Are you ready for 7 million people on tiny Singapore?
-
MMM:
Why not? My plumber, car mechanic and aircon service man charge quite a bit for their services. In fact, the latter stays in a condo, doing very well. When I go for movies on weekday afternoons, I even see him and his kids there. Got work life balance some more.
Concern2,concern2:
:hi5: But hor, next time who would want to marry my boy if he is a plumber? :faint: See, I don't mind if he's a plumber and he gets to spend more time with family. I also don't mind them wanting to get married earlier and have children at a younger age, and I can be a grandparent at an age which I can be mobile enough to give a helping hand if needed...only thing is would kiasuparents want their DD to marry a plumber?
Maybe you got foresight... For all you know, maybe a plumber is paid more than a doctor next time. As without the plumber, maybe it will be :imconstipated:
-
Dreamaurora:
The \"face\" is directly related to the pay. If your son works as a cook in the coffeeshop vs chef in a 5 * hotel, what is the difference in the face? They are essentially the same job, the difference is the pay! No face if you are lower income and every month have to wait for gov's this and that grant in order to survive.
I think this also got to do with how children nowadays are brought up. If as a parent we keep emphasizing our kids to study hard and get a cushy office job, obviously our children will think twice before accepting lower pay or mundane jobs. Because doing so will cause them to 'lose face'.
I am really fascinated by how people in this island view these jobs. When I watch sitcoms from USA, I notice that even the blue collar workers are portrayed very favourably e.g. that plumber hunk from Desperate Housewives. I once asked my angmor friend and really he said that back in his country the social stigma associated with the blue collar jobs is far less than Singapore. I hope one day we can reach a point where all jobs are treated with respect and we all can be proud of whatever jobs our kids partake. -
Why does one assume that the lack of suitable job opportunities is down to the presence of foreign workers? One can make the case that if not for the presence of foreign workers (FTs, FWs or what have you), we would have even FEWER industries, and FEWER companies and FEWER HQs, and therefore, even less jobs for Singaporeans.
If having greater numbers of qualified workers take away jobs, then countries like the Philippines, India, China should have tons of high value jobs available for their resident citizens, since they are exporting tons of their most highly qualified people to OTHER countries, right?
So whatβs the truth? Foreigners create jobs or foreigners take away jobs? Itβs both.
People make it out to be a zero-sum game, when it is far from being the case. -
Laura02:
Sometimes, in the name of efficiency, we lose out in other (finer) things in life.
We all nid to learn to clear our own trays ....MMM:
We do observed a resource crunch recently at various food places. Plates will pile up, etc...
Remember the times when we had more hawker centres, hawkers mended their own stalls and cleared dishes that belonged to them? They had to come up with their own manpower (usually their spouses, children / friends/ relatives). When they collected back their own utensils, they could tell if customers liked their food or not (left-overs if they don't like). Yes, things could be tough for them then, but their helped them to be efficient, to be alert - they practice mental arithmetic, memory training (remembering customers), they move around more.
Now, hawkers are different. Many are not even their own bosses. They get a salary, hence not driven by profitability. They know if customers like their food only when sales isn't picking up, and declines - which by then is already too late. For them, it wasn't their problem anyway. For those who mend their own stalls, their rentals are likely to take a hike after each renovation/ upgrading. For many hawkers, without an alternative place to continue with business, they retire. Many start developing high-blood pressure and the modern illnesses due to the sudden change in life-style and lack of physical activities. In time, they may find work as cleaners, work in Macs, but it is never the same - they are now workers.
Why do we need more and more workers? Don't we need more business-driven people so we don't rely so much on foreign investments? Why are hawker centres being demolished? And why are big corporations being given opportunities to rent out instead of small hawkers being given a chance to develop their own businesses? They existed before, why remove them? It is a non-reversible process, and the worse is yet to come. I feel.
Our system trains people to work, not to create. Our system drives people to be reliant - not to be self-reliant. Continue to get in more workers for the big corporations, and worse will be yet to come - for the people, not those at the top. -
Dora1:
Well, if he can earn a decent pay, own a flat, I'm sure there will be people who are willing to marry him. I think the crux of the problem is the super low wages. Plumbers, carpenters, mechanics are also technical people who deserve a decent pay. If they can earn a decent pay like say, and IT professional does, then why not? I won't mind my DD marry a plumber, it's the pay!!![/quote]concern2:
[quote=\"concern2\"]
Whatever one craves, there is a cost. I don't mind if my boy decides to be a plumber one day if he finds it is the most productive thing to do for a living - esp. if there is a market shortage. It is an honest living. But he must still get a tertiary education. Education should not be about what he does for a living later on. Doesn't mean if he can be a plumber now, I will not push him to do well in his studies. Hence, I never like to give kids the idea that they must study hard now so next time can make more money. They are 2 different issues. JMHO.
:hi5: But hor, next time who would want to marry my boy if he is a plumber? :faint: See, I don't mind if he's a plumber and he gets to spend more time with family. I also don't mind them wanting to get married earlier and have children at a younger age, and I can be a grandparent at an age which I can be mobile enough to give a helping hand if needed...only thing is would kiasuparents want their DD to marry a plumber? See, it's never about an honest day's work!
-
3Boys:
I can't speak for all industries, but for my industry, the MNCs are here because of the infrastructure and good work attitude of SCs. The preference to hire FT started because some local HR started to hire some FTs (which is fine with me). Then the numbers just started to swell when one of them made it to a management position. And it seems that it became very common in the industry, with some depts having 70-80% from the same country, adopting the work culture of their home country.Why does one assume that the lack of suitable job opportunities is down to the presence of foreign workers? One can make the case that if not for the presence of foreign workers (FTs, FWs or what have you), we would have even FEWER industries, and FEWER companies and FEWER HQs, and therefore, even less jobs for Singaporeans.
