MOE to stop publishing names of top students?

[CayennePepper]

sinoboy:

The decision to get kids into GEP is definitely a right one.


It is a loophole utilized by some locals and newcomers to skip PSLE (DSA even though may not make the COP for a top school).

Skip PSLE and land up in IP program means skip O level to go to A level direct, while others stress to get 3 points or less from 6 subjects at O level.

This good decision saves a family many years that would otherwise be spent on stressing for PSLE, then stressing O level, then stressing for ITE, the stressing for promotion to Poly, then eventually ending up in uni.

If you are a parent which decision would you make? :roll:

:pokeeye:


Aiyoh. You make it sound like it's that easy to DSA through GEP. :pokeeye:

It is not. Really. Just because the words GEP domain appear on some schools' websites doesn't mean they just accept every Gepper who applies!
It's just an avenue. Like the other nice little tabs you can click e.g ACADEMIC. Schools are not obliged to take in everyone who applies, including Geppers. Give them some credit.

[Melodies]

CayennePepper:

sinoboy:

希望当局能够考虑废除天才班，或透过DSA直接收取天才班，和直通车等这些让家长和孩子们都感到焦虑的条例与政策。

若当局把高材测试延至小六， 会让更多家长安心吗？

家长和孩子感到焦虑， 是因为他们把得失看得太重了吧！如能随遇而安。。。

非也!非也！并非家长们把得失看得太重。若能随遇而安，何乐也不为呢? 冰冻三尺，非一日之寒。洽洽相反，随遇已不能安矣！若不是求救无门，山穷水尽的边境。局势哪能从初衷的呻吟声演变成今时的震耳欲聋的呐喊声。

[CayennePepper]

Melodies, I like your 成语s

And I get where you're coming from. Really.
It's just that I don't think removing all the perceived 'obstacles' to a more equitable (I don't mean equal) playing field is THE solution to address the 震耳欲聋的呐喊声.

[sinoboy]

Melodies:

CayennePepper:

[quote=\"sinoboy\"]
希望当局能够考虑废除天才班，或透过DSA直接收取天才班，和直通车等这些让家长和孩子们都感到焦虑的条例与政策。

若当局把高材测试延至小六， 会让更多家长安心吗？

家长和孩子感到焦虑， 是因为他们把得失看得太重了吧！如能随遇而安。。。

非也!非也！并非家长们把得失看得太重。若能随遇而安，何乐也不为呢? 冰冻三尺，非一日之寒。洽洽相反，随遇已不能安矣！若不是求救无门，山穷水尽的边境。局势哪能从初衷的呻吟声演变成今时的震耳欲聋的呐喊声。[/quote]Agree. So removing GEP, DSA for GEP and IP program etc may be key to remedy the situation. Perhaps they can also look into modifying the requirement for '新学生' joining the primary education system to be admitted at a lower academic level so that at PSLE, this way all students taking PSLE are 12 year old. This way 13 or 14 years old '新学生' would not have an advantage and PSLE would then be a more apple to apple comparison.

[Nebbermind]

FQW:

OT a bit.


What do pple here think about overseas kids joining our pri sch midway and dropping 1-2 levels? That's one area I feel puts all 12-yr old kids here [local or otherwise] at a big disadvantage. It'll be useful to know how many such cases are there each year.

Would u retain your kids 1~2years to gain this advantage? :scratchhead:

[CayennePepper]

sinoboy:

Agree. So removing GEP, DSA for GEP and IP program etc may be key to remedy the situation. Perhaps they can also look into modifying the requirement for '新学生' joining the primary education system to be admitted at a lower academic level so that at PSLE, this way all students taking PSLE are 12 year old. This way 13 or 14 years old '新学生' would not have an advantage and PSLE would then be a more apple to apple comparison.

Humour me, please. Not as enlightened as the rest of you.

What, exactly, is the situation?
Some primary schools doing too well, relative to others?
No good secondary school to go to? Cos of the 1.x% of Geppers? (aren't all schools equally good :evil: )
PSLE too tough? Bell curve not fair?
Rich parents who could afford quality tutors depriving others of As?
What??

[sinoboy]

Nebbermind:

FQW:

OT a bit.


What do pple here think about overseas kids joining our pri sch midway and dropping 1-2 levels? That's one area I feel puts all 12-yr old kids here [local or otherwise] at a big disadvantage. It'll be useful to know how many such cases are there each year.

Would u retain your kids 1~2years to gain this advantage? :scratchhead:

Don't think local parents can ask to retain their kids for that kind of advantage. But I think most parents might try, if its a sure way of entering good school, good scholarship and good unis which leads to higher chances of success in life in the future.

MOE admits overseas one at a lower academic level to make sure they catch up I think. But these kids catch up much faster because some/most of them have more matured brains and better problem solving skills. Think the phenomenon is more pronounced in the last decade.

Best solution may be to let them join the academic level of their age and let them perform well or fail according to their abilities. Then more 'equitable'?

[SAHM_TAN]

sinoboy:

SAHM_TAN:

[quote=\"notsokiasu mum\"]

I have been a passive reader of this forum most of the time but I feel I need say something here. GEP has been around for many years. Up till about 10 years ago before the top schools went IP route, all GEP students were automatically promoted to the GEP secondary schools like RI RGS and ACS. So when you look at the system now, it has actually evolved and instead of almost 100% GEP in top schools like RI and RGS, now perhaps on 50% are successful in their DSA to these two schools. And there are easily 10 % of GEP who are not successful in their DSA application, and end up in schools with o levels subsequently. Sometimes I do not know why there is an obsession among parents to get their kids into top schools. I always felt that a kid should go to a school suited to his ability.

