2009 GEP Screening And Selection

[Full.010894Cream]

ApronMama:

Those who work hard whether in GEP or non-GEP stream are usually girls.

girls tend to be more settled and matured when it comes to school. even my girl, who doesn't like to school work, will still complete all. She'll complain when we give her anything more than 'prescribed'. :lol:

[Fairy]

atutor2001:

Hi Full Cream

Those numbers are just my kay poh guess only.

However, the 50% that needs to DSA to Top school is pretty accurate because my kids ex-Pr School has GEP. I noted that generally, about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools and actually went in through DSA.

The 20% figure on \"hardworking students\" is actually feedback from students of those schools. They generally don't appreciate this group of students. Maybe they don't feel that \"hardworking\" is a form of giftness. Maybe this group spend too much time studying and did not socialise.

Regards

May I know which pri sch are your kids from?...\" about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools\" - wow, that's a lot....say, around 25 students?

In the past few years (except last year), eight out of the nine GEP schools have 2 classes of GEP students, ie. around 50 students. Only one school has 4 classes, ie. around 100 students, half of whom are from its existing P3 students. Most of them did very well and can meet the cut off point of top schools.

Not sure about the girls. The boys, definitely do not come accross as muggers to me. They play soccer almost everyday, during recess, after school, whenever there's a chance. There may be exception. Even then, I believe for those who are 'hardworking type', it is often always, the parents pushing them.

On the other hand, I know (friends' kids) of some mainstream students who are very hardworking (some are also pushed by their parents), very focus and went on to top their cohort in their respective neighbourhood schools and are in top IP schools now. I wonder if they are being appreciated in their schools.

Anyway, having kids in both streams, I do understand the sentiments at both sides of the camp.

[atutor2001]

Fairy:

May I know which pri sch are your kids from?...\" about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools\" - wow, that's a lot....say, around 25 students? ....

..... eight out of the nine GEP schools have 2 classes of GEP students, ie. around 50 students. Only one school has 4 classes, ie. around 100 students, half of whom are from its existing P3 students. Most of them did very well and can meet the cut off point of top schools.....

Hi Fairy

During my kids' time, their school had only 2 GEP classes in each cohort. 20 students per class and that is 40 students in total.

It is definitely not a Pr school that can produce 2 classes of GEP on its own. Most of the GEPers came from other school. So I am not sure was my kids' school the other end of the GEP's schools and yours the front end.

However, I only know that generally, about half of them get less than 262 in their T-score.

Regards.

PS
Can share with us the percentage of GEPers with more than 262 T-score in general.

[turquoise]

Fairy:

atutor2001:

Hi Full Cream

Those numbers are just my kay poh guess only.

However, the 50% that needs to DSA to Top school is pretty accurate because my kids ex-Pr School has GEP. I noted that generally, about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools and actually went in through DSA.

The 20% figure on \"hardworking students\" is actually feedback from students of those schools. They generally don't appreciate this group of students. Maybe they don't feel that \"hardworking\" is a form of giftness. Maybe this group spend too much time studying and did not socialise.

Regards

May I know which pri sch are your kids from?...\" about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools\" - wow, that's a lot....say, around 25 students?

In the past few years (except last year), eight out of the nine GEP schools have 2 classes of GEP students, ie. around 50 students. Only one school has 4 classes, ie. around 100 students, half of whom are from its existing P3 students. Most of them did very well and can meet the cut off point of top schools.

Not sure about the girls. The boys, definitely do not come accross as muggers to me. They play soccer almost everyday, during recess, after school, whenever there's a chance. There may be exception. Even then, I believe for those who are 'hardworking type', it is often always, the parents pushing them.

On the other hand, I know (friends' kids) of some mainstream students who are very hardworking (some are also pushed by their parents), very focus and went on to top their cohort in their respective neighbourhood schools and are in top IP schools now. I wonder if they are being appreciated in their schools.

Anyway, having kids in both streams, I do understand the sentiments at both sides of the camp.

