Returning S'porean kids from China

[usaik]

I know of a friend from China who is planning to relocate his kid from China.


In view of the difference in the education system, his strategy is to downgrade his kid by 1-2 level like many of his friends who relocate their kids from China to SG. By downgrading his kid by 1-2 levels, the kid would be able to cope better even though he might be able to make it at the same level in term of English. As for the other areas, this kid would actually be much more stronger than the local kids.

This strategy was recommended to him by one of his friend whose kid because of this strategy, had done very well in the Singapore Education system. The child eventually got a scholarship from Singapore to do his undergrad study in a renowed US Uni.

[JHFMum]

Poonie:

Thank you all for your feedback.


Seems like I might have to seriously think very hard before deciding to relocate with my kids. Downgrading by 1-2 levels upon return to Singapore after a few years does seem like a real possibility. Coupled with that I've also heard that they might be downgraded when they join a local school there as their Chinese standard will not be good enough to handle Maths and Science let alone yu wen as a subject . So all in they will be behind their peers by 3-5 years in future.

It really depends on the type of schs you send the kids to. I've known of friends who have been relocated there and have now returned. Their kids are doing fine in our S'pore schs- inclusive of IP and good autonmous sch. In fact instead of downgrading, the children upon their return are a yr younger than their classmates. A few things they do that you may want to consider:
- If financially possible, send them to international schools or private schs with English. In some state, we have our own S'pore schs there.
- Do not withdraw them from their current school. Instead apply for Leave of Absence. You can also request that sch sends you the worksheets, tests and exams- of course you need to pay fees.
- Alternatively, buy our S'pore textbooks and assessments books so that they remain in touch with our system, esp English.
- During vacation, let the kids return to singapore and join the school for lessons. Our terms are different from China schs. This will also let your kids touch base with their friends.

With some careful planning, you need not worry too much. China stds are pretty high too, esp Chinese, Maths and science. You only need to worry about English.

[mommyNg]

Great suggestions JHFMum!


Poonie, how old are your kids now? And which part of China you are thinking of relocating? It does seem like a lot of work to do on your part if you want to keep the option of getting your kids back to Singapore system later, but it may be well worth the effort just to keep the family together???

[allegro]

I have first hand experience in relocating to China and then back to SG again. But my kids are still quite young, one of them is back in primary school here thanks to LOA scheme. Here’s mine and some friends’ experience:


1. School in China
A lot depends on what type of schools you enrol your kids in China. Local schools - he’ll be strong in Math and Chinese. Local school with international division - kind of the middle path. Full international school - Chinese may not be the focus.

But every international school has its own strength and weakness, so it’s hard to generalise. You may be surprised to know that the Singapore school in shanghai is actually weak in English despite following the Sg’s (old) English syllabus. And the famous hongkong international school is weak in everything right up to secondary levels, except Chinese.

You can find out a lot by talking to other expats there, especially Asian expats. Parents usually only find out the real standards when their children move back home, or switch to another school, and struggle.

2. Leave of Absence scheme in Sg
I encountered a lot of difficulty getting the school here to send me up to date worksheets, tests and what-nots. I really got the impression that the school didn’t care much for LOA students, despite the govt’s sincere attempts to support us. I sent my kid back to school every summer hol, but we were really on our own. The communication was dismal, my emails went unanswered by the teachers, I had to chase (beg) repeatedly for worksheets and tests and even for a simple transitlink card! It was up to me to find out what went on in school during our absence. It’s like they know you won’t be staying long anyway, so it was all very patronizing. Quite disappointed to say the least. But of course, once we came back for good, it was a different story.

I paid fees and bought books every year, just to be in the know what was being taught in Sg.

3. Relocating back to SG
If your kid comes back by P3 or P4, there’s a good chance he can still catch up. But many S’poreans do not want to come back at P5 or P6. If at all, they will wait till after PSLE year. I have friends who successfully enrolled their kids into secondary schools in SG without having done PSLE. And the kids still come back every summer for immersion prog. These are usually your neighbourhood schools.

[mommyNg]

allegro, thanks for sharing! Did you just come back from Shanghai? I may have plans to move there, so your advice will be very useful!


1. Which schools would you recommend in Shanghai that have strong English and Maths? Have you heard about YK Pao school (that has an international division) and would you recommend it? How about Dulwich? How would you compare them? Especially if you have plans to move back to SG in the future.

