7 New IP schools
-
Hi Chenonceau, which schools have you observed in which the borderline cases are asked to leave? I was given the impression that borderline cases would be given special attention to bring them up to par, rather than asked to leave. Thanks.
-
jtoh:
Hi Chenonceau, which schools have you observed in which the borderline cases are asked to leave? I was given the impression that borderline cases would be given special attention to bring them up to par, rather than asked to leave. Thanks.
Happened to 2 girls I know. Can't tell you which school lah... Borderline 65 is different from borderline 50. Borderline 65, you are helped but if you score less than 50 then you are asked to leave. Both girls left at the end of Sec 1.
It isn't about being heartless. It is really to help the girls. The judgment call involves considering the risks/benefits of IP for girls who can't keep up. If you are borderline pass all the way to J2, you jeopardise your As. Better to go 'O' level route and still have your 'O's. -
Chenonceau:
There shouldn't be alot of such cases. I would expect most students that have psle t-score of 250 and above to get their A levels easily.jtoh:
Hi Chenonceau, which schools have you observed in which the borderline cases are asked to leave? I was given the impression that borderline cases would be given special attention to bring them up to par, rather than asked to leave. Thanks.
Happened to 2 girls I know. Can't tell you which school lah... Borderline 65 is different from borderline 50. Borderline 65, you are helped but if you score less than 50 then you are asked to leave. Both girls left at the end of Sec 1.
It isn't about being heartless. It is really to help the girls. The judgment call involves considering the risks/benefits of IP for girls who can't keep up. If you are borderline pass all the way to J2, you jeopardise your As. Better to go 'O' level route and still have your 'O's. -
WeiHan:
There shouldn't be alot of such cases. I would expect most students that have psle t-score of 250 and above to get their A levels easily.[/quote]No... not a lot. Both were DSA cases. Champion sports girls who didn't make the cut off by a pretty long shot. Since then, I think schools have tightened up on DSA too... lower cut off but still a discriminating cut off. This prevents the trauma I saw the girls go through. It's like being expelled.Chenonceau:
[quote=\"jtoh\"]Hi Chenonceau, which schools have you observed in which the borderline cases are asked to leave? I was given the impression that borderline cases would be given special attention to bring them up to par, rather than asked to leave. Thanks.
Happened to 2 girls I know. Can't tell you which school lah... Borderline 65 is different from borderline 50. Borderline 65, you are helped but if you score less than 50 then you are asked to leave. Both girls left at the end of Sec 1.
It isn't about being heartless. It is really to help the girls. The judgment call involves considering the risks/benefits of IP for girls who can't keep up. If you are borderline pass all the way to J2, you jeopardise your As. Better to go 'O' level route and still have your 'O's.
I remember being very angry. For 2 weeks leading up to the exams, the girls were made to train up to 8pm at night and from 9am to 7pm on Sat and Sun. My daughter cried because she had no time to study. Because she cried, I defended her and I made clear to the school that she was not going to train those crazy hours. The other girl in her CCA did not have a Tigress Mother like me to defend her cub. She failed half the subjects with below 50. More importantly, she was below the 65 cutoff in BOTH English and Math. She was asked to leave.
What made me really mad was that the girl had also cried in order to be allowed to study... but some other interfering and powerful parent (who for some reason wanted badly for the team to win gold) bullied her into submission. My daughter was pressured too. The parent told my dauhter \"If you refuse to train, you may not be allowed to compete next year and your friends may not like you anymore. They might ostracise you.\"
My response was \"Oh dear! You better train.\" My husband's response was \"Try us!\" and then he told me \"You need to go face that parent and protect my daughter. Don't be a chicken.\"
In the end, I asked my daughter what she wanted. \"You want to study? Or you want to train? Because I think Mommy can accept an academic failure this once because of your training. But you must decide.\" She wanted to study and so I defended her choice.
