Punggol East By-Election coming ? MP steps down

[pirate]

rains:

You can say what you like about your vote, but who knows who you really voted for? I find it hard to believe that you had cast in the opposite direction of your conviction.

Why so hard to believe? Now you are conflating the 40% swing voters with the 35% core PAP supporters, and falling into that 60%/40% trap so evident in other online forums.

Is it hard to believe that grouchy ol' pirate voted PAP last time? If for a moment I think that WP veers away from being PAP-lite and towards Truebluesrulez-plus, I will happily vote PAP again.

[carilyn]

Actually in my younger days, I heard so many horror stories about how MIW tracks down people who dun vote for them. True or not, till now I dun know. But now of coz even if it’s true, it’s history. But after I started working and some volunteering works, I must admit that certain policies that are for the good of the whole picture will pissed off some groups, or even cause inconvenience to the whole group for the time being. Remember when they first built MRT? Most people are totally sceptical about it, wondering why must the hell we go thru so much inconvenience for an infrastructure that we dun necessarily needs. Now, if your near your house no MRT you complain. Likewise, those down town lines, Thomson lines may cause much inconvenience now, but when it’s done, I’ m sure most people will grow reliant on it.

Still, from our point of view, they can still do better jobs. But then we are not in their shoes. We dun know what is the constraint.
Anyway, glad that WP make it. Hope we have more politicians of better quality whether which camp they are from.

[carilyn]

@winchester- not hard to guess wor.

[happy to be mum]

Strparent:

pirate:

[quote=\"3Boys\"]

But I can't imagine 55% of PE residents are living from hand to mouth and need financial assistance.

But I have met many others that limlim speaks about. Illegal parking kena fine, zhenghu's fault; hawker stall unhygienic kena serve notice, I vote WP; temple next door too noisy, MP never do his work; temple hours curtailed, congregation cast protest vote; too many foreigners, protest; project slows down because not enough FW, protest; COE too high, protest; traffic jam, protest; hospital A&E waiting time too long, get angry; turned away fom A&E becoz non-emergency.......

There is bound to be something in one's life that one is unhappy with the g'ment about, and in SG that often turns into a vote against the g'ment.

If that is true, WP will not be the party that consistently does better than the other opposition parties, some of which have ostensibly more qualified and eloquent candidates, and offer more 'bribes' in their policies.

While it is true that there is a core of about 25% who will vote against the PAP no matter what, and this core may well consist of these kind of people, it cannot be true of the approximately 40% swing voters (about 35% are core PAP supporters).

Any strategy that conflates the 25% hardcore opp voters with the 40% swing voters is bound to fail. Continued attempts to accuse the 40% of being like the 25% will only alienate these 40%.

well said, pirate :salute:

there will always be people who believed that notion, but the problem would be IF the govt also think that way [/quote]
I have to disagree with 3Boys about voting for opposition because MP can't help your problems. Who is so naive that MPs can solve all our problems??

Right for the time when I can vote, I have never vote for MIW, it is not that our gahment is not good. Our gahment has a good record and S'pore is a safe place to stay in but right from young, I cannot understand how we can have democracy if there is only one party that is speaking. Hence I believe in having alternative parties in Parliament to have alternatives voices and views.

I have seeked help from hehe..Mr Michael Palmer when I was still staying in Punggol and help came through, actually was not help, it was more of injustice to some government red tapes. But did I vote for MIW? Nope, not that I was ungrateful but I still believe in alternative voices to be heard. Seeked help from MP again in the current ward I am staying and my MP is one of the busiest one around cause nowadays our system came on breaking down or have delays..hehe. Again, it is not much of a help but for an injustice which I felt that I have to voice out, not just for myself but for those parents who faced the same parking problems as I have every weekends where we fetch our kids for classes. 3 mins in seeing the MP, I just felt like getting out of the room, scolding myself for wasting my time. The MP was not even listening to my problems, no empathy at all. That will be the probably the last time I will ever go MTP session, my second time.

Friends my age rarely go see MP cause we are in the generation whereby we believe we have to help ourselves. But if we go seek help from MP, we do hope there will be sincerity and empathy from them, people can sense whether you are sincere or not. I can understand why PE residents will vote for LLL.

