Can through-train school work in kiasu Singapore?
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zac's mum\" post_id=\"2101042\" time=\"1678788554\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2101042 time=1678788554 user_id=53606]
By then all schools other than IP are homogenous …..all schools are good schools ya……I don’t even think the concept of express only even applies since there’s already SBB which could be differentiated at the sec Sch level.
So what COP will the IP schools end up with?
And what about the non-IP but Express SAP schools (eg NHHS, MSHS)? What COP will they have?
And what about the FSBB schools? What COP will they have?
When nobody knows how many of the primary school population will be opting in or out, how to gauge the demand and anticipated COP of these secondary schools? Not total screw up meh?[/quote] -
If the intend of TT system is for P6 students to skip PSLE and nothing else, then it will be not difficult for MOE to run a dual patth program to to allow P6 students to skip PSLE and yet still get promoted to secondary school. However if parents are expecting TT to help them secure enrolment to good and branded secondary school without PSLE, then the TT will fail.
Personally I think its unrealistic and cruel to expect parents to commit their preschooler to a 10 years untested and unproven program. At the same time, its also not possible for MOE to justify commiting resources to creating TT schools without certainty of the demand for such program.
What we need to avoid is to spend all the resources and effort to create TT schoo but there is no demand because the schools are not branded enough to entice parents to sign up. For these reasons, MOE will most unlikely to create any special TT schools with single purpose for now. -
I do not support to completely remove PSLE.
It is still necessary for smarter kids but without resources to display their abilities, whom may go unnoticed otherwise, and talents esp in baby scarce sg should not go wasted. Those who want psle to be abolished are those with means and resources. I recall, psle was meant to give a better chance for the common people. But i cannot find the source. So we have to think carefully before removing it.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://lkyspp.nus.edu.sg/docs/default-source/ips/td_psle-still-a-necessary-checkpoint-for-students-study_170717-pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiTrJmRudv9AhV3xDgGHa4dDEYQFnoECB8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw15uueU9HOME4OtmhScqWEo
lkyspp.nus.edu.sg
https://lkyspp.nus.edu.sg › ipsPDF
PSLE still a necessary checkpoint for students: Study -
00skyblue00\" post_id=\"2101061\" time=\"1678799331\" user_id=\"143605:
Like it or hate it, PSLE has for generations served as an important checkpoint for students and a dependable and meritocratic S1 posting mechanism. Those MPs who are advocating for TT school system are the same people who have benefits from PSLE, which allows them to enroll in schools such as St Nic, RGS, and RI. I presume the reason why they or their parents choose these branded schools some 20 to 30 years ago is the still same reason why these schools remain popular and sought after.
I do not support to completely remove PSLE.
It is still necessary for smarter kids but without resources to display their abilities, whom may go unnoticed otherwise, and talents esp in baby scarce sg should not go wasted. Those who want psle to be abolished are those with means and resources. I recall, psle was meant to give a better chance for the common people. But i cannot find the source. So we have to think carefully before removing it.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://lkyspp.nus.edu.sg/docs/default-source/ips/td_psle-still-a-necessary-checkpoint-for-students-study_170717-pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiTrJmRudv9AhV3xDgGHa4dDEYQFnoECB8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw15uueU9HOME4OtmhScqWEo
lkyspp.nus.edu.sg
https://lkyspp.nus.edu.sg › ipsPDF
PSLE still a necessary checkpoint for students: Study
One of the biggest expenditures for the Singapore government is education and I would consider education as one of the most important pillars to ensure Singapore's survival. Will MOE risk our kids' future by abolishing Singapore's proven but not perfect education system in favor of an unproven and untested TT system? I sincerely hope not.
A more sensible thing to do is perhaps to make skipping PSLE an available option for all while keeping PSLE at the core to serve as a checkpoint for S1 posting. Some may not like it, but the majority do see the merit and necessity for it. Doing the other way by forcing parents into accepting TT system will risk creating more social divide and many unexpected problems which will be hard to address. -
I don’t understand how making the option to skip PSLE available to everyone in every primary school will work. Which secondary school will they go to then, if there isnt a special TT secondary school for them to go to?
If slot them into a nearby secondary school, which nearby school? Will their classmates cry unfair if the school is supposedly higher than their perceived ability? -
zac's mum\" post_id=\"2101074\" time=\"1678805872\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2101074 time=1678805872 user_id=53606]
I don’t understand how making the option to skip PSLE available to everyone in every primary school will work. Which secondary school will they go to then, if there isnt a special TT secondary school for them to go to?
If slot them into a nearby secondary school, which nearby school? Will their classmates cry unfair if the school is supposedly higher than their perceived ability?[/quote]
The proposed TT system which starts from P1 to S4 will not work because kids at 5 to 6 are simply too young for parents to chart their education pathway. For this reason it will be better to drop the idea of TT system and just replace it with a simple opt-out system to allow students at P5 to decide if they wish to drop PSLE.
Those who opt out, will not take PSLE but will be required to take the Prelim exam. These opt out students will also not be permitted to particulate in DSA selection admission either. This is to be fair to other students who need to juggle PSLE and their DSA domain related participation, and also consistent in providing a less stressful less competition primary school life for those preferred.
As for S1 posting, students who opt-out from PSLE will also get to select their preferred 5 secondary schools at the same time PSLE student make their selection. But the difference is that non-PSLE students posting will only take place after PSLE students' S1 posting is completed. This means non-PSLE students will get posted to their school of choice ONLY if there are still vacancies after S1 posting. It is only fair that PSLE students get priority admission.
Some may be concerned that there may not be sufficient vacancies left, but that shouldn't happen because the pool of students per cohort is quite consistent, so if more student opt-out, there will be fewer PSLE students applying for S1 posting.
As long as MOE fulfills parents' wish or desire to allow their child to skip PSLE, there is really no need to be concerned if parents or students who choose to opt out are happy or not. In some way, this is similar to thru-train, it just doesn't start at P1 and not in the same school, and certainly not branded school either. -
zac's mum\" post_id=\"2101074\" time=\"1678805872\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2101074 time=1678805872 user_id=53606]
The difference between TT and opt-out (OO) system is that under TT system students will likely adopt the mindset that they are different and they can take it easy. If they spend 10 years away from \"mainstream\" there will also be a risk that they may be treated or develop differently, especially when they enter JC or Poly.
If slot them into a nearby secondary school, which nearby school? Will their classmates cry unfair if the school is supposedly higher than their perceived ability?[/quote]
With TT it may take at least a good 10 to 15 years to know if the TT system can yield the desired outcome of no PSLE and yet produce positive outcomes at O-Level. The big risk here is to have 10 to 15 years of student wasted in a program that doesn't work for Singapore. doesn't work could mean, poor outcomes, disgruntled parents, and no reduction in stress.
With the OO system at P5, all students will still go through the mainstream education from P1 to P6 except by end of P5 they will decide if they are taking PSLE. If they keep quiet, no classmate will know until PSLE day itself.
And similarly, for S1 posting, no one in their schools will know if they are from the opt-out pathway as it's not common for S1 students to compare PSLE results. Mixing them together will also ensure OO students continue their education journey like other students. For those outstanding OO students who desire to try to IP schools, they still can do it after Y2 via Y3 admission instead of TT program where they are stuck in the school until O-Level.
With OO system, SS will still need to decide if opt-out students should be posted to express or NT etc. Perhaps using their P5 and prelim exam results will be a good starting point?
Will the OO system become popular? I think only time will tell. But my guess is without assurance of branded secondary school to go to, the take-up rate may be low. And this is perhaps a good way for MOE to test the real interest behind parents who favor skipping PSLE. -
There is a pfp for poly, do u all think a "sfp" will work? Using p5 sch results/sch recommendation to "dsa" to selected sec schs set aside for this sfp. Accepted students will leave sch by end of Term 1 of p6 n join the selected sec sch (eg sch that offers the various banded subj in Sec1 to cater to those who needed more time n also lateral transfer for late bloomers, not those express only or IP schs). Moe can look at how successful is (n the challenges of) pfp to gauge if this new initiative to bypass psle for certain grps of students is feasible. They can then start foundation preparation for sec sch subj instead of drilling for psle (that is if the belief is that psle drilling is not part of building a proper/strong fdn for sec sch subj).
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jedamum\" post_id=\"2101093\" time=\"1678838958\" user_id=\"159:
Accepted students should leave by end of P6 Term 2 (June), not leave at end of Term 1 (March)
There is a pfp for poly, do u all think a \"sfp\" will work? Using p5 sch results/sch recommendation to \"dsa\" to selected sec schs set aside for this sfp. Accepted students will leave sch by end of Term 1 of p6 n join the selected sec sch (eg sch that offers the various banded subj in Sec1 to cater to those who needed more time n also lateral transfer for late bloomers, not those express only or IP schs). Moe can look at how successful is (n the challenges of) pfp to gauge if this new initiative to bypass psle for certain grps of students is feasible. They can then start foundation preparation for sec sch subj instead of drilling for psle (that is if the belief is that psle drilling is not part of building a proper/strong fdn for sec sch subj).
Because
some primary schools are only able to complete teaching MOE P6
(Science + Maths) entire syllabus, by the end of May. And May month is still in Term 2, not Term 1.
After May month is over,
AFTER
the entire P6 school syllabus teaching is over & done with,
these students since not taking any more PSLE,
are now free to go directly to their Through train Secondary school and start their brand new Secondary 1 journey,
AFTER
the long one month June school holiday break is over.
No point
for these students to hang around in P6 Semester 2, from July onwards, since they are not even taking any PSLE National exam.
If these \"through train\" P6 students still hang around the primary school premises in P6 July (Semester 2), then their presence inside the school compound will only disturb the other hardworking group of P6 students, who are busy preparing for their coming PSLE. Parents of this P6 hardworking group, surely u won't want this to happen to your child, right? -
jedamum\" post_id=\"2101093\" time=\"1678838958\" user_id=\"159:
This sounds feasible. Maybe an option for the kids doing Foundation subjects for P5 to start Sec 1 one year earlier, so that they have extra time to get used to the 8 subjects?
There is a pfp for poly, do u all think a \"sfp\" will work? Using p5 sch results/sch recommendation to \"dsa\" to selected sec schs set aside for this sfp. Accepted students will leave sch by end of Term 1 of p6 n join the selected sec sch (eg sch that offers the various banded subj in Sec1 to cater to those who needed more time n also lateral transfer for late bloomers, not those express only or IP schs). Moe can look at how successful is (n the challenges of) pfp to gauge if this new initiative to bypass psle for certain grps of students is feasible. They can then start foundation preparation for sec sch subj instead of drilling for psle (that is if the belief is that psle drilling is not part of building a proper/strong fdn for sec sch subj).
IMO PSLE maths drilling is not part of Sec maths foundation at all. My kid now Sec 1 doing algebra way of solving “psle Assumption method, age gap questions”, so much easier for him. He hated model method. Thrown out the window, good riddance!
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