I feel a bit scared now that I think back. I was actually ready to accept that my daughter fail because I didn't know about the seriousness of this culling business. We were lucky she chose to study. We were lucky that I decided to fight for her. Else, the one being asked to leave, could well be my daughter.
Then again... it wouldn't do for the 250+ student to begin to think it's in the pocket. Lots of things happen in adolescence. Those who choose IP need to know that borderline is not enough to stay in IP. It's not a case of you make it into IP, you're made for 6 years. Cannot be complacent. Must maintain standard of PSLE through the 6 years.
I still think the school is an excellent school, and my daughter had 4 years of fun there. Work hard. Play hard. Even in good schools, mistakes happen. The Teacher-in-Charge (who was herself very new) left the school the year after and the administration of the CCA was much improved, and for the 3 years after, there were no such cases. And the bullying parent volunteer was also absent from practices the year after. She was almost camping in on practices the year before. -
Chenonceau:
No... not a lot. Both were DSA cases. Champion sports girls who didn't make the cut off by a pretty long shot. Since then, I think schools have tightened up on DSA too... lower cut off but still a discriminating cut off. This prevents the trauma I saw the girls go through. It's like being expelled.
There shouldn't be alot of such cases. I would expect most students that have psle t-score of 250 and above to get their A levels easily.WeiHan:
[quote=\"Chenonceau\"]
Happened to 2 girls I know. Can't tell you which school lah... Borderline 65 is different from borderline 50. Borderline 65, you are helped but if you score less than 50 then you are asked to leave. Both girls left at the end of Sec 1.
It isn't about being heartless. It is really to help the girls. The judgment call involves considering the risks/benefits of IP for girls who can't keep up. If you are borderline pass all the way to J2, you jeopardise your As. Better to go 'O' level route and still have your 'O's.
I remember being very angry. For 2 weeks leading up to the exams, the girls were made to train up to 8pm at night and from 9am to 7pm on Sat and Sun. My daughter cried because she had no time to study. Because she cried, I defended her and I made clear to the school that she was not going to train those crazy hours. The other girl in her CCA did not have a Tigress Mother like me to defend her cub. She failed half the subjects with below 50. More importantly, she was below the 65 cutoff in BOTH English and Math. She was asked to leave.
What made me really mad was that the girl had also cried in order to be allowed to study... but some other interfering and powerful parent (who for some reason wanted badly for the team to win gold) bullied her into submission. My daughter was pressured too. The parent told my dauhter \"If you refuse to train, you may not be allowed to compete next year and your friends may not like you anymore. They might ostracise you.\"
My response was \"Oh dear! You better train.\" My husband's response was \"Try us!\" and then he told me \"You need to go face that parent and protect my daughter. Don't be a chicken.\"
In the end, I asked my daughter what she wanted. \"You want to study? Or you want to train? Because I think Mommy can accept an academic failure this once because of your training. But you must decide.\" She wanted to study and so I defended her choice.
I feel a bit scared now that I think back. I was actually ready to accept that my daughter fail because I didn't know about the seriousness of this culling business. We were lucky she chose to study. We were lucky that I decided to fight for her. Else, the one being asked to leave, could well be my daughter.
Then again... it wouldn't do for the 250+ student to begin to think it's in the pocket. Lots of things happen in adolescence. Those who choose IP need to know that borderline is not enough to stay in IP. It's not a case of you make it into IP, you're made for 6 years. Cannot be complacent. Must maintain standard of PSLE through the 6 years.
I still think the school is an excellent school, and my daughter had 4 years of fun there. Work hard. Play hard. Even in good schools, mistakes happen. The Teacher-in-Charge (who was herself very new) left the school the year after and the administration of the CCA was much improved, and for the 3 years after, there were no such cases. And the bullying parent volunteer was also absent from practices the year after. She was almost camping in on practices the year before.[/quote]Thanks Chenonceau. Good thing your dd had supportive parents. But it is scary to think that if you had given in, your dd may well have been the one asked to leave.
