Child Underperforms Because Tested Above Cognitive Level

[jedamum]

doodbug:

My impression of STELLAR is that there is much potential in the program, to incalculate an appreciation for the Language, to hone technical grammatical skills, and it exposes children to a range of vocabulary. However, correct me if I am wrong, the concern with STELLAR is the uneven application or adoption of this program across the schools, or even across the different cohorts within a school. In my son's school, the STELLAR booklets used every year are different. I have no problems with the materials that my son receives or is using; however an upper Primary kid's mommy does not like the STELLAR system at all, because the materials for her kid's level are much weaker.

:goodpost:
i have seen the Stellar worksheets of my nephew's sch and my boy's sch last year and the standard was distinctively different.

[doodbug]

jedamum:

doodbug:

My impression of STELLAR is that there is much potential in the program, to incalculate an appreciation for the Language, to hone technical grammatical skills, and it exposes children to a range of vocabulary. However, correct me if I am wrong, the concern with STELLAR is the uneven application or adoption of this program across the schools, or even across the different cohorts within a school. In my son's school, the STELLAR booklets used every year are different. I have no problems with the materials that my son receives or is using; however an upper Primary kid's mommy does not like the STELLAR system at all, because the materials for her kid's level are much weaker.

:goodpost:
i have seen the Stellar worksheets of my nephew's sch and my boy's sch last year and the standard was distinctively different.

What is common, are the big books!

[Chenonceau]

(1) How many schools have Stellar?

(2) How many teachers deliver Stellar they way it should be delivered?

My DS is in P6… 2nd best class of the his cohort. This is his English homework. 3 short newspaper articles (each about 5 to 6 cm of print). Write 5 sentences about your thoughts. Clearly, teacher didn’t wanna mark too much but had a quota of homework pieces to give.

This is the kind of homework P6-es get when they have to face PSLE at the end of this year.

[doodbug]

Chenonceau:

(1) How many schools have Stellar?

(2) How many teachers deliver Stellar they way it should be delivered?

My DS is in P6... 2nd best class of the his cohort. This is his English homework. 3 short newspaper articles (each about 5 to 6 cm of print). Write 5 sentences about your thoughts. Clearly, teacher didn't wanna mark too much but had a quota of homework pieces to give.

This one sounds like a random assignment to me, heh.
If that's all to the instructions, it sounds pretty directionless.
But you know, we're a pretty compliant nation. It's not in our consciousness to ask why we have to do certain things or whether there is any learning value, and many of us accept 'because teacher says so' as sufficient reason to accept.

[buds]

Chenonceau:

Buds... I know you've had great experiences. I know also you know how to manage Teachers... and schools.

Chenonceau babe.. :hugs: Don't get me wrong, having many good experiences does not mean that we never had negative ones. In fact we had one or two that was worth a public apology. I suppose it's not reali about how to manage teachers and schools (cos i don't know how to do that :scratchhead: ) but i guess it could be abt managing expectations. Mebbe because i have no particular expectations. Can liddat? :skeptical:

Chenonceau:

It doesn't mean the system has no problems. We're not talking about the same thing so we can actually agree. You see your tree and it is a beautiful tree. I am trying to see the forest.

Hmmm.. i have always agreed with you on this girl, that i didn't mean to say the system has no problems. I mean which system doesn't right? By forest we mean to say... 100 over primary schools, perhaps? So if i have 20 friends from 20 different neighbourhood n SAP schools that means still got hope? :please:

While my children and my friends' children enjoy their beautiful trees, i listen ... i read.. i try to understand the why the other trees are falling sick or have fallen sick.

Chenonceau:

I agree you have a lovely tree. I agree with that there are many lovely trees around just like yours... and many are unknown neighbourhood schools. But there are many many sick trees in the forest too.

While i've heard few sick trees in the forest (and mostly from SAP schools) again i agree that there ARE sick trees. However, i do notice that it is not about the school as a whole sometimes or not about just the system at times.. it's more about teachers perhaps.. specific teachers. Sick teachers?

Could it be that just some teachers just cannot make it?

Passed through the system and the testing and thrown into the forest.. lost?

We may each have one very bad experience that may have been detrimental to our child's learning that may not necessarily be a school problem or a system crutch.. mebbe? I'm just thinking aloud..

Cos we had a few of our own and moved on.