If having greater numbers of qualified workers take away jobs, then countries like the Philippines, India, China should have tons of high value jobs available for their resident citizens, since they are exporting tons of their most highly qualified people to OTHER countries, right?
So what's the truth? Foreigners create jobs or foreigners take away jobs? It's both.
People make it out to be a zero-sum game, when it is far from being the case.
Like I have shared earlier, due to a few major incidents in a few different companies, a few MNCs have decided to relook at their investment plans in SG because they feel that they are now paying 1st world overheads for a workforce with 3rd world working attitude.
That's why I am really worried when we say 55% of the population will be foreigners. Then why would investors pay a premium to come here then? They are here for the SC working attitude and infrastructure. -
MMM:
:rotflmao: This :imconstipated: so apt here!
Concern2,concern2:
:hi5: But hor, next time who would want to marry my boy if he is a plumber? :faint: See, I don't mind if he's a plumber and he gets to spend more time with family. I also don't mind them wanting to get married earlier and have children at a younger age, and I can be a grandparent at an age which I can be mobile enough to give a helping hand if needed...only thing is would kiasuparents want their DD to marry a plumber?
Maybe you got foresight... For all you know, maybe a plumber is paid more than a doctor next time. As without the plumber, maybe it will be :imconstipated:
Ho tan bo would depend on durability of appliances or :imconstipated: , competition in the market, how DIY people are in general, and how efficient one is. Maybe invent new kind of toilet bowl will be more ho tan..., then pakak with garmen, all public toilets must use our system...
-
And also when these FT reach a certain position where they have a say in hiring, they will want ti hire their own kind, to build up their ε°η, whether intentionally or subconciously. It is quite human nature.
Dora1:
I totally agree with you. 10+ years ago, when I was a fresh graduate, I had no problems look for a job even though I have no experience. The companies were will to give us a chance and train us. Now, in the stat board that I am in, there are 10 fresh uni grads who have technical degrees fr NUS and NTU, doing temp data entry and admin work. They said they can't find work, cos the companies all don't want to hire fresh graduates. My friends who are still in the industry say that's because for the same pay, they can hire FTs with abt 3-5 years experience. So its credit to the HR if they can get the max out of the same $$. However, these FTs bring their very different work culture with them. When their numbers are small, it is easier to mould them to adapt to the SG culture. But now we have 80% of the depts from the same country, the working culture is no longer SG. I shared previously that there are MNCs who are considering to stop further investments in SG because they find that SG now has 1st world cost of doing business, but 3rd world work attitude. And on top of that, the young SG grads cannot find work and are doing stg totally unrelated. a few years later, companies will continue to lament that they need to hire more FTs because no SCs with relevant experience and expertise. They were never given the chance in the 1st place, how to have the experience?MMM:
Personally, I don't mind FT in some area (eg. construction, cleaner, etc...) I also don't mind some in service but it does get alarming if every shop you go, you think you are in another country or to the effect that all the NTUC local aunties are being replaced by F\"T\"... then I think that is really too much.
We do observed a resource crunch recently at various food places. Plates will pile up, etc... and there are only a few cleaners. The positive aspect is that we start to see local old folks taking up more of those job as compared to before where it's mainly done by F\"T\". Some of these old folks need a job and they probably didn't stand a chance earlier before the stricter control????
In the workplace, we have alot of FT. In my old co., locals are the minorities. Though we work harmoniously together as a team but I feel that some of these jobs don't actually need a FT. These are jobs that can be performed by our local graduates. So are our local graduates being deprived a chance due to that????
If the companies cannot hire FTs so freely like during my time, I'm sure they will be more willing to hire fresh graduates. -
MMM:
They are already getting that lah. Recently I get a plumber to repair a spoilt tap, Cost $120 for 20mins job.
Concern2,concern2:
:hi5: But hor, next time who would want to marry my boy if he is a plumber? :faint: See, I don't mind if he's a plumber and he gets to spend more time with family. I also don't mind them wanting to get married earlier and have children at a younger age, and I can be a grandparent at an age which I can be mobile enough to give a helping hand if needed...only thing is would kiasuparents want their DD to marry a plumber?
Maybe you got foresight... For all you know, maybe a plumber is paid more than a doctor next time. As without the plumber, maybe it will be :imconstipated: -
pirate:
Sometimes is not that they are not willing to accept lower pay, but it is that hiring is εζ by the agencies (the HR people like to outsourse their job to agencies) , and the agencies probably have connection with overseas agencies , and may be they can make more by recommending foreigner.Dora1:
I totally agree with you. 10+ years ago, when I was a fresh graduate, I had no problems look for a job even though I have no experience. The companies were will to give us a chance and train us. Now, in the stat board that I am in, there are 10 fresh uni grads who have technical degrees fr NUS and NTU, doing temp data entry and admin work. They said they can't find work, cos the companies all don't want to hire fresh graduates. My friends who are still in the industry say that's because for the same pay, they can hire FTs with abt 3-5 years experience.
Maybe you should ask those 10 fresh uni grads why they never take the initiative to offer to take a lower pay to undergo on-the-job training doing the front-line operations work of their desired prospective employers? Why they rather go do data-entry and low level admin work in a stat board? How they expect to get relevant experience if they not willing to get their hands dirty or their shirts sweaty or scolded by unreasonable customers?
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better π
Register Login