I agree with Fairy. Most of the GEP kids in my dd's school last year could make it to the top IP schools based on PSLE results. And they're definitely not all muggers. Some are, of course. Others are very playful, enjoying themselves during and after school.

Fairy, what do you mean by \"except for last year\", 8 of the 9 centres had 2 classes each?

[Fairy]

turquoise:

Fairy:

[quote=\"atutor2001\"]
Hi Full Cream

Those numbers are just my kay poh guess only.

However, the 50% that needs to DSA to Top school is pretty accurate because my kids ex-Pr School has GEP. I noted that generally, about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools and actually went in through DSA.

The 20% figure on \"hardworking students\" is actually feedback from students of those schools. They generally don't appreciate this group of students. Maybe they don't feel that \"hardworking\" is a form of giftness. Maybe this group spend too much time studying and did not socialise.

Regards

May I know which pri sch are your kids from?...\" about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools\" - wow, that's a lot....say, around 25 students?

In the past few years (except last year), eight out of the nine GEP schools have 2 classes of GEP students, ie. around 50 students. Only one school has 4 classes, ie. around 100 students, half of whom are from its existing P3 students. Most of them did very well and can meet the cut off point of top schools.

Not sure about the girls. The boys, definitely do not come accross as muggers to me. They play soccer almost everyday, during recess, after school, whenever there's a chance. There may be exception. Even then, I believe for those who are 'hardworking type', it is often always, the parents pushing them.

On the other hand, I know (friends' kids) of some mainstream students who are very hardworking (some are also pushed by their parents), very focus and went on to top their cohort in their respective neighbourhood schools and are in top IP schools now. I wonder if they are being appreciated in their schools.

Anyway, having kids in both streams, I do understand the sentiments at both sides of the camp.

I agree with Fairy. Most of the GEP kids in my dd's school last year could make it to the top IP schools based on PSLE results. And they're definitely not all muggers. Some are, of course. Others are very playful, enjoying themselves during and after school.

Fairy, what do you mean by \"except for last year\", 8 of the 9 centres had 2 classes each?[/quote]If I'm not wrong, another school has 3 P4 GEP classes last year. Not sure how many students in a class though.

[vlim]

atutor2001:

Fairy:

May I know which pri sch are your kids from?...\" about half of the \"gifted\" cohort did not meet the entry point of the Top schools\" - wow, that's a lot....say, around 25 students? ....

..... eight out of the nine GEP schools have 2 classes of GEP students, ie. around 50 students. Only one school has 4 classes, ie. around 100 students, half of whom are from its existing P3 students. Most of them did very well and can meet the cut off point of top schools.....

Hi Fairy

During my kids' time, their school had only 2 GEP classes in each cohort. 20 students per class and that is 40 students in total.

It is definitely not a Pr school that can produce 2 classes of GEP on its own. Most of the GEPers came from other school. So I am not sure was my kids' school the other end of the GEP's schools and yours the front end.

However, I only know that generally, about half of them get less than 261 in their T-score.

Regards.

PS
Can share with us the percentage of GEPers with more than 261 T-score in general.

well I think we got to be fair to these gep kids also as a lot of their time are spend in doing projects and other enrichment assignments till mid p6... so they do not have the time which the mainstream students have for preparing for the psle... and there again as mentioned before and before getting straight a's is not the goal for gep and further more most gep kids are able to get to their dream sec school thru dsa as the ip sec school acknowledge the tough training/advance learning these kids have gone thru.. so somehow it compromise ....

[turquoise]

Fairy:

If I'm not wrong, another school has 3 P4 GEP classes last year. Not sure how many students in a class though.

Hi Fairy,

RGPS has always had 3 GEP classes. It's the only all-girls GEP school.

[atutor2001]

vlim:

...well I think we got to be fair to these gep kids also as a lot of their time are spend in doing projects and other enrichment assignments till mid p6... so they do not have the time which the mainstream students have for preparing for the psle... and there again as mentioned before and before getting straight a's is not the goal for gep and further more most gep kids are able to get to their dream sec school thru dsa as the ip sec school acknowledge the tough training/advance learning these kids have gone thru.. so somehow it compromise ....

