Are you ready for 7 million people on tiny Singapore?

[toddles]

This is also worth a read. Wonder if he's a KSP?? haha... too busy to join in our chatter I'm guessing.


The crux of the issue is the \"force-feeding\" I put in red.

http://singaporemind.blogspot.sg/2013/01/population-white-paper-filled-with.html


Population White Paper : Filled with flaws and unsubstantiated claims
Even before the PAP solved the problems caused by the large influx of the last 15 years, it tells us that it wants to continue the large influx until 2030 to reach a population of 6.5-6.9M people. This proposal has shocked both netizens and citizens alike because the past decade of high foreign influx has led to numerous problems and a decline in the quality of life Singaporeans. Singapore now has the highest population density in the world and the PAP govt wants to increase this further by another 30%. The high foreign influx and especially cheap 3rd world labour has caused the income gap to widen, wages to be stagnant among lower income groups, cost of living to shoot up and transport/medical infrastructure to be strained.

Here is the white paper [Link]. You should read the white paper in full to understand the arguments but if you don't have time, as usual, I will summarize the main points

The first section of the paper discusses the challenging demographics we face - that of an ageing workforce. If the current birth rate does not improve we will have an ageing population unless we allow for immigration. Most govts be it Russia, France, Sweden, Finland and S.Korea when confronted with the same problem of low fertility tackles it head on by removing the root causes of low fertility but the PAP proposes a solution that assumes that it will fail to get the fertility rate backup.

However, the evidence produced here is not correct. While it is true that the Singaporean workforce is ageing, Singapore workforce today consists of both foreigners (40%) and Singaporeans(60%). These foreigners on work permits and employment passes are \"refreshed\" every few years provide a segment of the workforce is \"forever young\". So the combined profile of our entire workforce is not going to age substantially over time. Today we have the reverse of an ageing workforce problem that will get worse if the PAP embarks on this irresponsible measure of importing more foreign labor over time - the problem faced by Singaporeans is that of structural unemployment. There is underemployment or unemployment of our older workers (45 and above) because the PAP open the floodgates to supply the labor market with younger foreign workers many of our older workers have been retrenched and find it hard to get new jobs. They usually end up underemployed in positions that do not fully utilize their skills and experience.

The white paper also talks about the low fertility rate among Singaporeans. This I've explained in previous postings [Link]is fixed by importing babies today or adults into our workforce 20 years from now. You cannot import adults to make up for the shortfall in babies today. Even then in terms of numbers we are talking about a shortfall of 10-20 thousand babies a year but the white paper talks about expanding the population by about 100 thousand a year - 5 times the baby short fall from replacement level. What is the extra 80,000 people for? Other than force feeding the economy with people to keep it growing, it really does not make sense.

The last part of the white paper discusses the final numbers we will be looking at in 2030, a population consisting of 55% Singaporeans (this number includes the newly minted citizens during the 17 year period) and calls this a \"strong core\" of Singaporeans. It also discusses the benefits if the PAP govt goes along the proposed plan - increase job opportunities, good quality of life, and the chance to live in a vibrant economy. To tell this to Singaporeans who are already filled with anger and frustration resulting from the high foreign influx of the last decade that maintaining a high influx is good for them is an insult - we already know the consequences and outcomes of such a policy, throughout the last decade, the PAP has reiterated that a high foreign influx is here to create a better life for Singapore, but that is not what happened.

To try to fool us again shows the disingenuity of our leaders - not only have they failed to deliver, they are now proposing to go along a trajectory we know will not deliver a good quality of life for our people.

[concern2]

toddles:

Agree with pirate that this White Paper is underwhelming.


Read through - looks like some glossy brochure trying to convince us that there are so many \"strategies\", peppered with sentences with words but little meaning. Really dislike bizzare phrases like \"vibrant economy for dynamic sgp\" - Seriously?!

There are some helpful charts and figures but I was expecting a paper with much more rigour. I really don't need lines like \"singapore must continue to be one fo the best places to live in the world - a city for all ages...\" blah blah.

