Parents, not enrichment centres, are key to result

[Chenonceau]

Sun_2010:

PSLE questions do not need simultaneous equations. Such questions can be solved without using simultaneous equations, though at times some ( only 1 or 2) can be more easily solved using simultaneous equations than other hueristics.

Some children do make mistakes when they use alzebra because their concept isnt strong. A strong foundation in models helps in internalising the problem, then alzebra is a breeze.

This thing keeps coming back so it's probably something to be wary of. I'll make sure I check this with my DS. He's pretty good at models already but he has a preference for branching. We encountered 2 questions that was solved much faster using simultaneous equations... So we thought maybe a good idea to master that too. But I'll watch and note that this method has it's downside. He has time anyway to develop some competence by end of year.

I reckon many of us have pet methods. DS likes branching. Some people here like models. Piggy likes algebra. Others like unitary. I'll just give DS a skim through of all and see how he feels. He is as much pilot of this as I am. He'll tell me if it's something he doesn't like. Then we can discuss.

But I do recognize that DS has a strong foundation in Math and a good feel for numbers. His Dad is good at Math and Dad has said that DS brain works strangely but not ineffectively. So, maybe those whose kids have a poorer foundation may wanna note that it could be confusing to have at hand so many methods to choose from.

[Chenonceau]

linden2000:

Looking at the Maths school textbook and workbook just sets me thinking if questions/sums of exam paper difficulty levels could not be incorporated into the school texts. If there is a need to differentiate higher difficulty, group them into a section by themselves under each topic if need be. That way children from low income families who are unable to afford assessment books, past year exam papers or tuition can have access to such material. Then they can self-study or seek help if they need to. They can't seek help if they do not even know what to ask.

Yes... That is exactly what I meant when I suggested better textbooks. When my son failed Paper 2, he thought it was because he wasn't one of the smart ones. He didn't even know what he didn't know because textbooks gave no clue. We had to analyze the paper, pray and ask friends. The poor child in a low income home won't have these people rallying around. Give that child a life line to success that is within his capability.

[Chenonceau]

Sun_2010:

Ksi, Chen,


It has been stimulating reading this thread. While I tend to disagree with some points, they have made me think and analyse my stand - and i realise at times my opinion is just my perspective , based on my love for maths and coloured by my experience of PSLE in 2010.

I think people disagree because we all have different life experiences, and we all have different core beliefs. The Mommies who dun think heuristics are helpful are those who are strong in Math... Ksi, Wonderm, Piggy, yourself. I am not strong in Math so I couldn't help him except by giving him these. Once I gave him the different methods, he just took off. That was my experience you see.

Next, some of us differ in whether we believe in innate talent. Many believe that talent and aptitude define everything. I don't. I think the part played by nurture is far greater. This means that I won't accept the explanation - no aptitude or not smart enough. I'll say, you practice till the aptitude comes. DD found a job as a waitress. Was scolded everyday for a month. I wouldn't let her give up. Even if it is waitressing an you suck at it, if you stick with it long enough, you'll get good.

Core beliefs are also defined by personal experience. When I was little, I was known to be not bright. Till today, I think I am not bright. But I worked very hard and didn't do too badly. So I tell my son that since he is my son, he is not bright, but we can make up for it with practice and exposure.

I think it is normal to disagree. The world is rich in its diversity and the only way to fully enjoy it is to grasp the realities of other people by first disagreeing and then integrating.

[coast]

ksi:

Coast, the discussion so far is not an emphasis on asking for more materials to be produced by MOE, we have been discussing the \"untaught\" heuristics as being a critical point to ensure better results and some of us here say \"No\". More importantly, deliver a good job in concept learning so that kids can interpret question well and solve the problems with understanding.

It is good to read about the examples of children without tuition for heuristics can still manage A/A* for PSLE Math.

Hi ksi,

Actually that is my emphasis (Chenonceau pushes for it too ... she has quoted personal examples that her DS's school is not providing adequate resources for Maths and Chinese).

I agree it is very important to learn and master concept.

I also agree children without tuition can still manage A/A* for PSLE Math. But did they get good materials from schools? Did they have a dedicated teacher who teach beyond textbooks? I know of schools using external (OnSponge, A*, ...) for some classes and schools developing their own internal materials. These schools PROVIDE adequate materials.

If you look at the textbooks (not the school's own materials), are they adequate? If they are, why would schools have to develop own materials ... rely on external materials?

We need to give every child an EQUAL chance at PSLE. Not because which school or class he belongs to.

Just calling for an EQUAL chance ... providing adequate materials to ALL students is a good start ... nope?

[Chenonceau]

chamonix:

Chenonceau:

Hah? Really ah... Must wait for Piggy to wake up and come on line. Her DS is a GEPper. She might know for sure. Actually, I dun really care if GEP learns more as long as what more they cover ain't in the PSLE.

Don't flame me lah... Perhaps different GEP centres teach differently?

Chenonceau:

But if they cover simultaneous equations then the PSLE needs those. And mainstream doesn't cover them. DS is learning himself from a secondary textbook.