Hi vlim

Thanks for bringing out the point I was hoping to bring out without offending anybody.

When a kid is above average but not exactly gifted, they will suffer given the extra workload.

For the very gifted, the extra workload is a breeze. For the hardworking ones, they will survive. However, for the others, their results in PSLE will be affected - maybe that is why MOE give special DSA to GEPers in compensation for the extra workload.

For my friends' kids, the end was bad. GEPers are a very close group and they seems to know each other even those from other schools. (Anybody can share how the network is like?). To kaypoh for his performance, all I did is to ask some other GEPers (not from the same JC) I wondered what is the effect on his self-esteem at the end.

Regards.

[corneyAmber]

rains:

vlim:

well maybe we as a parent need to be relax and happy first before we can make our kids relax and happy.... I had heard someone saying .. ' live as if today is the last day of your life'.. so treasure whatever u have and live happily ... ha haaaaa ... sorry if I am not in the same track as what u guys are discussing

I always thought care needs to be exercised when you use that line 'live as if today is the last day of your life'. When I was a teenager, I took it as 'don't bother to plan too much and don't need to study hard. For all I know, tomorrow I die liao'. So I always never did well in my studies.

That was because you had missed the part 2 to this saying...

\"Dream as if you'll live forever..\"

[corneyAmber]

atutor2001:

Are ALL kids selected for GEP really comparatively MORE gifted than those kids not selected? Lets look at the selection criteria from MOE site :


Who is an exceptionally gifted child?

An exceptionally gifted child is one whose intellectual ability is significantly advanced. Some common characteristics of exceptionally gifted children include:

1. an extraordinary speed in processing information
2. an ability to relate to a broad range of ideas and synthesise commonalities among them
3. a high degree of ability to think abstractly which develops early
4. an extraordinary degree of intellectual curiosity
5. an unusual capacity for memory
6. a long concentration span
7. a fascination with ideas and words
8. an extensive vocabulary.

If we look closer at the selection guide and the method of testing for identification of gifted kid, we will find that for a kid to be identified as gifted, he/she needs to have a very good command of English at P3 because the test is conducted in English. The top gifted kid from China will probably fail the tests.

Among my friends and peers, I find that only those who speak good English or who are very particular about language have \"gifted\" kids.

As usual, my kap poh self made me follow the development of the \"gifted kids\". My observation :

1. About 50% of the gifted kids need DSA to enter the Top school
2. 20% of the gifted kids are just simply hardworking
3. Top 30% are really gifted - self motivated, good time management, ...

So when they casted the net and caught 100 fishes, only about 30 of the fishes are what they are looking for. Therefore, it is quite easy to train an above average kid to be selected for GEP.

However, there are drawbacks to take up GEP if the child is not really gifted (especially for boys - based on real life examples I have witnessed) :

- too lazy (not unable to) to catch up with the work
- think that he is really gifted & becomes complacent
- feeling lousy as there is no way to match the real gifted

Those poor gifted boys I know barely passed their A level. Now the parents have to send them overseas as they can't qualify for local U.
Their results might have been much better if their heads did not swell thinking that they are gifted. Just some observations to share.

We might be going a little into \"analysis paralysis\" syndrome here on GEP. To me, we assume the GEP system is fair unless we have a better way to offer. Problem definition is always the easy part, providing the solution is tough. It does not bother me who gets into the GEP because anyone who enters the programme has a price to pay whether truly gifted or not:

1. Labelling
2. High expectations of being super in everything, mentally and sometimes even physically
3. Higher esteem roller coaster
4. Hard to stay low profile
5. Growing up not so ideally.......subject to further criticisms
6. Become big talking point for people and constantly being monitored

So to me even if the wrong candidates get into the programme, they have to pay the price for it, not in monetary terms but in worser terms.

I believe being gifted and talented also means one has to know how to carry the gift.

With the above, staying in mainstream and excel has alot of more merits.