Petition to Review the Singapore Education System

[Busymom]

Edureach:

The awkward situation we are in occurs not just at PSLE level which many here are focussing but in the most important common exam- GCE A-level.


Many rejected applicants, both A-level and poly, are warmly welcome to study down under not to mention many of our undergrads in NUS, NTU and SMU are academically good enough for UK unis like LSE, Imperial and Warwick.

Maybe, our education system is so superior or our kids here overperform?

Hmm... I remember someone said in another thread that Singapore students have fallen behind many other Asian countries like Japan, Korea, Hong Kong and Taiwan... :roll:

[verykiasu2010]

Busymom:

Way2GO:

However I do agree with ur view dat if MOE keeps pegging d exams at higher difficulty level after each PSLE, those who can’t keep up or cannot afford outside help will be disadvantage n it shouldn’t be.

Are there past-years papers like in the 'O' and 'A' levels? If yes, would be easy to see if MOE keeps pegging the PSLE exams at higher level of difficulty with each succeeding year.

there are past years questions around

the standard hardly varies, though there are differences in style of question, if that could qualify as 'higher' standard

[Busymom]

2ppaamm:

This brings to light another point: Grade inflation. It will come a time when many will be getting a string of A* and still low T-score. This will happen when everyone is geared towards exams, and students become exam-smart. So those A* no longer will mean anything (like in the case of half of RJC students getting straight As in 'A' levels). I'm sure when this situation arises, the examiners will have to find a way to distinguish the students by either increasing the standard of the tests, test outside the syllabus or mark the tests narrowly. This contradicts creativity in children and exploration. Children will then be even more afraid to make mistakes and venture. Our children will become less risk-takers. A hallmark of our education product.

Actually, I 'll be surprised if there isn't a normal bell curve for 'O' and 'A' level as well. How then to ensure some consistency in the results as exams are set by humans and you can't ensure that every year, papers would be set at the same standard.

2ppaamm:

The sec schools can use a basket of entry criteria besides academic grades for entry. This can be interviews, cca etc. As it is DSA is school based rather than student based. The school chooses the CCA they want to emphasize and select students who are good in that area. This makes the school rounded, but not the student.

I agree with you here (since I said the same thing earlier about CCA, etc.), but there could still be a problem. One part of me wonder if kids will end up being burnt at both ends if we go this route. Also, are the kids (at 12yo) too young for this...

Our friend's kids living and studying in the US have to take up some competitive sports, besides a sterling academic result, in order to have a chance to get into the Ivy Leagues (heard it is even more competitive if you are a resident as there is a quota for students coming from each state/county). However, these are the equivalent of our secondary school students, not primary school.

Would be interesting to do a poll to see if parents are keen for such a system.

[Busymom]

verykiasu2010:

Busymom:

[quote=\"Way2GO\"]However I do agree with ur view dat if MOE keeps pegging d exams at higher difficulty level after each PSLE, those who can’t keep up or cannot afford outside help will be disadvantage n it shouldn’t be.

Are there past-years papers like in the 'O' and 'A' levels? If yes, would be easy to see if MOE keeps pegging the PSLE exams at higher level of difficulty with each succeeding year.

there are past years questions around

the standard hardly varies, though there are differences in style of question, if that could qualify as 'higher' standard[/quote]So are you saying that the papers haven't become more difficult, just that the questions have become more difficult to comprehend? This may be possible for problem sums in Math, but would be difficult to do this for English or Chinese or even Science, right?

Or is it just a problem with some (or most?) schools trying to set killer papers in P5 and P6, which are way higher in standards than the actual PSLE papers?

[Chenonceau]

Busymom:

Actually, I 'll be surprised if there isn't a normal bell curve for 'O' and 'A' level as well. How then to ensure some consistency in the results as exams are set by humans and you can't ensure that every year, papers would be set at the same standard.

There is... there should be... and I also see that standards have risen, but at a more acceptable pace. A bit like house prices. Are these a gradual rise, in tandem with productivity and median pay? OR do they far outstrip median pay allowing capital rich people to become the only land and apartment owners. And being rich, they get richer.

I've looked into the requirements for Geography and Economics at 'A' levels... and standards have risen, but not shockingly (not for a Singaporean at least)... and quite in keeping with generally rising literacy rates worldwide and educational infrastructure in many countries. This could be because 'O' and 'A' levels are common in Commonwealth countries and not every country has the same level of educational infrastructure.

The 'O' and the 'A' bell curves is not just us. Other countries are part of that population too. The population is larger and hence there is more stability. We don't have that many students every year at the PSLE, and the bell curve just blows our standards away.

At the end of the day, my bugbear is not the risen standards. I support rising standards. My bugbear is that standards have risen to a point where teachers and schools cannot teach everything they test. I agree with Coast that the bell curve issue is secondary to the issue of adequate teaching, even though both are related. In my following post, I will provide a real life anecdote that shows this beyond all doubt.