Your son is already receiving top notch training. :rahrah:

I dun think Piggy will flame you lah.... But she'll know better than me about GEP lor... I dunno that he receives any training though... He has to teach himself 3 subjects 'cos I am only good at one - English.

[metz]

Chenonceau:

I dun think Piggy will flame you lah.... But she'll know better than me about GEP lor... I dunno that he receives any training though... He has to teach himself 3 subjects 'cos I am only good at one - English.

I am not referring to you training him. Rather, I consider giving the child an opportunity to learn on his/her own is itself the highest form of training. Hmm, maybe I am not making sense here... been away from the system for too long

[coast]

linden2000:

Chenonceau:

I was very puzzled as to why my son failed Paper 2 in early P5 when he had mastered everything the school had taught.

I had the exact same experience with my son last year. He too failed P5 Paper 2 and as a result, the Maths paper overall. I too was puzzled because I had all along thought that he already knew the material from the school Maths texts. After sitting down to look through the paper did I realise that the difficulty of the problem sums tested in the exam are definitely beyond what is in the texts.

That's when I started looking for resources to help my son bridge the gap. We did find onsponge useful in that aspect. To us, heuristics or not, onsponge is useful because it teaches the techniques categorised by topics.

Looking at the Maths school textbook and workbook just sets me thinking if questions/sums of exam paper difficulty levels could not be incorporated into the school texts. If there is a need to differentiate higher difficulty, group them into a section by themselves under each topic if need be. That way children from low income families who are unable to afford assessment books, past year exam papers or tuition can have access to such material. Then they can self-study or seek help if they need to. They can't seek help if they do not even know what to ask.

:goodpost:

Thank you for sharing. Many children (not just those from low income families) will benefit from adequate materials.

\"Then they can self-study or seek help if they need to. They can't seek help if they do not even know what to ask\"

Couldn't agree more

[Chenonceau]

chamonix:

Chenonceau:

I dun think Piggy will flame you lah.... But she'll know better than me about GEP lor... I dunno that he receives any training though... He has to teach himself 3 subjects 'cos I am only good at one - English.

I am not referring to you training him. Rather, I consider giving the child an opportunity to learn on his/her own is itself the highest form of training. Hmm, maybe I am not making sense here... been away from the system for too long

:hi5: You make perfect sense because I thought so too. That's why I insisted on no tutor even though we can well afford the best tutors. He will get whatever score he'll get but without a tutor. Even if he doesn't do well in PSLE, he will take off in secondary school because he knows how to learn by himself.

[Mychildren]

HI Chenonceau,

You've voiced out most of the things that I want to say......Good!!!
I now reading through this topic. Will give my opinion once I finished reading.

[Chenonceau]

coast:

ksi:

Coast, the discussion so far is not an emphasis on asking for more materials to be produced by MOE, we have been discussing the \"untaught\" heuristics as being a critical point to ensure better results and some of us here say \"No\". More importantly, deliver a good job in concept learning so that kids can interpret question well and solve the problems with understanding.

It is good to read about the examples of children without tuition for heuristics can still manage A/A* for PSLE Math.

Hi ksi,

Actually that is my emphasis (Chenonceau pushes for it too ... she has quoted personal examples that her DS's school is not providing adequate resources for Maths and Chinese).

I agree it is very important to learn and master concept.

I also agree children without tuition can still manage A/A* for PSLE Math. But did they get good materials from schools? Did they have a dedicated teacher who teach beyond textbooks? I know of schools using external (OnSponge, A*, ...) for some classes and schools developing their own internal materials. These schools PROVIDE adequate materials.

If you look at the textbooks (not the school's own materials), are they adequate? If they are, why would schools have to develop own materials ... rely on external materials?

We need to give every child an EQUAL chance at PSLE. Not because which school or class he belongs to.

Just calling for an EQUAL chance ... providing adequate materials to ALL students is a good start ... nope?

Someone offered me non-decaf coffee at dinner when I asked for decaf. As a result, I am wide awake and haven't been able to sleep a wink. So, if I may, I would like to try my hand at integrating the discussion.

Better Materials
There seems to be a general consensus that this is desirable because as I look back at the posts, many Mommies do think the textbooks are insufficient. In another thread, I believed ksi also said this... ksi, do correct me if I am wrong.

To Teach Heuristics or Not
(1) People seem to agree that until there has been adequate concept mastery, it is better to stay away from heuristics.
(2) I have learnt from ksi, sun and wonderm that heuristics may be confusing for the weaker students.
(3) I believe (again pls correct if wrong) ksi has come to the realization that some heuristics UNtaught in P5 can mean the difference between pass and fail.
(4) Many Mommies have vouched for Onsponge as a good (if not necessary) resource for math heuristic.
(5) I have also learnt from Sun that modelling alone is sufficient for PSLE but other methods may be faster (so I'm still gonna expose my DS and then see how, since he does have a good Math foundation)

GEP Vs Mainstream
The discussion is not full enough so I find it hard to integrate.


So I suppose, all round, we have enriched each other's perspectives by sharing the little worlds we are all prisoner of.