2. I suppose the LoA scheme experience may differ depends on the individual schools? My dd1 went back this summer hols for P1 and the teachers and staff were very helpful. I emailed the teacher earlier in the year and sent her some dd1’s pictures and my dd’s short write-up about herself and she "introduced" my dd to the class so that when she is back she is no "stranger" to the classmates. The admin staff even offered to lend us their "spare" school uniforms since they said it didn’t make sense for us to buy new sets since we were only there for a short period of time. But I agree with you that it is hard to get worksheets and tests on a regularly basis when we were overseas, but I assumed the teachers are really overwhelmed with work at school, though my dd form teacher usually is pretty good in responding to emails.

3. So back to my question, which schools in Shanghai would you recommend that would best facilitate the moving back to SG by P4? How difficult is it to be able to enroll the kids to good SG secondary schools (such as those with IP programs) when they come back? And what should we do to help the kids? Would it be better off to enroll them in international schools instead of local neighbour schools (assuming $$$ is not an issue)…?

4. Lastly, probably a less examined but no less important issue, do kids have problems adjusting to the social demands when they move back to SG, e.g. cliques that they can’t break into, target of (relational, for girls) bully, way of teaching and communication, etc.?

Thanks!!!

[Poonie]

Thank you all for your tips and advice. My kids are in lower primary. What are the costs per annum for the various types of school? If we opt for local chinese school, will they be able to understand the Math and Science questions?


About maid - is it better to get a xiao ah yi there or bring our own maid from Singapore. Heard xiao ah yi is about SGD300. Is that true? Do they have a poor reputation? Someone advised me to make a copy of their ID but is that good enough security? As for our own maid from Singapore, do I continue to pay levy?

[allegro]

MommyNg, sounds like you are based elsewhere right now?


1. YK Pao and Dulwich - different as chalk and cheese. YK Pao tries to position themselves as the best of both worlds - local (rigorous) curriculum + international (angmoh) standards. I think they're still trying to live up to it. Friends who send their kids there say it's over-rated and over-priced.

Dulwich, together with SAS, are the 2 most highly-regarded international schools in SH so far. Pricey too. Sg friends there report their kids have not much affinity for chinese, pretty much the same way as sg kids here.

There're local schools with int'l division like Shanghai United and Shanghai High, but the verdict is still out if they're good enough to seamlessly transit the child back to Sg system.

Moving back to Sg - my kids have no problems assimilating, but maybe coz they're still young?

Poonie, legally you cannot bring your maid there to work. China will never issue work visas for foreign maids when they hv such a huge population of ppl trying to find work. If you do, you run the risk that other ayis will report on you and the family could get deported. Not worth it.

It was something I grappled with, tried to work around, in the end I just settled with hiring an ayi from Anhui. Yes they have their peculiarities, a lot of pride, and different ideas of what maids are. But overall my ayi was reliable, honest and a great cook. Over there, we always moan and joke about our ayi horror stories, end of the day, it boils down to luck and patience. Pretty much like our maid situation here too.

Yup I photostated her ID and got her home tel nbr etc. I hired her through word of mouth.

Salary - in SH, be prepared to pay RMB 1,800 to 3000 for an ayi. More if they'd worked for angmohs. Most of us hire ayis from the neighbouring provinces, not local shanghainese.

[Poonie]

Allegro, thanks.


S$300 to S$600 to hire an ah yi is not cheap! I presume this is live-in maids you are referring to.

Is the emphasis in Chinese very high in the middle-path type of schools? Is Soong Chin Ling School a middle-path type?

[allegro]

hi Poonie, Soong Ching Ling is world class. Not middle of path. It’s actually right up there, ivy league, i think better than our top preschools in sg.


There’s a local division which a lot of guanxi is needed to get in, and there’s an international div which a lot of money is needed to get in. If budget is not a problem, do visit the school and register early. I heard of cases where they "misplaced" registered forms, so you should pay fees as early as poss (not just deposit) to secure a place.


Yr other qn: Yes, chinese is strong in local schools with international division. English somewhat weaker but I think you can always beef up at home.

[Poonie]

allegro:

hi Poonie, Soong Ching Ling is world class. Not middle of path. It's actually right up there, ivy league, i think better than our top preschools in sg.


There's a local division which a lot of guanxi is needed to get in, and there's an international div which a lot of money is needed to get in. If budget is not a problem, do visit the school and register early. I heard of cases where they \"misplaced\" registered forms, so you should pay fees as early as poss (not just deposit) to secure a place.


Yr other qn: Yes, chinese is strong in local schools with international division. English somewhat weaker but I think you can always beef up at home.

Allegro (you play an instrument?)

Thanks for the info. Will check out the fee, that is if there is a Soong Ching Ling in the place we are going to. I only know there is one in Shanghai.