PSLE 2012 - Results Discussion
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Seems like there are lots of students who scored extremely well, above 260, followed by another group that scored below expectation ie below 230.
The problem with PSLE is it doesn’t truly measure the child’s aptitude. All the stake is placed in one precarious basket. Anything can go wrong during this period. My friend’s DD had her period just a day before the exams! I hate to believe it’s luck but come to think of it, it might be a factor not to be scoffed at.
The marking and T-score is not transparent. Who knows if the scores are skewed one year towards MT and the next year on Math? -
cherryc:
Those highlighted in blue - how true is it? Even my friend (his DD in GEP) was telling me that they can afford to get 10-15 points less in T-score to compete with mainstreamers for a particular place in TOP school. Very UNFAIR. Infact, I will expect GEP children to get more points to enter TOP schools as they are \"gifted\"To name or not to name? (That is not the question)
Posted on Nov 22, 2012 4:26 PM Updated: Nov 22, 2012 10:26 PM
By Hri Kumar Nair
[email protected]
MOE’s decision not to publish the names of top PSLE students and schools was deemed sufficiently important to warrant mention on the front page of the Strait Times. These days, it seems anything to do with PSLE does.
I must admit that the news did not overwhelm me. The move is obviously intended to downplay the importance PSLE. But will it ease the pressure? I doubt it.
Parents, principals and teachers will still consider the PSLE to be a critical, high stakes exam. That will continue to dictate how they approach it, including the pressure they will place on our children to perform and the steps they will take (tuition) to ensure success.
The MOE has said that it will look at PSLE as part of a holistic review of the education system, and that this will take time. This is reasonable. We should avoid making hasty decisions and not lose sight of the larger picture. The real question is what is in the minds of our planners and what do they perceive the issues to be? Discouraging press reports of top performers gives very little insight on what is on the table.
Yes, every school is a good school - but some schools are better.
It is not about facilities – MOE equips all schools with good facilities. It is about the school culture, tradition, teachers and peers. You will not convince anyone that it does not matter which secondary school a child goes to.
While going to a particular school does not guarantee success, every parent wants to give their child the best opportunities possible. That means sending them to a school with the right environment and culture, which challenges students to work harder and do better. Schools with good track records will always attract more applicants.
So long as PSLE determines which school a child goes to, there will always be stiff competition, and therefore stress. This is unavoidable, and not always a bad thing. Our children should learn that getting what they want does not come easily and sometimes, things do not go according to plan. But if they do well, there is nothing wrong with letting the rest of us know about it. Perhaps others will learn and draw inspiration.
The question should therefore be about substance, not form. If it keeps PSLE, MOE should focus on ensuring a system of proper assessment and fair competition for places. There are some things they can do. For example:
Ensure that teachers teach the syllabus properly and thoroughly, so that students are not forced to look to tuition to fill in the gaps. This unbalances the playing field;
Have a robust system which properly assesses principals and teachers, and remove poor performers without delay;
Look seriously into DPM Tharman’s point about how we draw such fine lines in our PSLE scoring system. I remain unconvinced that T-scores properly measure the ability of a student; and
Get rid of direct school admissions for students in the GEP. If they are truly gifted, they can compete with everyone else at the PSLE.Mr Hri Kumar Nair is an MP for Bishan-Toa Payoh GRC -
CayennePepper:
But... the GEP curriculum is not targeted at preparing for PSLE.phtthp:
The GEP kids naturally will score better in PSLE - cos they have special teachers, special care and learn much more than Mainstream pupils.
Exposure to various things really matters. -
I love that letter to MOE. I agreed with DSA process, why GEP students are given different route compared to mainstream students?
Please keep us update with the reply from the authority. -
CKmum:
Why r some parents here getting narrow minded about d GEppers n keep targeting them juz becos their own children r nt?
To be fair for the mainstreamers. -
Coolkidsrock2:
This seems to be true for 5 kids I know, out by at least 1 big figure from expectations.
True for my DD. But what does this mean?
1. Cohort mean score has gone up
2. number students having 260+ t-score have increased significantly.[/quote]
I'm puzzled too. Could it be 1 or 2 schools producing too many top scorers and thus pulling others down?[/quote]
Nobody to answer our questions. Don't know where to find the answers.Very stunned n puzzled.
My daughter was in the top 10 range in her school. Now the others who were far behind has overtaken her.