Did the school make it clear from the start that they would be asking the underperforming students to leave? It seems rather unfair otherwise. If the students were far from the COP to begin with, and made to practise such long hours, it makes it doubly hard for them to do well in the exams. If that's the case, then the DSA sports girls would do better to focus on studies rather than sports. -
Jtoh, the cut offs were communicated. But you know… You always think there might be some 2nd chance. At least, I myself underestimated the school’s determination to keep standards high. That’s why I want to sound this warning to parents. It’s dangerous to assume that there will be a 2nd chance. If you get a 2nd chance, it is good. Don’t count on it. It’s safer to assume no 2nd chance.
Kindness dictates that the school ask students to leave if they assess that the child is not keeping up… No matter the circumstances. Never mind that the child failed because of too much training. The black and white report card shows that the child cannot keep up. -
Chenonceau,
If the schools had informed the kids of the passing grades then it’s fair. The kids and their parents went in with their eyes open. But I can imagine it’s tough with all the training especially when your grades aren’t as good as your classmates. -
jtoh:
Thanks Chenonceau. Good thing your dd had supportive parents. But it is scary to think that if you had given in, your dd may well have been the one asked to leave.
No... not a lot. Both were DSA cases. Champion sports girls who didn't make the cut off by a pretty long shot. Since then, I think schools have tightened up on DSA too... lower cut off but still a discriminating cut off. This prevents the trauma I saw the girls go through. It's like being expelled.Chenonceau:
[quote=\"WeiHan\"]
There shouldn't be alot of such cases. I would expect most students that have psle t-score of 250 and above to get their A levels easily.
I remember being very angry. For 2 weeks leading up to the exams, the girls were made to train up to 8pm at night and from 9am to 7pm on Sat and Sun. My daughter cried because she had no time to study. Because she cried, I defended her and I made clear to the school that she was not going to train those crazy hours. The other girl in her CCA did not have a Tigress Mother like me to defend her cub. She failed half the subjects with below 50. More importantly, she was below the 65 cutoff in BOTH English and Math. She was asked to leave.
What made me really mad was that the girl had also cried in order to be allowed to study... but some other interfering and powerful parent (who for some reason wanted badly for the team to win gold) bullied her into submission. My daughter was pressured too. The parent told my dauhter \"If you refuse to train, you may not be allowed to compete next year and your friends may not like you anymore. They might ostracise you.\"
My response was \"Oh dear! You better train.\" My husband's response was \"Try us!\" and then he told me \"You need to go face that parent and protect my daughter. Don't be a chicken.\"
In the end, I asked my daughter what she wanted. \"You want to study? Or you want to train? Because I think Mommy can accept an academic failure this once because of your training. But you must decide.\" She wanted to study and so I defended her choice.
I feel a bit scared now that I think back. I was actually ready to accept that my daughter fail because I didn't know about the seriousness of this culling business. We were lucky she chose to study. We were lucky that I decided to fight for her. Else, the one being asked to leave, could well be my daughter.
Then again... it wouldn't do for the 250+ student to begin to think it's in the pocket. Lots of things happen in adolescence. Those who choose IP need to know that borderline is not enough to stay in IP. It's not a case of you make it into IP, you're made for 6 years. Cannot be complacent. Must maintain standard of PSLE through the 6 years.
I still think the school is an excellent school, and my daughter had 4 years of fun there. Work hard. Play hard. Even in good schools, mistakes happen. The Teacher-in-Charge (who was herself very new) left the school the year after and the administration of the CCA was much improved, and for the 3 years after, there were no such cases. And the bullying parent volunteer was also absent from practices the year after. She was almost camping in on practices the year before.
