Are you ready for 7 million people on tiny Singapore?

[WeiHan]

What is wrong with a more liberal attitude towards sex?


What is so good about traditional family values for us to cling to it?

Are countries with more permissive sex attitude really worse than us in a broad spectrum of measures?

I say, there is no concrete proofs that a victorian sex attitude leads to stronger society so why the need to cling to it?

[concern2]

3Boys:

JannettLee:

[quote=\"raysusan\"]http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/379316_608040349212552_165554393_n.jpg\">

Based on the comparison, I must say WP scores better than PAP's

It's such an obvious piece of propaganda and you are falling for it?

I can also say 'Strong economic growth is in the best interest of Singaporeans'.

How, you believe me or not?[/quote] I don't get it. Why are we scrutinizing on WP's proposal? Is the White Paper very convincing? I find WP is over-doing. They don't have to propose, do they? IS's speech already nailed it very well. But of course, WP has come up with alternatives. How else will people let them go so easily just pointing at the problems and not providing alternative solutions?

IT IS NOT LIKE WE ARE CHOOSING BETWEEN PAP'S WHITE PAPER AND THE WP'S WHITE PAPER, ARE WE? Goodness, the comparison by Low is a simplified way of viewing the differences in approach to the same set of problems. If you say it is propaganda, ya, perhaps - the propaganda that there could be other alternatives, other perception to similar issues - so what is wrong with that?

Can PAP claim they have explored those areas mentioned before pushing out the White Papers? If so, how? And what are their thoughts to those? Any statistics to back up their claim? Are they even aware that there COULD be other alternatives as brought up by the MPs? And what is PAP's stand on IS's admittance of failed policies in the past? And would we be making the same mistakes again, adding more problems to the existing ones by embracing this White Paper?

I like the fact that the WP is providing and formulating alternative solutions, although I may not, at this point in time, agree to all they have brought up. It takes deeper considerations and time for people to adjust. Yet, it is a bitter pill that is easier to swallow than to take a risk of permanent environmental and social damage.

[concern2]

Anyway, will be busy with CNY preparation. Much has changed over the years, but I am glad many still value this traditional celebration. HAPPY LUNAR NEW YEAR, everyone! GONG XI FA CAI! XIN XIANG SHI CHENG! :celebrate:

[crony.026118in.026118ksp]

Harlequin:

crony.in.ksp:

All these ostriches have lots of hot air suggestions after burying their heads under the hot sand for too long


Anything non-PAP is like genius to them even though they are most alike with dodo birds

Psst... She thought we are the same person. :rotflmao: I received a PM from a kind member last night, about what she wrote on another thread... Hahahaha...you see, she has a \"thing\" about nailing whoever is/are her perceived suspect/s. You know, they call it an obsession.

She is a bird species expert, so, don't play play. :rotflmao: I don't have any bird, if you have any bird you better :siam: far far before she made your bird her private specimen collection :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

Take care, keep posting, I enjoy reading your posts... :rahrah:

Who is she ? A bird person ? Lady bird ? She interested in my bird ?

[pirate]

WeiHan:

What is wrong with a more liberal attitude towards sex?


What is so good about traditional family values for us to cling to it?

Are countries with more permissive sex attitude really worse than us in a broad spectrum of measures?

I say, there is no concrete proofs that a victorian sex attitude leads to stronger society so why the need to cling to it?

Nothing wrong what. While we are at it, Singapore can also pioneer childbearing contracts so that our boys can have the option of single parenthood too. Got grandchildren can already. Son-in-law or daughter-in-law all optional. Dun need all these in-law problems.

[limlim]

3Boys:

But they are the same thing!! Was the end result of being a single parent not the consequence of 'irresponsible intercourse' (as you put it)?. If there is no stigma or societal sanction (and I am NOT saying there should be) to being a single parent, then where is the societal stigma to 'irresponsible intercourse'?

legislation can work against irresponsible behaviors w/o penalizing single parenthood.

[toddles]

pirate:

WeiHan:

What is wrong with a more liberal attitude towards sex?


What is so good about traditional family values for us to cling to it?

Are countries with more permissive sex attitude really worse than us in a broad spectrum of measures?

I say, there is no concrete proofs that a victorian sex attitude leads to stronger society so why the need to cling to it?

Nothing wrong what. While we are at it, Singapore can also pioneer childbearing contracts so that our boys can have the option of single parenthood too. Got grandchildren can already. Son-in-law or daughter-in-law all optional. Dun need all these in-law problems.

Victorian sex attitude? Wow Singapore's been called many things but victorian is quite fresh.

i dunno... less abortions in victorian times i suppose, more orphanages?

all these issues seem so intractable. makes the 'should i migrate' thread heat up...

[JannettLee]

PAP kept asking Singaporean to take bitter pills (for those unpopular policies)all these while for the betterment in future. Now, they have to assess if Singaporean is really better off now as compared to 10 years ago. Is the current buying power better than before for whatever money they have now across all levels of social group? They have to review their existing policies from time to time and assess if those implemented policies work according to their plan/intention and then make changes accordingly.


Judging from ton of noises made from all walks of life now and so much unhappiness expressed online on many websites , I have very strong feeling that most of the people are not enjoying all those benefits from our good GDP growth here all these years. I think many Singaporeans feel they are worse off now than 10 years ago and their buying power is deteriorating. PAP must assess which social group(s) are badly hit and formulate policies to help these affected social groups. People will not buy in the policy now as they know that having more people here means they will face even keener competition.

[3Boys]

limlim:

3Boys:

But they are the same thing!! Was the end result of being a single parent not the consequence of 'irresponsible intercourse' (as you put it)?. If there is no stigma or societal sanction (and I am NOT saying there should be) to being a single parent, then where is the societal stigma to 'irresponsible intercourse'?

legislation can work against irresponsible behaviors w/o penalizing single parenthood.

How? How about young adults boozing up and sleeping around? Throw them in jail?

We're not Saudi Arabia, you know?

[3Boys]

WeiHan:

What is wrong with a more liberal attitude towards sex?


What is so good about traditional family values for us to cling to it?

Are countries with more permissive sex attitude really worse than us in a broad spectrum of measures?

I say, there is no concrete proofs that a victorian sex attitude leads to stronger society so why the need to cling to it?

It's sad you do not hold any value to traditional family values, including sanctity of marriage.

Figures show that children from normal 2-parent families do better in school, have higher self esteem, and are more successful in adult life. Not to say that those from broken homes don't make it, but the odds are slightly stacked.

If a free-for-all is supposedly superior, then why, even in the most permissive societies, are there laws that allow for divorce on the grounds of adultery?

Because like it or not, there are boundaries when it comes to sex and relationships. Like it or not, those boundaries are what we call values.

Even the most permissive societies value families, and have laws that protect them. And if it is not values that define a family, that what does? If values do not define human behaviours, then what does?

Just because you do not believe in or have experienced the power of 'traditional family values', does not mean that it does not exist of has no value for the rest of us.