I do understand why parents want their kids into top school, starting from primary school.

Whether their decision is right or not we do not need to judge.

The decision to get kids into GEP is definitely a right one.

It is a loophole utilized by some locals and newcomers to skip PSLE (DSA even though may not make the COP for a top school).

Skip PSLE and land up in IP program means skip O level to go to A level direct, while others stress to get 3 points or less from 6 subjects at O level.

This good decision saves a family many years that would otherwise be spent on stressing for PSLE, then stressing O level, then stressing for ITE, the stressing for promotion to Poly, then eventually ending up in uni.

If you are a parent which decision would you make? :roll:[/quote]Don't understand why you roll eyes.

Kids who DSA still take PSLE.

IP is seriously not for everyone, not even if later the kid is eligible for Uni.

I look at my kids and make the decision. I make decision based on what will happen.

[Melodies]

Honestly, your 'obstacles' are the schemes that allow resourceful parents to explore and hence create this 震耳欲聋的呐喊声 situation.


It is a matter of trading off between the consequences of these schemes that affect the majority/public and whatsoever to pave way for training this small privilege group.

Aiyo, what so big deal about this GEP program? You go to UK/US/Australia/western countries, this is the way (unstructured way) how they teach their pupils la! ha!ha!ha Don't tell me Angmo kid is more gifted than our kids and they can cope but we can't cope. :rant:

CayennePepper:

Melodies, I like your 成语s
And I get where you're coming from. Really.
It's just that I don't think removing all the perceived 'obstacles' to a more equitable (I don't mean equal) playing field is THE solution to address the 震耳欲聋的呐喊声.

[david59]

concern2:

The last 2-3 pages of comments confirms the fact that parents are taking such exams as a competition which I find is the need for change. I feel like I am re-watching the 2012 Olympic Games - so and so broke the record - cannot be- she must be doping... :slapshead: Although it isn't about cheating here, but it is like saying there is non-level playing ground and unfairness, which is what education should not be in the first place - it should not be viewed as a competition in the first place. All these talks about who is top and if not you are mediocre is driving everyone madly in a competition of academic competition - at the expense of real learning and real education.


The key issue is that many people have a very narrow definition of success. And such narrow definition of success being ingrained in children at this very early stage is uncalled for, is dangerous, and detrimental to future success of our country. We have been carrying this narrow definition for the past decade. To continue to prosper and propel ourselves, we need to take on a broader view and celebrate success in various fields. Although I would personally prefer that things be more transparent, instead of censoring this and that, there comes a time when things tend to take on extreme and side-effects, and calls for some form of administering.

I do not believe that those who are already working hard would stop doing so because top students are not being glorified, unless the ultimate aim of the student / parent is to be in that limelight. To go on to say why not stop disclosing this achiever and that achiever is carrying this too far and is not being rational in thinking.

On the contrary, I see goodness and nobility in shining the lime light on those who have all odds against them to succeed, yet they did it, although they may not be the best of the best in results. It gives hope. At least for now.

:goodpost:

May I add, why so much stress just simply in primary school education? I feel a lot is due to the schemes like dsa n GEP.

DSA pushes some parents to make their kids join certain sports or activities with the unceasing hope that their kids can get into top schools despite their mediocre academic results. Pushing the kids to do things they may not like is unhealthy for family bonding. It's fine if the kid enjoys. However, the greatest stress comes when the kid finds himself struggling to perform in the elite school he would otherwise be unable to get into.

GEP robs the neighborhood schools of their top best students and give them to the elite schools who thus constantly perform excellingly above national average in PSLE. How then can these neighborhood schools ensure that they can continue to produce top scorers above 270 in the yearly PSLE?

I know some neighborhood schools select and form an elite class of a smaller 20 to 25 students in Primary 5 n 6 with the hope n objective of achieving a few top scores with 270 n above. This elite class is given the best resources n teachers to achieve this aim. I wonder what happen to the weaker students then. I see unjust treatment in our educational system here. I believe many students in elite class come from well educated n well to do families with great resources to help their kids academically. Yet they also receive top class treatment from their schools. The elite class is therefore stressed with lots of works to achieve the schools' desire for top scorers. Their parents are also stressed to help their kids to keep up with the demand set by the teachers.
The parents of weaker students who are more likely of lower educational background n lower income group cannot afford good quality tuition for their kids as the schools are unlikely to put greater effort to help them due to thinly spread better resources for the elite class. Thus, these parents are desperate for miracles to happen or send their kids to cheap group tuition centres that really hardly help. Instead, more time is wasted n the kids are stressed with more tuition work they cannot do, on top of school works.
The best way to present the success of a school that is truly educating their students academically is not by displaying a huge banner showcasing their top students but by displaying the average aggregate PSLE score whereby we total up the scores of all the students and divide it by the total number of students. By doing this, every school will have to make every effort to help all their students to do better as any neglect of any class will likely result in a low average score for that particular school.
It is important to groom the best but to do so at the neglect of the weaker ones is unjust meritocracy ! It simply promotes a greater divide between the smarter n the weaker ones.