Did the school make it clear from the start that they would be asking the underperforming students to leave? It seems rather unfair otherwise. If the students were far from the COP to begin with, and made to practise such long hours, it makes it doubly hard for them to do well in the exams. If that's the case, then the DSA sports girls would do better to focus on studies rather than sports.[/quote]I have been curious about the performance of those that DSAed through sport into top schools. Their t-scores could be 10-20 points less than the COP. I have always thought that the schools will take special academic care for these group of students. That is how it should be. These students that have sports talent brought in honour and intangible benefits for the school spirits and in return, shouldn't the school take more care in their academic performance? -
Teehee… We don’t live in an ideal world. Competition is keen in the top schools in every aspect. Teacher performance is ranked. School performance is ranked. Academic results are ranked. Size of donations matter. Sports medals are collected and displayed. I am under no illusion that the school has my daughter’s interests at heart 100% of the time.
There are teachers who wanna log in an achievement. In this case, it would have been a nice feather in the cap for a new teacher. There was also the issue of donations. The school did not wanna offend the bullying parent because she brought in lotsa donation dollars. In the end, it was my little Sec 1 against the selfish agendas of 2 others. The Principal cannot oversee everything with 6 Sigma results.
Where my daughter has benefitted, it was when the teacher’s and the school’s agendas overlap and are coherent. Where they do not overlap, it is up to me to look out for my cub.
I remember a few make-up classes but insufficient… and really, to do well… you depend on yourself. You catch up. You get notes from your friends. You plan your project commitments by doing your part early, so that you can miss project meetings when you have to train everyday. The girls are SUPPOSED to be all rounded sports girls and top students. Every one has a heavy CCA, not just the DSA girls. If you can’t manage CCA AND studies, then a slower pace in another school is probably better because the school cannot slow down for you.
My daughter DSA-ed into her school. We were asked to sign a commitment to train as necessary and to stay with the CCA for 4 years. CCA achievement is an important part of a top school experience. Not even I expected her to rank in the top 3 places of her class in Sec 1 and Sec 2. It is thus possible to be academically top in IP even if you DSA. However, parents need to be vigilant, supportive and very loving.
The child also needs to be very driven.
I was jumping up and down when The Daughter off-handedly told me she had to stay back to get her prize for being 2nd in class. She looked at me and said "Mom, that’s nothing. Other people get top in level AND they have TWO heavy CCAs." And she wouldn’t let me go to her prize-giving because "Mom, it’s no big deal. Waste time."
Achievements are a dime a dozen in a top school. Everyone you know is good at CCA AND studies. So just because you DSA in, no one will think you need special treatment for handicapped students. You cope or you go somewhere else with a slower pace. My daughter ended in hospital with pneumonia one year. Her best friend who was Vice Head Prefect (or VP of Student Council) fainted in her home toilet before school one day. For some stretches, both girls sleep 3 hours a night only. Her best friend’s mom is a housewife who speaks only Chinese and is a non-grad. She sat in the General Office on more than one occasion to protest that her daughter was overworked. She was very brave because the Principal was someone very educated (scholar and everything).
The school’s job is to give the children opportunity after opportunity. There are countless opportunities for development. It is up to the parents to help their children focus and manage health, time, energy. You basically get a lot of choices about what you wanna be good at and the girls wanna be good at EVERYTHING. So as parents (even if not educated), we need to watch and help to balance.
The school provides the stimulation. It is up to parents to decide if too much is too much and dialogue with the school. This can be daunting especially when the teachers are themselves very educated and your child goes to school with kids of famous personalities. However, parents who do their part and dialogue with the school, can help their children shine.
In essence, the school won’t give you special treatment and I am glad it did not. It taught my daughter self-reliance and all that stretching gave her confidence, and allowed us all to understand that she could do and endure more than we ever expected. In 4 years, I only intervened 3 times to balance the demands. Each time, it was with a clear realization that this is her limit and if she is not all the way at the top, I don’t care… because one mountain has another mountain higher. -
All top schools are concerned about their rankings and name recognition.
Top schools’ atheletes, art performers and students’ leaders must bare in mind that their heavy schedules are never a reason for any academic underperformance. if for reasons parents are not confident of their kids to excel in both areas, its advisable to give top schools a wide berth.
We just hve to excercise wisdom in making impt decicions.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login