Just the other days, I was just thinking when has my birthplace, Singapore becomes so crowded and everywhere we go, we are bound to bump into foreigners. I am not against them but it is really too many. When has the MRT rides become so pack like sardines. I was shocked when I had to take a train during peak period recently. Why gahment has to tear down those buildings that hold dearly to alot of S'poreans, like the old National Library etc.. When our gahment starts to run my home land like an corporation, measuring growths and growths more than concerning about its people.

As a parents, all of us have this worrying question, can our kids afford their own house / HDB next time with the current housing prices expecting to be up and up. Can we afford to buy another car when our current cars' lives are up with the current scary COE! Okay, some will rebute say car take public transport. Ya, try doing that if you have 2 or more 3 kids going for different classes, swimming, Sunday church school, enrichment classes etc. during the weekdays or weekends..you will be like rushing like siao! And for those middle class who has no help except maid, to meet with maids' increasing salaries...for goodness sake, scrap the disgusting levy for those with young children or old people who required maids to look after. And do look deeper into providing more subsidies for those stay at home mums! Most stay at home mums are stay at home mums for reasons and not become they are rich (we are talking about middle class level). And the stressful education system...and healthcare...for the poor they will have help quite straightforward, for the rich, no worries, for the middle class, they (hospitals) will make you broke first before much help can come in. And I think our country is one of the rare one in the world whereby we have to rely so much on foreign talents. Why foreigners will like S'pore so much? Of course we treat them like kings. Why our local bank is being lead by foreigner? Do we really lack of local talents. If you are in other countries, local will be given priority instead of foreigners, are we in Singapore?

I understand it is impossible to please everyone but please...we need our gahment to listen to its people again and hence more and more S'poreans alike feel we need to have alternative voices in the Parliament and not so because our gahment is lousy but they have lost the human touch, lost the touch of our many middle sandwich classes are facing.. And I believe I will still not be voting for MIWs for sometimes..

[happy to be mum]

WP’s win was a surprise to me…but very nice and happy surprise.

[Irrelevant]

carilyn:

Remember when they first built MRT?

I sure did. JBJ was complaining about the costs of the MRT (5 billion, if I recall correctly) in parliament while Ong Teng Cheong was defending it.

So if we have got enough opposition members then, perhaps the MRT might not be approved? :evil:

[rains]

3Boys:

rains:

Your view is too one-sided. Everything that others highlight, you dismiss it as mindless and trivial complaints. I think the pilot and stewardess analogy is hardly an accurate one. Pilots only need to ensure the safety of the passengers. Why should I care if he can appeal to my basic needs? An MP is someone who should serve the needs of the people by ensuring that the country is run well. If the cost of living is suffocating the people while the MP is enjoying the high life, then something is wrong.

You can say what you like about your vote, but who knows who you really voted for? I find it hard to believe that you had cast in the opposite direction of your conviction.

You can choose to believe whatever you choose to believe. I have written at length about my choice in another thread back in 2011, before the GE ballot, to the shock of many forumers.

My conviction is that the g'ment does a good job, despite the circumstances, and that people don't understand how hard it is to please everyone, and the necessity for hard trade-offs.

My conviction is also that the MIW plays dirty politics, which I detest.

They are 2 separate things and are not contradictory.

In my younger days, before I started working and developing a more sophisticated understanding of how the world works, the second issue was to the fore, I could not stand the MIW.

Now that I've grown up, I begin to see things in a different light. There are many redeeming features of the MIW policies, despite their awful politics. But LKY's comments about Aljunied did it for me. Unlike many voters, I think the current batch are far more suited to 'proper' political leadership in the new era than he ever was.

At any point in time, one may feel one way about one thing, then some other factors may come into it.

If you are cheering the 10+% swing in votes in PE (presumably MIW voters who switched camps), then why do you begrudge me the right to change MY mind?

I don't begrudge you for anything at all. I just buay song you shooting every real concern down like how the miws do - 'noise'.

The way I see it, just about every policy, especially those that have to do with monetary gains, directly or indirectly, is about serving their own interest - first. If it so happens to make a certain group happy, yay - we kill two birds with one stone.

If they truly deem Singapore transportation as being world-class, let them take mrt and bus to work - and I will believe them that it's really world-class.

