City Harvest's founder Kong Hee & 4 others arrested/charged
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blessed777:
Well you see....the problem is that words can be interpreted differently. the mainstream christians will argue that people like KH does not abey the words of God..but KH et al, will argue that it is the other way round and they think they are the best christians around.Disobedient Christian go to hell, the tesmony by Jennifer Perez:
That is why I don' think spirituality is about how knowledgeable one is with the scriptures and how well he/she can quote from it. It is about how much kinder and compassionate the person has transform into....the peaceful bliss that he starts to enjoy and the wisdom that starts to glow forth that enable him to manage life many adversities and to help others. -
kwcllf:
\"Buddhists may repeat life cycles and still not reach Nirvana. Christians go to heaven after death\". I think this is a very sweeping statement.
kwcllf: Please re-read the post I was specifically responding to. I am not making a statement in isolation. blessed777 elaborated very clearly on the Christian concept of grace, going to heaven straight after death (no rebirth) etc.
As for searching on the internet, it's just a simple convenient tool. If you feel it is not good enough for you, feel free to read up books if you wish. -
WeiHan:
i agree, knowledge of the scriptures is only a first step, the more important step is to let the scriptures transform us.. when we can love others like how God love them then others can see how our life hv been transformed by His love...
:
Well you see....the problem is that words can be interpreted differently. the mainstream christians will argue that people like KH does not abey the words of God..but KH et al, will argue that it is the other way round and they think they are the best christians around.
That is why I don' think spirituality is about how knowledgeable one is with the scriptures and how well he/she can quote from it. It is about how much kinder and compassionate the person has transform into....the peaceful bliss that he starts to enjoy and the wisdom that starts to glow forth that enable him to manage life many adversities and to help others. -
WeiHan:
It doesn't matter who interpretes what. At the end of the day, it's the 'head of household' who has the last say. Like we often hear parents tell their kids, if you misbehave, you'll get it when we go home!
Well you see....the problem is that words can be interpreted differently. the mainstream christians will argue that people like KH does not abey the words of God..but KH et al, will argue that it is the other way round and they think they are the best christians around.blessed777:
Disobedient Christian go to hell, the tesmony by Jennifer Perez:
That is why I don' think spirituality is about how knowledgeable one is with the scriptures and how well he/she can quote from it. It is about how much kinder and compassionate the person has transform into....the peaceful bliss that he starts to enjoy and the wisdom that starts to glow forth that enable him to manage life many adversities and to help others.
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empressplace:
Buddhists may repeat life cycles and still not reach Nirvana. Christians go to heaven after death.empressplace:
Um, sorry, but excuse me hor... your first post as quoted here invites controversy, not just because it is so short to explain what one religion is all about, but it is worded in such a way that makes the reader feel you are trying to imply one is more superior to the other. Whilst your explanation seems fair, it doesn't seem to explain your first comment very well.My point is simple. Christian and Buddhist teachings at their core are different. As I said, moral teachings seem about the same but at the core, there are fundamental differences between the Buddhist and Christian beliefs in terms of reincarnation, life and suffering, personal effort versus grace etc.
Let's acknowledge the differences and not gloss over them. Anyway, no need to argue over this. A simple internet search would give some pointers.
The controversy lies in your use of words. If you may allow me to point out specifically, the negative conations in the first sentence: the words 'may', and 'still not', verses the more certainty in tone and positive conation of the word 'heaven' in the second.
I think this is the reason why some may feel offended and why MOD has been asking us to steer clear of making sensitive comments, and in this case, comparing one religion to another.
JMHO. -
patagonia:
haha maybe...even the perceptions of \"head of household\" can completely different...Some see him as rather wrathful and vicious..some see him as full of love.
It doesn't matter who interpretes what. At the end of the day, it's the 'head of household' who has the last say. Like we often hear parents tell their kids, if you misbehave, you'll get it when we go home! -
Lets not take this conversation to discussing religion. Each religion has its own ways and it all has the same motive - to make u a better person.
Coming back to the topic
I hardly see any posts here from people who r currently attending CHC. IT could be because they r still in the brain washed state or too afraid to speak up lest GOD gets angry at them..
I have been to CHC many many times on my friends insistence. That was in 2001-02 (cant really remember) but during the time when they were in Tanjong Katong and trying to build the Jurong building. A few things that literally drove me away from there was
1. The way people dressed including the pastors. Yes the Bible says u need to be well dressed when u come to his house, but here they gave me a complex. There was atleast one instance when SH talked abt the dress she was wearing and also mentioned the cost of it was abt 400$. For me, a head of religious institution should not be flamboyant. U can wear a 40$ dress and donate the rest. THere are millions n millions who dont even have clothes to wear. When i mentioned this to my friend, my brain washed friend said there is nothing wrong in pastors wearing expensive clothes as its their own money they r using. But then i was like where do they get that kind of money if ur a full time pastor.
2. KH and SH was living in an apartment in orchard. U live such a flamboyant life and then u talk abt leading a spiritual life. Somewhere i just couldnt relate to them at all. I found their words empty. I cant see it in ur behaviour man.. Now i read that they live in sentosa cove :yikes: :shock:
3. And before the serivce finished, KH used to strongly talk abt tithing and how sinful it is not to give ur 10% blah blah.. And it is always give more, u will be belessed more. Believe me the words r really strong. U just go n listen to couple of sermons and u will know what i am talking about. Then people start coming to u, with a pouch and ur supposed to put ur donations in. I used to be really carried away by the talks. Firstly the guilt feeling they generate in u ( e.g you have money to eat in expensive restaurants but no money to give god) So i used to feel very bad if i dont give. So even used to pray lord this month i really cannot , next month i will pay double (and i used to do that). The pouch that comes around is on top of ur regular 10% tithe. Imagine a row has about 30 odd people and the row in front n behind u can see u, will u drop in a dollar.. I wont mainly because others r looking and also because i never see people putting in small money.. So i am forced to give more (offcourse its for GOD).
4. And i also just couldnt accept the idea that majority of the money they get as donations is used to propogate christanity even the charity works and out reach are part of that of their religious propoganda. For me religion is heliping others first and not asking them to follow what i do..
5. Let me tell you most of the people who attend the CHC are filthy rich ( even way back then). So maybe the whole church's atmosphere is catered to them.. Just normal people like me feel totally out of place there as there is nothing i can relate to.
I can go on and on.. In short i just couldnt accept the fact that the preaching and especially their behaviour (flamboyant life style) doesnt tally with my understanding of GOD. And not a single one of the 33k people will speak up(incld my friend who defended SH dressing sense way back when it became a huge controversy. Accord to her, their pastor cant do anythign wrong, its all with a purpose) because they r scared they will incur GODs wrath by speaking against their church (House of GOD). I am also not speaking against the house of GOD but against what i saw in the house of GOD which i couldnt agree to.
Just my 2 cents -
WeiHan:
Hmm.. 'head of household' is not head of church / temple / mosque.. It's the Top Guy up there.
haha maybe...even the perceptions of \"head of household\" can completely different...Some see him as rather wrathful and vicious..some see him as full of love.patagonia:
It doesn't matter who interpretes what. At the end of the day, it's the 'head of household' who has the last say. Like we often hear parents tell their kids, if you misbehave, you'll get it when we go home! -
sankan:
Lets not take this conversation to discussing religion. Each religion has its own ways and it all has the same motive - to make u a better person....
:goodpost: -
concern2:
:goodpost:.....
I think this is the reason why some may feel offended and why MOD has been asking us to steer clear of making sensitive comments, and in this case, comparing one religion to another.
JMHO.
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