the odds are low too. However if he chooses a 6 point cut off school, there will be no balloting for him. He has a choice , he has to choose wisely.[/quote]Most of the time, it's much ado about nothing.
I get it that some people sees RI as their dream school and it's either RI or nothing. But take a step back and ponder, what is wrong with the alternate 5 point school aka 2nd choice? It's not exactly the end of the world yet we somehow make it seems like the poor child is heading to some backwater secondary school in a 3rd world nation. -
My daugther will be the first batch of PSLE under this new AL banding scheme. With no historical data for school selection, I do hope MOE will begin to give a simulate AL cut off point ontop of the usual T-score for each schools. At least this will give the us, the pioneers, the choices of secondary schools that make sense with her AL band.
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Blurryburger:
Why can't you pick non-affiliated school then? I'm curious why are non-affiliated so keen to get into affiliated schools? The alumni are keen to send their children because they want their children to to have the same experience they did, tradition, good cultural fit etc.
Can I add on to that ... Imagine a child who came from an affiliated pri school versus another. Same scores, same ability. Now imagine that MOE allowed an arbitrary discount (to be decided by the affiliated school), and the child that came from an affiliated primary school gets in without balloting while the other one would have to compete for fewer spots left (because well, there are these affiliated children ahead of her) so the odds are even worse for those children whose grandparents or great grandparents did not have the 20/20 foresight of enrolling their parents/grandparents into an affiliated primary school...
So the kid from the affiliated school probably escaped balloting at P1 registration and would escape balloting at secondary school... Anecdotally, parents (alumni or otherwise) hate balloting. But now, conceivably, only a select few would have immunity...
One must remember that in the cases where the affiliated schools give significant discount, the general academic standard in the school may not be as high as those schools who take students in purely based on academic results. So getting into an affiliated school does not mean your child is surrounded by high academic achievers or that they will do well for his O levels or whatever.
In truth, is the angst mostly because we are really talking about specific affiliated schools who are considered top X schools in Singapore? Or is everyone interested to enter the Band 7 and Band 8 affiliated secondary schools? (Sorry I don't know really how to rank secondary schools so I'm using 2011 banding by MOE)
Also, I will add that from personal experience (although it was a long time ago ), depending on their character and temperament, sometimes it doesn't work out well for the non-affiliated kids in terms of assimilation so it may not be easiest for a child going into his / her teenage years. I don't think the affiliated kids are mean but just that they have already formed their cliques from primary school and it may hard to break into those cliques.
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grimm:
I second your views. I was also from a primary school which affiliate into the secondary school. Most of the best students in our primary school would have left for better secondary schools after they got their psle results. And the not so good ones (i.e. the 80% +) will stay on and get affiliated to its secondary school.
Why can't you pick non-affiliated school then? I'm curious why are non-affiliated so keen to get into affiliated schools? The alumni are keen to send their children because they want their children to to have the same experience they did, tradition, good cultural fit etc.Blurryburger:
Can I add on to that ... Imagine a child who came from an affiliated pri school versus another. Same scores, same ability. Now imagine that MOE allowed an arbitrary discount (to be decided by the affiliated school), and the child that came from an affiliated primary school gets in without balloting while the other one would have to compete for fewer spots left (because well, there are these affiliated children ahead of her) so the odds are even worse for those children whose grandparents or great grandparents did not have the 20/20 foresight of enrolling their parents/grandparents into an affiliated primary school...
So the kid from the affiliated school probably escaped balloting at P1 registration and would escape balloting at secondary school... Anecdotally, parents (alumni or otherwise) hate balloting. But now, conceivably, only a select few would have immunity...
One must remember that in the cases where the affiliated schools give significant discount, the general academic standard in the school may not be as high as those schools who take students in purely based on academic results. So getting into an affiliated school does not mean your child is surrounded by high academic achievers or that they will do well for his O levels or whatever.
In truth, is the angst mostly because we are really talking about specific affiliated schools who are considered top X schools in Singapore? Or is everyone interested to enter the Band 7 and Band 8 affiliated secondary schools? (Sorry I don't know really how to rank secondary schools so I'm using 2011 banding by MOE)
Also, I will add that from personal experience (although it was a long time ago ), depending on their character and temperament, sometimes it doesn't work out well for the non-affiliated kids in terms of assimilation so it may not be easiest for a child going into his / her teenage years. I don't think the affiliated kids are mean but just that they have already formed their cliques from primary school and it may hard to break into those cliques.
Then brilliant students with much better psle scores than us join us in our secondary due to the high cut off points for the limited space. And they will be in the top few classes, mixed with affiliated students. These new students will likely form their own cliques with the other new students, coz it is really difficult for them to break into our 6 years strong cliques, where we are mostly from the same class from P1 to P6.
While I welcomed one of those new students into my clique, she didn't fit very well coz academically she was much stronger than us but we were a bunch of rowdy girls who didnt mind as we got used to each other. And I feel it wasn't the best place for her. In the end, she didn't do as well as I think she is capable of. -
floppy:
It's really not about the choice of RI. Scratch RI and replace that with another school-another band with the same scenario of being sandwiched between two bands...
Most of the time, it's much ado about nothing.grimm:
Easy, don't choose RI, don't have stress now or later
I get it that some people sees RI as their dream school and it's either RI or nothing. But take a step back and ponder, what is wrong with the alternate 5 point school aka 2nd choice? It's not exactly the end of the world yet we somehow make it seems like the poor child is heading to some backwater secondary school in a 3rd world nation.
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