If they truly believe that all schools are good schools, let their children attend a neighbourhood school. I will only believe in this make-believe if the ministers' children and grandchildren don't attend taonan, nanyang and don't know what other branded schools.

If they truly believe that their public housing is affordable and wonderful, strip themselves of their obscene paychecks, directorships and god knows how much allowances and live in an Hdb flat. If they do that, I will also believe that Hdb is affordable and fantastic.

If they truly believe that all educated women should be economically productive and should be working mothers, let their wives take a 9-5 job and earn our kinda salary, and leave their kids with grandparents or maids. Then I will be convinced that every educated woman ought to be an economic digit.

If they truly believe that foreign talents are beneficial to the economy and these FTs are top talents we can't do without, then let foreign talents take over their jobs and have their salaries, not ours. Then I will truly believe that they are wise and right.

The bottom line is: they should walk the talk. If they ever do, I'll ask everybody I know to vote for them.

[concern2]

Irrelevant:

carilyn:

Remember when they first built MRT?

I sure did. JBJ was complaining about the costs of the MRT (5 billion, if I recall correctly) in parliament while Ong Teng Cheong was defending it.

So if we have got enough opposition members then, perhaps the MRT might not be approved? :evil:

Not so sure...how about if there had been more oppositions earlier, the casinos might not have been built? :faint: I can't believe I am joining in this debate...better to :siam:

[mummy so kiasu]

happy to be mum:

Right for the time when I can vote, I have never vote for MIW, it is not that our gahment is not good. Our gahment has a good record and S'pore is a safe place to stay in but right from young, I cannot understand how we can have democracy if there is only one party that is speaking. Hence I believe in having alternative parties in Parliament to have alternatives voices to be heard.

As a parents, all of us have this worrying question, can our kids afford their own house / HDB next time with the current housing prices expecting to be up and up. Can we afford to buy another car when our current cars' lives are up with the current scary COE! Okay, some will rebute say car take public transport. Try doing that if you have 2 or more 3 kids going for different classes, swimming, Sunday church school, enrichment classes etc. during the weekdays or weekends..you will be like rushing like siao! And for those middle class who has no help except maid, to meet with maids' increasing salaries...for goodness sake, scrap the disgusting levy for those with young children or old people who required maids to look after. And do look deeper into providing more subsidies for those stay at home mums! Most stay at home mums are stay at home mums for reasons and not become they are rich (we are talking about middle class level). And the stressful education system...and healthcare...for the poor they will have help quite straightforward, for the rich, no worries, for the middle class, they (hospitals) will make you broke first before much help can come in. And I think our country is one of the rare one in the world whereby we have to rely so much on foreign talents. Why foreigners will like S'pore so much? Of course we treat them like kings. Why our local bank is being lead by foreigner? Do we really lack of local talents. If you are in other countries, local will be given priority instead of foreigners, are we in Singapore?

I am a resident of PE. You have brought out most of my concerns, except I do not have maid. As a SAHM, we can't afford to have more kids due to the high cost of education. We do not benefits from 4 months maternity leave & do not need any childcare service. Government should look into pre school & tertiary education which is more long term rather than baby bonus.

[concern2]

rains:

...If they truly deem Singapore transportation as being world-class, let them take mrt and bus to work - and I will believe them that it's really world-class.

If they truly believe that all schools are good schools, let their children attend a neighbourhood school. I will only believe in this make-believe if the ministers' children and grandchildren don't attend taonan, nanyang and don't know what other branded schools.

If they truly believe that their public housing is affordable and wonderful, strip themselves of their obscene paychecks, directorships and god knows how much allowances and live in an Hdb flat. If they do that, I will also believe that Hdb is affordable and fantastic.

If they truly believe that all educated women should be economically productive and should be working mothers, let their wives take a 9-5 job and earn our kinda salary, and leave their kids with grandparents or maids. Then I will be convinced that every educated woman ought to be an economic digit.

If they truly believe that foreign talents are beneficial to the economy and these FTs are top talents we can't do without, then let foreign talents take over their jobs and have their salaries, not ours. Then I will truly believe that they are wise and right.

The bottom line is: they should walk the talk. If they ever do, I'll ask everybody I know to vote for them.

:goodpost: 纸上谈兵！ :siam: