Riders in Project Work

[jedamum]

Blobbi:

There are quite a few lecturers on this forum, including Chief Kiasu? Maybe they can add their experience?

Chief is lecturer???

[Blobbi]

jedamum:

Blobbi:

There are quite a few lecturers on this forum, including Chief Kiasu? Maybe they can add their experience?

Chief is lecturer???

Paiseh!! :oops:

[ChiefKiasu]

jedamum:

Blobbi:

There are quite a few lecturers on this forum, including Chief Kiasu? Maybe they can add their experience?

Chief is lecturer???

What jedamum? Look me no up issit?

[outsider]

I was a rider once.

It was during poly. I had to do a computer programming assignment with a partner chosen by the lecturer. I was very very weak in this subject
while my partner is super good in it. He didn’t discuss with me, he completed the assignment in 1 or 2 days and passed it to me. I am supposed to understand what he wrote and do the presentation with him.

I guess in my case, my partner rather not discuss with me, else he had to spend time teaching me, which can make him vomit blood

[corneyAmber]

outsider:

I was a rider once.

It was during poly. I had to do a computer programming assignment with a partner chosen by the lecturer. I was very very weak in this subject
while my partner is super good in it. He didn't discuss with me, he completed the assignment in 1 or 2 days and passed it to me. I am supposed to understand what he wrote and do the presentation with him.

I guess in my case, my partner rather not discuss with me, else he had to spend time teaching me, which can make him vomit blood

This kind is not exactly rider, this is the opposite phenomenon of a rider called a dictator in a project group. There are such dictators who are typically perfectionists. Anything lesser is not acceptable and hence will prefer to end up doing everything to get high score for the whole team.

[rains]

ks2me:

This kind is not exactly rider, this is the opposite phenomenon of a rider called a dictator in a project group. There are such dictators who are typically perfectionists. Anything lesser is not acceptable and hence will prefer to end up doing everything to get high score for the whole team.

I was guilty of being someone like that for quite a few years. In fact, in one of the pairwork, I actually threw away my partner's work and did the project on my own and submitted it using both our names. On reflection, I was too conceited and didn't spare a thought for my partner's feelings. I tried meeeting her up a few times but was unsuccessful so I concluded that she was one of those people who just wanted to ride on me. Eventually, she gave me her share and I didn't think it was good enough. Yeah, I know I was horrible.

But subsequently, I met other riders along the way and I had to do most of the job myself. In any case, I wanted good grades, so I didn't really mind the work so much. In one instance, I got really angry becos I had just sat through 9 hours of work for it and a friend in the group told me she needed to go for an interview at a drama centre for some volunteer work (out of interest) and so got no time for the project work.

Another interesting encounter I had was the time when a guy in our group didn't do any work for a project and he promised to do the next project on his own and credit it to the whole group, but it turned out that he didn't do a single thing the night before the submission date! So the 3 of us, minus that rider, msn from 11pm to 6am to do that project from scratch. At one point, one of the group members dozed off.

Insider,
I'm sorry your daughter has to go through what she does. Her groupmates are terrible. They actually had the cheek to disagree with the content when they blatantly didn't do their parts and the due date for presentation was the next day.

It's harder when the lecturer wants everybody to present. I really don't know what I can suggest to help make your daughter feel better.

Groupwork really sucks! What's the point of having groupwork anyway? To let those whose English is not even grammatical or those who don't know how to do the project to tap on those who are more able? To introduce 'reality' to students? It's a stupid way to do it in my opinion.

[jedamum]

ChiefKiasu:

What jedamum? Look me no up issit?

http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc18/jedamum/Emoticon/indifferent0028.gif\"> wat did you say Mr Lecturer? I fell asleep.......

[corneyAmber]

rains:

I was guilty of being someone like that for quite a few years. In fact, in one of the pairwork, I actually threw away my partner's work and did the project on my own and submitted it using both our names. On reflection, I was too conceited and didn't spare a thought for my partner's feelings. I tried meeeting her up a few times but was unsuccessful so I concluded that she was one of those people who just wanted to ride on me. Eventually, she gave me her share and I didn't think it was good enough. Yeah, I know I was horrible.

So you are one of those perfectionists. :D

But subsequently, I met other riders along the way and I had to do most of the job myself. In any case, I wanted good grades, so I didn't really mind the work so much. In one instance, I got really angry becos I had just sat through 9 hours of work for it and a friend in the group told me she needed to go for an interview at a drama centre for some volunteer work (out of interest) and so got no time for the project work.

Wah! this rider really got her priorities wrong in the name of volunteer work.

Another interesting encounter I had was the time when a guy in our group didn't do any work for a project and he promised to do the next project on his own and credit it to the whole group, but it turned out that he didn't do a single thing the night before the submission date! So the 3 of us, minus that rider, msn from 11pm to 6am to do that project from scratch. At one point, one of the group members dozed off.