Perhaps like 3Boys says, we should just take it all with a pinch of salt. It can be the preferred Masterplan, so to speak, but who knows what will really happen? Man proposes God disposes.

20 years - we have seen how some policy turns out after 20 years. 20 years ago, we called it vision. 20 years later, we realise it wasn't that wise afterall. My personal feel is that anything that goes against nature is not sustainable. JMHO.

[concern2]

sleepy:

concern2:

[quote=\"Dora1\"] Yes opp needs 1/3 to veto. And I'm afraid we are too late, cannot wait till 2016 liao. the white paper will be debated next month in parliament, and we all know what's the result :mad:

Is it possible that they suddenly make halt to this after discussion in Parliament? LIke perhaps making 'populist decision'? Or perhaps making you feel like being 'subsidized' :siam:

Oh, so it's possibly a conspiracy :scratchhead:
that maybe no real intention to enforce but scared us silly first and then after pretending to debate, they gonna trash this white paper anyway and appear as if they do listen to people's voice and emerge white & pure in people's heart again :idea: :evil:


Anyway hopefully really 虚惊一场 I've sleepless night last night le, too worried [/quote] I never say that hor! Anything could happen, remember? :evil:

[ngl2010]

I remember LKY was against having 6.5 million people in Singapore. Too bad now it is hard to hope that he can influence the current govt. He was also against having casinos here. Can we have him back to support our opinion in this 7 million people thingy?

[winchester]

ngl2010:

I remember LKY was against having 6.5 million people in Singapore. Too bad now it is hard to hope that he can influence the current govt. He was also against having casinos here. Can we have him back to support our opinion in this 7 million people thingy?

he got say dont want 6.5 million? what context?

[ngl2010]

winchester:

ngl2010:

I remember LKY was against having 6.5 million people in Singapore. Too bad now it is hard to hope that he can influence the current govt. He was also against having casinos here. Can we have him back to support our opinion in this 7 million people thingy?

he got say dont want 6.5 million? what context?

He said it in 2008 when govt in 2007 wants to increase the population to 6.5 million in 40-50 years time. I guess now the government wants to increase the population faster and even more :faint:

Here is the link

http://www.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne%2BNews/Singapore/Story/A1Story20080201-47850.html

[hquek]

Just curious what happens when the new intake starts aging…are we shooting for 10million or exporting the aged out of the country.

[sleepy]

hquek:

Just curious what happens when the new intake starts aging....are we shooting for 10million or exporting the aged out of the country.

2016, 2021, 2026 - total at least 3 more elections

:idea: Perhpas they are 'projecting' opposition will take over parliament by then so can conveniently leave the 烂摊子 to new parliament by 2030

[toddles]

limlim:

3Boys:

[quote=\"concern2\"]Found this on Corrinne May fb:

(source: http://www.facebook.com/corrinnemaymusic)

If the Singapore government is looking at increasing the population of Singapore and increasing the dismal birthrate, they should take a good look at the abortion laws in Singapore.


Now the situation is drastically different and Singapore desperately needs more babies. We should look at ways to help more women keep their unborn babies and not abort them. Since Singaporeans often pick up new habits through educational campaigns (think of the 'courtesy campaign' for eg., and the 'please flush the loo' campaign) There needs to be some educational directive that helps women understand how precious every life is. And I'm not kidding when I say that we should start an 'Every Baby is Precious' campaign.

I agree 100% that more should be done to 1) Prevent unwanted pregnancies, 2) Encourage/Help women who are pregnant but cannot for whatever reason keep their babies, carry to term and not abort.

+100% agree..

Can go for adoption mah.... every baby is precious to Singapore..[/quote]yeah totally agree with this. wrote in on this when Chan Chun Sing was asking for suggestions... but for some reason they are skirting this issue.

[Funz]

hquek:

Just curious what happens when the new intake starts aging....are we shooting for 10million or exporting the aged out of the country.

:idea: Out of the 6.5mil, about 3mil are non singaporeans. These are the ones that they will keep 'renewing' base on productive age. At the same time that the other 3mil+ reproduce enough to replace themselves.