*The specific ppl eventually left the industry. Yup. For good.*
In this case it is reali good riddance. :torchme:

Chenonceau:

Ads such as the following don't happen if the SYSTEM is robust. http://i42.tinypic.com/1t379v.jpg\">

Mine doesn't attend any so i won't comment on the above.

Chenonceau:

Further, you have stated that your school WRITES good materials. My questions are...

Aaaah.. here's the beauty i noticed about the writing. It's not one person's writing. They are shared writings. Shared materials. Shared resources. Everyone seems to chip in some and HODs collate to make one solid wan. This is what you want MOE to do? Mebbe to expect a revolutionary change from the top is wee bit challenging..? Perhaps it could start from the ground like within schools? Then the schools submit to MOE and MOE's curriculum specialists get down to standardizing one solid material based on every educator's resources?

This was how my curriculum planning got formulated. (during my teaching days) And yes, after that everybody shared... and yes, everybody benefitted, teachers and children included. Execution is an entirely different thing though, cos there were still major complains abt some teachers. So, i see it as a ppl problem more than a system problem cos we had everything in place.

Chenonceau:

(1) Should teachers be expected to TEACH, MARK, COUNSEL... and WRITE?

Because every dept and every teacher had their fair share of sharing and responsibilities fulfilled, they teach... and from the heart... they mark... conscientiously every single sentence in every composition my children have written (immediate reflection of errors and of what kind) plus feedback... they counsel... when children have a bad day or if there were mini kiddie-scuffles on and off (values inculcation in play) and they may have time to write one or two extras for projects they just know the children will love doing with the extra time.

Again, just sharing arh.. :scared:

Expected? Perhaps yes.. cos when i first started teaching, we WERE expected to prepare our own. We were ranked by Grades that enables us to move up the ladder.. to move up salary scale via further studies and also pure hard work and creativity. But still, then... all the teachers shared. Mebbe kampong days got more spirit.

Chenonceau:

(2) Should teachers test beyond what they teach?

Of course not. It's like asking a receptionist to do accounting work.

Chenonceau:

(3) How many schools run Stellar?

To date, not all yet. Since some of my friends say they still gotta purchase English textbooks.

Chenonceau:

(4) How many teachers run Stellar the way it should be run?

Aaaahh.. this is where the issue lies. Because there's no proper evaluation and may i just quote doodbug on this... she mentioned uneven application... which i agree with and i suppose is a people problem. Given that DDs school has same materials across levels there will be teachers who may not execute them correctly or with the same measure of passion? During my teaching days, there will be officers from HQ who will just come without telling you when :nailbite: to see how your class was conducted.. whether it was as per the schedule set for the day (according to your lesson plan) and whether the materials given or prepared were used as per instruction. We'd be counseled and advised accordingly after lunch. They come again scheduled so you can be more on the ball (that someone is checking :evil:) and a few more un-scheduled ones until the end of your career with the company. Supervisors included. So weighing scale isn't tipped.

Chenonceau:

It's no use talking about single trees (your tree and your friends' trees or the GEP special tree) when so many other trees in the forest are sick.

Sorry.. sorry.. :salute:



I was just responding to posts and not in any way wanting to cross your path intentionally.. cos i know you're upset with something.. someone.. in your DS school and yes in your words, the system in general... which you hope to be really world class when they dare print it so. :hugs:

Chenonceau:

If tomorrow, your school Principal were replaced, and a lousy Principal came in and thus, your kids had to go through a hard time, then what'll you do? Put your kids in the school your current Principal goes to?

Actually, with regards to this.. both DDs schools have had change of principal but no change in school system. Better yes. Again maybe just a lucky streak but doesn't mean we'd be lucky all the time..

Chenonceau:

My DS has no Stellar. His English teacher makes spelling mistakes that HE does not make. His Chinese teacher asks the class to contribute tuition materials for sharing. His Math teacher says \"This kind of questions, we have not covered\" but that exact type of question was asked in the exam 2 weeks later.

Do you see this as the teachers themselves being incapable or handicapped in a way... because they cannot teach properly or because they dunno how to plan or write materials.. because no teachers in the school is sharing resources with anyone..? Are these traits evident in all the teachers in your DS' school or just the ones teaching DS' class?

Btw, his Maths teacher super.. dare to say liddat some more. :roll: I'd be freaking :mad: pissed too if i were you! :hugs:

Chenonceau:

Your tree is not sick, but it could get sick unless there are systemic mechanisms to strengthen every school and every teacher NO MATTER where in the country.

Yes i understand that.. and each time i tread into one of your determined posts, as i respond to posts from yours and others.. i honestly try to understand why and where you are coming from.. the roots of those trees.. but i guess i may be perceived only as saying the good stuff for the sake of it, but it's reali not like that. I believe that people can make the difference (as u can see from the experiences i've shared) and if you strongly believe better people in the overheads can make the difference, can make positive change, can make for a better system so that everyone benefits... i believe you. Then we need to either get the right people there, or get the right people to listen so they too believe. And how would they believe? By researching into these schools that have made learning so joyful for children and collating them.. putting them as a chop and endorsed MOE copyright material. Give due credit to the school.. the writers (the teachers) who care to write/share them in the materials/texts. I wasn't given credit for mine, what more royalties.. but not that i mind cos i know the children from then on benefitted from my generosity. Many have asked but i choose to see it positively. Consider that my contribution to the industry. No hard feelings.

Chenonceau:

My DS' school had a great Principal 7 years ago. The compo materials that he was given in P3 and P4 are about as old. DS gets no Chinese compo materials AT ALL. The school doesn't WRITE them. Principals move around. If or when your school gets a lousy Principal who hires prostitutes and believes in teaching from the textbooks only etc... what would you do? Go and manage the Principal? What is happening to me and my DS... psle2011mum... beanbear... janet... can well happen to you.

Yup, agree. It can happen to us. But it didn't happen. Hopefully not now or in the future. I also don't wish it upon any other parents or children. But that's a matter of morals of one person and his integrity... again not the whole pool of teachers in his school to be blamed or inflicted in the saga together with him. He spoiled his own soup... his other cooks are not to be blamed, right?

Chenonceau:

It just takes one change of Principal. Unless there are other non-human strengtheners of the system.
(1) better textbooks
(2) better policies on teaching and testing
(3) e-sharing platform for teachers

AGREE on all three counts. :snuggles:

And may i add... some form of evaluation or appraisal (system or committee) as well so everyone's accountable on what goes on in the \"teaching\".

[Chenonceau]

buds:

Chenonceau:

It just takes one change of Principal. Unless there are other non-human strengtheners of the system.
(1) better textbooks
(2) better policies on teaching and testing
(3) e-sharing platform for teachers

AGREE on all three counts. :snuggles:

And may i add... some form of evaluation or appraisal (system or committee) as well so everyone's accountable on what goes on in the \"teaching\".

That we agree on this part is most important to me. For the rest, I do agree that individual teachers make a difference. DS' teacher in P3 and P4 was lovely. We've ALREADY bought her Teacher's Day present even though she doesn't teach him anymore. However, SHE is not promoted fast, if at all.

I do agree that some schools are doing a great job (and they mayn't even be branded schools at all).

Would your school agree to photocopy all its writings and distribute to teachers in my DS' school? If not (for whatever the reason) you have your answer on sharing lor... Principals can ensure that Teachers share. For sure, last year, DS' Chinese dept didn't share much... But who ensures schools share?

I tend to believe that the point of highest leverage is at the top. You and I can only fix 1 or 2 teachers problems... but until a systemic strengthener goes in, many many teachers will fall between the gaps. Only at the very top is there enough power to slide in a systemic strengthener.

[buds]

On a side note… is it still like that for DS class n teachers after u feedback to them?

[Chenonceau]

buds:

On a side note.. is it still like that for DS class n teachers after u feedback to them?

Yes. And my DS got scolded by his CL teacher for being \"mafan\".

[violin_lover]

Chenonceau:

buds:

On a side note.. is it still like that for DS class n teachers after u feedback to them?

Yes. And my DS got scolded by his CL teacher for being \"mafan\".

You should bring this up to the principal. The CL teacher should be counselled :mad:

[Chenonceau]

violin_lover:

Chenonceau:

[quote=\"buds\"]On a side note.. is it still like that for DS class n teachers after u feedback to them?

Yes. And my DS got scolded by his CL teacher for being \"mafan\".

You should bring this up to the principal. The CL teacher should be counselled :mad:[/quote]I don't blame her. If the school does not gather people to write and share materials, where is she gonna get them to give out? If I complain to Principal, the TEACHER will kena when actually, it's simply that there are NO materials to give out.