Moral behind the story, do not accept \"words credit\", have it in \"action cash\"!! :lol:

Insider,
I'm sorry your daughter has to go through what she does. Her groupmates are terrible. They actually had the cheek to disagree with the content when they blatantly didn't do their parts and the due date for presentation was the next day.

It's harder when the lecturer wants everybody to present. I really don't know what I can suggest to help make your daughter feel better.

Actually it would be good to let the lecturer know the progress of the group in milestone approach so should anything goes really wrong, it would be good to make an alternative proposal to the lecturer on the presentation which the lecturer has alot of pre-information given along the way to consider this new alternative proposal. Anyway all these are in hindsight, just work differently in next team project.

Groupwork really sucks! What's the point of having groupwork anyway? To let those whose English is not even grammatical or those who don't know how to do the project to tap on those who are more able? To introduce 'reality' to students? It's a stupid way to do it in my opinion.

Groupwork is inevitable in real working world and at that point, it is hard to avoid. So it is good to learn in school(non-threatening environment) and devise ways to address certain issues by dealing with it and float then to drown in the real working world later where there will be more to lose in terms of performance. JMHO

[rains]

ks2me:

So you are one of those perfectionists. :D


I just thought at the end of the day, everybody will reap the benefit of good grades. 'Perfectionists' may not be an appropriate word becos no work is perfect, but there are works 'better' than others.

Actually it would be good to let the lecturer know the progress of the group in milestone approach so should anything goes really wrong, it would be good to make an alternative proposal to the lecturer on the presentation which the lecturer has alot of pre-information given along the way to consider this new alternative proposal. Anyway all these are in hindsight, just work differently in next team project.

Sometimes it's difficult to let the lecturer know the progress in truth. What do you want to tell the lecturer? That the rest of them are pigs and they don't do a single thing? You'll look like a witch to your groupmates and the lecturer might even ask you to sort things out yourself.

I once had a tutor who got us to write down our contributions for a project. I remember there was this guy who totally didn't do a thing but he still faked something out of nothing anyway. Then what? You go and tell the tutor he didn't do a thing? I think most of us who take everything upon ourselves are not so bold as to stand up for ourselves, and that's why we ended up taking everything upon ourselves, instead of confronting the groupmates and ask them to do something or scram.

Groupwork is inevitable in real working world and at that point, it is hard to avoid. So it is good to learn in school(non-threatening environment) and devise ways to address certain issues by dealing with it and float then to drown in the real working world later where there will be more to lose in terms of performance. JMHO

I feel that groupwork is not appropriate for works that would be graded. It's an unfair system that penalises the (er hem) kind and nice, and hardworking people.

[rains]

insider:

Groupwork grading (or rather the world) is never fair in my opinion – this is what my kids have to know and adjust themselves to fit the world accordingly with school lives as the main grounds to gain experience. If unfairness cannot be corrected, then just have to tell self and accept that that is plain bad luck to be with certain undesirable people that one should not have been and move on, even she has to suffer a dent in her GPA...


PS: She came back yesterday with a moody face after the presentation and I am yet to chat with her how the presentation was. She has to learn how to accept ‘bad luck’ with grace instead of suffering a double/triple loss by feeling unnecessarily anxious / moody / frustrated / etc. Think she will mature more in this area when she meets more riders in her future projects(and realizes this is part and parcel of life…)

I hope when my time comes to advise my daughter on riders in project work, I'll be as gracious a mother as you are.

My worst experience in a groupwork was not in doing work for riders. It was to be accused as a rider!

The girl already had a bad reputation for badmouthing just about everybody she knew and telling tutors that people she didn't agree with are riders. But the system was such that I was made to group with her and a coursemate who she was acquainted with. She tried very badly to oust me from the group and told the tutor that I refused to do my part.

It was very traumatic for me as it was the last semester and I had worked very hard in the hope of getting a good hons. I lost sleep and appetite for a week. I knew that I could forget about getting an A for that module due to the sabotage.

To 'help' us resolve the dispute, the tutor suggested that they gave me a certain part of the project to do on my own (so that their grade would not suffer if I were a rider).

The girl actually suggested that we met up just before the presentation to do some 'discussion', which I didn't turn up at all. I didn't think that she could mean well at all.

Their presentation slides had every one of them tagged 'by (their names)' so that I would look like I didn't do a single thing in the project.

At the end of the course, I realised that these two are just 'average' materials. They didn't even secure the last category of hons. To think the girl had the cheek to tell me,\"Don't get an A at our expense.\" probably meaning \"Don't make use of us to get an A.\" Some people really don't know where they stand.

And mind you, these are teachers.