Busymom:

Our friend's kids living and studying in the US have to take up some competitive sports, besides a sterling academic result, in order to have a chance to get into the Ivy Leagues (heard it is even more competitive if you are a resident as there is a quota for students coming from each state/county). However, these are the equivalent of our secondary school students, not primary school.

Would be interesting to do a poll to see if parents are keen for such a system.

The US system is not a good model in my opinion. It is Americans who invented the reality we know in Singapore today, from KPIs to bonuses to incentive systems. Theirs is a system that tends to accentuate top end and bottom end of the population. Burnout research started in teh USA because burnout became such a problem someone had to research it.

Singapore follows US so much that we end up where we are today.

Why not examine the Finns and see what we can learn? http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2062419,00.html. The Finnish have one of the world's best trained workforces without the burnout rate.

Reality can take many forms. We know the bell curve, we know the competitive systems that hold sway in many Anglo-Saxon worlds... we come from (at least Singaporean Chinese do) a culture that had the Imperial Exams where the prize that went to the top performer was fame, money and power... We know only this and think there are no alternatives to the bell curve, to school placement.

Really? No alternatives? We conclude this without searching... without thinking outside of the current reality that holds our minds and hearts captive? Perhaps, just as an intellectual exercise, we should try and imagine a world sans bell curve and see if we find something nice.

Be brave. Think outta the box and outside of the reality that we think has no alternative. I'm not saying I am right. I am just encouraging us to explore the idea first. It could well be a stupid idea but then, many of what we appreciate in life today looked like a stupid idea at first too.

\"Man can fly\" is one.

[Chenonceau]

verykiasu2010:

there are past years questions around


the standard hardly varies, though there are differences in style of question, if that could qualify as 'higher' standard

I kept my girl's papers from 7 years ago. Very different. Teachers who log in here attest to the rising standards. So... Emphasis on process skills is also relatively recent. I guess it depends on which years you are comparing to.

I have tried and cannot get PSLE papers earlier than 5 years ago.

[Chenonceau]

Real-life Anecdote that Teacher Refuses to Teach All that is Tested in Exams


3 weeks before SA1, I emailed the Math teacher 2 questions from Onsponge asking if she could explain to my son how to do them. The teacher said that the 2 questions were too difficult because some things have not yet been taught, and there is no time.

Guess what. AFTER SA1, when going through the papers, the teacher explained that the last question that my son could not do, was in fact, like the ones I had emailed her. If that is the case, why refuse to explain it before SA1?

There were students in the best class scoring 99.5% because their tutors taught them how from Onsponge. My son has no tutor, and I am no good at Math. His father is not always available to help. I was too naive and told my son \"Never mind. It won't be tested.\"

But it was. I was naive.

It isn't just the 5 marks though 5 marks are important if you're bell curving. Ya gotta be better than others because of the bell curve. It's also that this does not reflect the true ability nor work ethic of the child. The ones who scored 99.5% had tutors who made sure they learnt the technique. My son scored 94.5% for Math. If Teacher had taught him in response to his question, he would have scored 99.5% too.

The difference between my son's 94.5% and those others who scored 99.5% is Have Tutor and Have No Tutor.

[2ppaamm]

Chenonceau:

verykiasu2010:

there are past years questions around


the standard hardly varies, though there are differences in style of question, if that could qualify as 'higher' standard

I kept my girl's papers from 7 years ago. Very different. Teachers who log in here attest to the rising standards. So... Emphasis on process skills is also relatively recent. I guess it depends on which years you are comparing to.

I have tried and cannot get PSLE papers earlier than 5 years ago.

Oops I just threw out mine (papers from 2003) last weekend as we hv decided not to put any more children through psle and leave the Singapore system. I like Chen's remark about man can fly. Yes, there are alternatives, we just need to be brave. Write about it another time when I am on a computer.

[Sun_2010]

Chenonceau:

Real-life Anecdote that Teacher Refuses to Teach All that is Tested in Exams

I
3 weeks before SA1, I emailed the Math teacher 2 questions from Onsponge asking if she could explain to my son how to do them. The teacher said that the 2 questions were too difficult because some things have not yet been taught, and there is no time.

The difference between my son's 94.5% and those others who scored 99.5% is Have Tutor and Have No Tutor.

O! I know how much that can hurt. - the anger , helplessness :frustrated:

Anyway that is just a small exam, the war is only on next year!
:snuggles:

Given that things are likely to remain the same at least till your son's Psle, I really suggest you try and post your questions. The gurus here not just solve the problem, they use clear colorful models , and other explanations for a clear concise answers. And all within a few hours of posting. And the latest to join the Maths Demi God Club is our own Chief :evil:

PS: I have the Psle 2004-2009 series that I bought when DD was in P5, I think maths and science. Are you interested? But i not selling it just loan it 2012? Then you can return it ,
( assuming the world doesn't end by then of course )

[2ppaamm]

Sorry, don’t know why duplicate again.