Living in Singapore

[zac's mum]

Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=\"2131637\" time=\"1711716129\" user_id=\"195250:[quote=\"Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=2131637 time=1711716129 user_id=195250]
Actually I don't understand what it mean? For a primary or lower secondary student, study hard for all subjects in school - is a basic requirement or their main responsibility, why need to climb the ladder? What is the wrong wall? Sorry, I am a stupid person, don't understand 😅[/quote]

The ladder is a metaphor for the so-called golden career pathway that many Asian parents crave for their offspring to climb successfully (Oxbridge / govt scholarship / med or law degree; pick any one of these. And in fact he got all 3 of these, when 1 is already considered a “big win” in many parents’ eyes).

[00skyblue00]

Just read about Ashxxx. Reminds me of the story of the fisherman and the businessman.


https://femalefitnessmatters.co.uk/2020/12/03/the-parable-of-the-fisherman-the-businessman/

[00skyblue00]

Just watched the cna insider interview.

In short, he said, exams are for citing students in the correct environment at correct learning pace. Hmmmm… If so, why need to change from tscore to AL? Without psle or delay psle, students would not be learning at the correct pace or delay the chance to learn at correct pace.
Actually, i hope someone can review if the same approach of mixing normal streams students with express stream by subjects can be also used for mixing ip with express by subjects. For students who are talented in eg maths, but weaker in lang esp CL, they can still be learning at advanced level like ip students in their talented subjects. Still be given a chanve to participate in maths talent program with the ip students.
For ip students who may also be stronger in one area, but not in another area, they may not be talented in all subjects too. They can take a slower pace to learn the weaker subjects. Win win for all.

Instead of a clear cut IP for all subjects, we can have an advanced G4 level, express G3, G2 and G1 level for each subject.

But yes, logistically it will be a nightmare for the schools or policy makers.

[Liew Nga Wing]

zac's mum\" post_id=\"2131639\" time=\"1711718070\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2131639 time=1711718070 user_id=53606]
The ladder is a metaphor for the so-called golden career pathway that many Asian parents crave for their offspring to climb successfully (Oxbridge / govt scholarship / med or law degree; pick any one of these. And in fact he got all 3 of these, when 1 is already considered a “big win” in many parents’ eyes).[/quote]

But Zac is a Secondary 2 student now if I don't remember wrongly, he may go Oxbridge / scholarship or law degree in future. Who can say he will not?

[lee_yl]

00skyblue00\" post_id=\"2131642\" time=\"1711720822\" user_id=\"143605:

Just watched the cna insider interview.
In short, he said, exams are for citing students in the correct environment at correct learning pace. Hmmmm... If so, why need to change from tscore to AL? Without psle or delay psle, students would not be learning at the correct pace or delay the chance to learn at correct pace.
Actually, i hope someone can review if the same approach of mixing normal streams students with express stream by subjects can be also used for mixing ip with express by subjects. For students who are talented in eg maths, but weaker in lang esp CL, they can still be learning at advanced level like ip students in their talented subjects. Still be given a chanve to participate in maths talent program with the ip students.
For ip students who may also be stronger in one area, but not in another area, they may not be talented in all subjects too. They can take a slower pace to learn the weaker subjects. Win win for all.

Instead of a clear cut IP for all subjects, we can have an advanced G4 level, express G3, G2 and G1 level for each subject.

But yes, logistically it will be a nightmare for the schools or policy makers.

Thank you for helping to summarize.

Even if I agree with Minister Chan, I would still aim for IP for my girls. Reason being girls do better than boys in general at 12yo as they are more mature emotionally. More advantageous to push girls to chope a seat in IP via PSLE. At 16yo, boys mature and many start to do better than girls academically. So if my girls were to try at 16yo, they will be at a slight disadvantage because girls tend to plateau and worse still, girls could get into moody spells easily during puberty till 18yo.

To delay PSLE till the children are 14yo, I already think my girls would be disadvantaged. But if mine were boys, then of cos would say 14yo is fairer. LOL.

[zac's mum]

Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=\"2131643\" time=\"1711720895\" user_id=\"195250:[quote=\"Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=2131643 time=1711720895 user_id=195250]
But Zac is a Secondary 2 student now if I don't remember wrongly, he may go Oxbridge / scholarship or law degree in future. Who can say he will not?[/quote]

I don’t think he is interested in that ladder, even if he has the calibre. But that’s ok with me.

[sharonkhoo]

00skyblue00\" post_id=\"2131642\" time=\"1711720822\" user_id=\"143605:

Just watched the cna insider interview.
In short, he said, exams are for citing students in the correct environment at correct learning pace. Hmmmm... If so, why need to change from tscore to AL? Without psle or delay psle, students would not be learning at the correct pace or delay the chance to learn at correct pace.
Actually, i hope someone can review if the same approach of mixing normal streams students with express stream by subjects can be also used for mixing ip with express by subjects. For students who are talented in eg maths, but weaker in lang esp CL, they can still be learning at advanced level like ip students in their talented subjects. Still be given a chanve to participate in maths talent program with the ip students.
For ip students who may also be stronger in one area, but not in another area, they may not be talented in all subjects too. They can take a slower pace to learn the weaker subjects. Win win for all.

Instead of a clear cut IP for all subjects, we can have an advanced G4 level, express G3, G2 and G1 level for each subject.

But yes, logistically it will be a nightmare for the schools or policy makers.

Yes - I agree! My ideal would be \"full subject-based banding\" (or some similar system) for all grades from P1 to JC2, or at least S1 to JC2. It would be a nightmare to timetable, but that would be mean that kids of all abilities would be less segregated, while those who need more challenge or more support in specific subjects would be able to get it. Then we can ditch the \"IP\" label. I would also like all independent schools to revert to government-funded so they don't use their additional wealth to create another divide in the education system.

[sharonkhoo]

Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=\"2131643\" time=\"1711720895\" user_id=\"195250:[quote=\"Liew Nga Wing\" post_id=2131643 time=1711720895 user_id=195250]
But Zac is a Secondary 2 student now if I don't remember wrongly, he may go Oxbridge / scholarship or law degree in future. Who can say he will not?[/quote]

The important thing is for parents to be open to looking for different \"ladders\" and \"walls\" for their kids depending on their abilities and inclinations, and not expecting that all kids should want the same thing, or be able to achieve the same thing in the end. Setting high and unattainable goals is very stressful on kids - I was one of those, though fairly able, who had a father who always set a goal even higher. His belief (which I disagree with) was that you should always aim for the top - not just Oxbridge, but 1st class; not just 1st class, but top 1st; not just a good job, but the highest pay/prestige; not just to get that kind of job but to climb higher and faster than the next guy... you get the picture. He never considered that I wasn't that calibre, or that I didn't even want to climb that ladder (like that young man), and that constantly being asked why I wasn't doing better was extremely stressful. I survived by blocking out his messages as much as I could, and developing a different value system. And I got married at 23 to a man who valued me for being willing to step off that ladder!

I'm NOT saying that there should be no goals, no aspirations - but they should be realistic and tailored to the child's abilities and interests, not just what \"everyone else\" thinks is good. And parents need to tell the child that they are happy that the child done as best he can at climbing his chosen ladder and wall.

[phtthp]

slmkhoo\" post_id=\"2131661\" time=\"1711760944\" user_id=\"28674:

The important thing is for parents to be open to looking for different \"ladders\" and \"walls\" for their kids depending on their abilities and inclinations, and not expecting that all kids should want the same thing, or be able to achieve the same thing in the end. Setting high and unattainable goals is very stressful on kids - I was one of those, though fairly able, who had a father who always set a goal even higher. His belief (which I disagree with) was that you should always aim for the top - not just Oxbridge, but 1st class; not just 1st class, but top 1st; not just a good job, but the highest pay/prestige; not just to get that kind of job but to climb higher and faster than the next guy... you get the picture. He never considered that I wasn't that calibre, or that I didn't even want to climb that ladder (like that young man), and that constantly being asked why I wasn't doing better was extremely stressful. I survived by blocking out his messages as much as I could, and developing a different value system. And I got married at 23 to a man who valued me for being willing to step off that ladder!

I'm NOT saying that there should be no goals, no aspirations - but they should be realistic and tailored to the child's abilities and interests, not just what \"everyone else\" thinks is good. And parents need to tell the child that they are happy that the child done as best he can at climbing his chosen ladder and wall.

:goodpost:

[sharonkhoo]

starlight1968sg\" post_id=\"2131618\" time=\"1711697027\" user_id=\"14025:

In short, during schooling, the grades count. During working, the grades ie salaries count.
We are tied to grades

Having measures is good as it gives some feedback. It's the attitude towards these measures that matters - they only count as much it matters to you.