Now I know how the hare, in the tortoise and hare story, felt after the tortoise had won(though we did not fell asleep like the tortoise).[/quote]
I have spoken to my kid's tutor earlier. He said some of his students in the top of their respective classes saw their T Score dropped significantly. The same happened to my kid as his result is below what he is capable of. This is a big surprise to the tutor and he said some of his students' parents will be going back to their kids' school to try to find out why the large difference in PSLE results and school results. -
Remind and reassure your child that PSLE score does not change who he is overnight. Still the same person. The choice of secondary is just another milestone in a long journey. Entering his dream school does not guarantee anything, just the pleasure of donning the uniform and badge.
One parent shared that by enrolling in a secondary school with lower COP might in fact, be a blessing in disguise ie getting into better classes, priority in CCA selection and a greater chance to shine. -
CayennePepper:
Totally agree with you, CayennePepper.
Erm, many geppers also go through GAT for DSA. Just like those who apply through other domains. And i'm personally aware that not all geppers get COs; top schs are selective and are not as 'indiscriminating' as many parents presume.sinoboy:
Agree not targeting the GEP. Just that some top schools pre-selected these students using DSA on the assumption that they are truly gifted. It would be a fairer system if GEPpers are put to the test at PSLE to see how truly 'gifted' they are.
Definitely OT already!
For those who have said/implied in one or another that the GEP seems to have specially prepared the students for PSLE - you don't understand what GEP is about. For GEP students, the school usually doesn't really start preparing them for the PSLE until well after the 2nd term (only in July and for some schools, late July/early August) unlike their mainstream counterparts who have been geared towards the PSLE since day one of P6. In fact, they still have to submit their social studies portfoliio in July and take their social studies exams in August. GEP students may have been exposed to more challenging topics but usually some of these are out of the PSLE examination boundaries.
So, if a parents' hope is that their child gets into GEP so that will he or girl will be given \"special training\" become the top scorer for PSLE, then they will be in for a rude shock. This is because GEP is not about giving special treatment for a group of students so that they can score well for PSLE. GEP is about differentiated learning for this group for children who may become bored and disinterested in learning if they are are not mentally challenged.
It's not my intention to offend anyone in this forum. I wish that one will not make sweeping statement or unsubstantiated statement. Be fair to all - I'm sure that all the P6s have worked hard regardless of results. They deserved to be praised. -
kwcllf:
Well looking at the standard response leads me to conclude that they will keep silent on how T scores will be awarded and keep quiet on who are the top students to avoid more complaints of unfairness like this. Hope the authorities can really look into the GEP/DSA loopholes.
My views to Singapore Conversation:
------------------------------
On Wed, Nov 21, 2012 7:19 PM PST Our Singapore Conversation wrote:
>
>
>Dear XXX
>
>Thank you for taking the time and effort to pen
>down and share your thoughts and ideas about the DSA process, and how to
>tweak processes and procedures to make it more equitable. We understand
>that the selection criteria for children to secondary school and the
>PSLE examinations are of as much importance to parents as they are to
>the children who are taking the examinations, and your suggestions are
>well taken!
>
>We will take your views into consideration as we continue
>organising the dialogue sessions to develop a collective vision for the
>future. Specific policy ideas will also be deliberated at a later stage,
>as we involve Singaporeans in a series of discussions on how to achieve
>our collective vision together.
>
>The Our Singapore Conversation is an
>opportunity for us to reaffirm what is good and relevant; recalibrate in
>areas where we might have gone off course; and refresh to break new
>ground. Would you be keen to participate in one of these dialogues? I
>think that your experiences and ideas would be a valuable contribution
>to the conversation.
>
>Please consider registering for a session at
>https://www.oursgconversation.sg/lets-talk-2/signup/ [1].
>
>Thank you
>once again, and do also encourage your friends to take part in this
>national conversation on Singapore's future.
>
>Warm regards,
>
>Tim @ Our
>Singapore Secretariat
>
>On 2012-11-20 15:00, Weng Chi Kuan wrote:
>
>>
>Dear Sirs,
>>
>> The topic on reducing stress for the PSLE exam has
>stirred emotions considerably and it is almost impossible to find a
>solution that satisfy everyone.
>>
>> I have a son who took his PSLE
>exam this year and is anxiously waiting for his results this Thursday.
>Having gone through the process with him, I wish to offer some thoughts
>on the process of secondary admission to make it fairer.
>>
>> With the
>introduction of Direct School Admission (DSA), the MOE has given schools
>a certain degree of discretion in admitting students that have special
>abilities in other areas, such as sports. Although this gives a student
>a \"better\" chance of being admitted to a Elite or Top school, I strongly
>feel the system can be made more equitable.
>>
>> My son has also gone
>through the DSA route, but unfortunately, he was unsuccessful.
>Nevertheless, the experience I gained from the process I hope to share
>with you.
>>
>> By reading through forums like Kiasuparents, I have
>gathered that many parents have used the DSA process as an \"insurance\"
>policy. Many would apply for multiple schools through DSA and quite a
>number of them have been successful in more than one schools. As they
>only decides whether to accept the \"Confirmed Offer\" after they have
>taken the PSLE exam, such hoarding of places have denied other equally
>deserving students of getting into their \"Dream\" schools.
>>
>> For
>those that have \"Confirmed Offers\", they will obviously be less stressedm
>when taking their PSLE exam, compared to those that did not gain entry
>into any schools through DSA (or those that did not apply for DSA), as
>they can fall back on the \"Confirmed Offers\" given to them. This will
>cause an unlevel playing field for these two sets of students taking the
>PSLE exam. For those that do not have a \"Confirmed Offer\" through DSA,
>they will have to slog it out in the DO-OR-DIE PSLE exam. Obviously,
>this will add on to the stress level that MOE is trying so hard to
>lessen.
>>
>> Currently, successful DSA applicants will decide whether
>to accpet the \"Confirmed Offers\" ONLY after they sat for their PSLE
>exam. If they felt that they did no do too well, then they can decide
>after the PSLE exam to accept the \"Confirmed Offers\" and need not wait
>for the release of PSLE results. Why are they given such an Advantage
>over students that are unsuccessful in their DSA or those that did not
>apply?? To eradicate this anomaly, successful DSA applicants must decide
>whether to accept the \"Confirmed Offer\" before sitting for the PSLE
>exam. If they don't want to accept the \"Confirmed Offer\", then they must
>compete Fairly with everyone else in the PSLE exam to gain entry into
>their \"Dream\" schools.
>>
>> Also, applying for DSA can be an expensive
>affair. For example, ACS Independent charges $80.00 and School of
>Science and Technology $95.00 to take the placement tests. This can be a
>huge burden to not-so-well-to-do families. In other words, the process
>favours the better-off families that can afford to apply for multiple
>DSAs. For those that cannot afford, then they will have less chances of
>getting the schools they wanted via DSA.
>>
>> In DSA exercises, some
>Elite schools have separate admission criteria for Gifted Education
>Programme (GEP) and Mainstream students. Although the GEP programme has
>been well-debated over the years, should we still want to differentiate
>the two sets of students gaiing admission into secondary schools. I feel
>that this should be abolished so that admission will be fair to all
>students. If need be, after the students enter secondary schools, they
>can be re-sorted and exceptionally academically bright students can be
>offered special programmes. As we know, GEP students are exposed to
>higher-order exposures in the various subjects and I am sure most take
>Math Olympiad courses which will give them an a Clear advantage over
>students in the Mainstream.
>>
>> Although I support MOE's DSA approach
>to offer students different pathways into their \"dream\" schools, clearly
>the system has to be tweaked to make it fairer. The following is my
>humble suggestion:
>>
>> 1) limit the number of DSA applications
>(perhaps to a maximum of 2)
>> 2) make it less expensive to take the DSA
>placement tests
>> 3) students given \"Confirmed Offers\" via DSA MUST
>decide whether to accept the offer prior to sitting for the PSLE exam.
>Those that do not want to accept the \"Confirmed Offer\" must give up ASAP
>(ie, shorten the deadline than currently) to prevent hoarding of school
>places and free them up for students that really want them.
>> 4) sort
>out students given \"Confirmed Offers\" via DSA early. Those who decide to
>give up their \"Confirmed Offers\" will compete with everyone else to gain
>admission into their \"Dream\" schools through the PSLE exam in an
>equitable environment.
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>> XXX
>>
>
>Links:
>------
>[1]
>https://www.oursgconversation.sg/lets-talk-2/signup/
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HAPPYH:
CKmum:
Why r some parents here getting narrow minded about d GEppers n keep targeting them juz becos their own children r nt?
To be fair for the mainstreamers.
Definitely GEPpers are the target because MOE draws a 'rosy' pictures for us. Not everyone is knowledgable like you. The impression MOE gives is that GEP is 'Tian Cai ban'.
Our expectations for GEPers are high. We don't expect them to be the next Chipmunk or Gay cases.
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