TUTORS CHOOSING STUDENTS TO TEACH
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well…it is not mainly the academic results of the school teacher, but the character and personality as well. I simply dont understand, being an adult, would ransack someone’s cupboard and not only this, at times when i have to be overseas, the lessons were conducted at my mum’s place, and she did the same thing, when my mum taking the nap, she again ransack her cupboard, she can even just took the pork floss and eat it. Sometimes there were packets of titbits where friends or relatives bought from overseas, she just simply take and eat (even it is brand new packet, without asking for permission).
Another case of a primary school teacher, who is my neighbour, every morning, you can hear her voice shouting for her son to hurry up (at 6.30am). i am staying 2 doors away from hers, and i will be waken up by her voice. and many times i met her at the lift, i smile at her, she look away… and worst of all… many times when i was back and when the lift reached our floor, i cant come out of the lift, bcos she will be standing right at the middle of the door and not even waiting for ppl to come out first becos she tried to squeeze in (and many times, her husband had to tell her “let ppl come out first”).
Teachers are to teach, not only in acedemic but also being a role model… but with teachers like this… -
Mdm Koh:
What could be the reason for this trend that you're describing?whitecorp:
Granted there can be numerous explanations for why an individual fared badly, but thats not the main issue here-I am highlighting a trend where an increasing number of school teachers are incapable of meeting expectations when it comes to teaching ability. Its about the general picture, not the single person we should be focusing on.
I never said that straight A students would make good teachers, but for starters at least they would inspire greater confidence as compared to a straight Cs guy wouldn't you agree? What happens when they finally blossom into full fledged teachers would be another story.
Keep it simple and short: school teachers aren't as great as they are perceived to be these days, and thats a fact. Even those currently in the service also concurs with this observation.
JC H2 maths graduate tutor
I agree with you that a tutor who aced the subject would inspire confidence at the start, but this confidence may not last.
Ultimately, the tutor's job is make the student feel confident of his or her own abilities. It all comes back to how good the tutor is at teaching.
You are absolutely right on the tutor being able to make a student feel motivated. Many a time kids who approach me have low self esteem as a result of unforgiving criticisms dished out to them in school by either their peers or teachers over a prolonged period, and its really an uphill task to attempt reprogramming them.
The trend we are witnessing is essentially due to NIE taking in large numbers of low quality candidates owing to the general consensus that nobody in the right frame of mind would go there if he/she was given a choice: one only applies to be a teacher if you have nowhere else to go.The outstanding ones would have already flocked to law, medicine and engineering. You stuff crap into a machine, chances are you get crappy products. Plain simple. Of course you might still get some gems, but those are far and few. It doesn't take much to figure out how we arrived at this mess today.
Regardless how the education engine runs, I just do my very best to ensure my students survive their exhausting journeys.
JC H2 maths graduate tutor -
whitecorp:
What could be the reason for this trend that you're describing?Mdm Koh:
[quote=\"whitecorp\"]
Granted there can be numerous explanations for why an individual fared badly, but thats not the main issue here-I am highlighting a trend where an increasing number of school teachers are incapable of meeting expectations when it comes to teaching ability. Its about the general picture, not the single person we should be focusing on.
I never said that straight A students would make good teachers, but for starters at least they would inspire greater confidence as compared to a straight Cs guy wouldn't you agree? What happens when they finally blossom into full fledged teachers would be another story.
Keep it simple and short: school teachers aren't as great as they are perceived to be these days, and thats a fact. Even those currently in the service also concurs with this observation.
JC H2 maths graduate tutor
I agree with you that a tutor who aced the subject would inspire confidence at the start, but this confidence may not last.
Ultimately, the tutor's job is make the student feel confident of his or her own abilities. It all comes back to how good the tutor is at teaching.
You are absolutely right on the tutor being able to make a student feel motivated. Many a time kids who approach me have low self esteem as a result of unforgiving criticisms dished out to them in school by either their peers or teachers over a prolonged period, and its really an uphill task to attempt reprogramming them.
The trend we are witnessing is essentially due to NIE taking in large numbers of low quality candidates owing to the general consensus that nobody in the right frame of mind would go there if he/she was given a choice: one only applies to be a teacher if you have nowhere else to go.The outstanding ones would have already flocked to law, medicine and engineering. You stuff crap into a machine, chances are you get crappy products. Plain simple. Of course you might still get some gems, but those are far and few. It doesn't take much to figure out how we arrived at this mess today.
Regardless how the education engine runs, I just do my very best to ensure my students survive their exhausting journeys.
JC H2 maths graduate tutor[/quote]I think your expectations of a school teacher are too high... especially this line, \"one only applies to be a teacher if you have nowhere else to go.\"
You're assuming that people become teachers because they cannot be lawyers, doctors or engineers. Although there's a grain of truth in that, there are many out there who are in teaching because they want to teach.
Different people have different aspirations and strengths. -
Mdm Koh:
I think your expectations of a school teacher are too high... especially this line, \"one only applies to be a teacher if you have nowhere else to go.\"
You're assuming that people become teachers because they cannot be lawyers, doctors or engineers. Although there's a grain of truth in that, there are many out there who are in teaching because they want to teach.
Different people have different aspirations and strengths.
Yes there are people who are very passionate about educating the next generation and I am not denying that, but these make up the minority ranks, no thanks to our society which places a premium on specific occupations while tucking others in a dimmer corner. Not surprisingly, practicality would rule over aspirations for most. In this respect, I highly doubt your claim about many going into teaching because they love to do so holds water. Perhaps we might have a few sincere souls and thats about it. The rest join the teaching force because they are left with no other reasonable alternative. Why do you think MOE went on a recruitment spree during the recent 2009 recession? To scoop up the collateral damages of downsized companies -white collared unemployed who would willingly switch to teaching so as to put food on the table for their families.
Unfortunately the notion about teaching being a second rated vocation for those who can't make it in life isn't an assumption on my part, but rather a reflection of aggregated views from quite a handful of people I been in contact with (school teachers, professionals, students) over the past few years.
You might be right that I have high expectations of a school teacher, and that arises from the fact I personally had great mentors back in junior college and secondary school. Surely there isn't any plausible reason to suggest why school teachers of today shouldn't measure up to previously high teaching standards?
JC H2 maths graduate tutor -
Whitecorp, yes, I agree with you that the education system can be improved. However, someone who chose teaching as a second career can become a good teacher too. It's really about the individual's attitude.
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vanilla mum:
I am sorry to hear you had such unpleasant experiences. Name the culprits and shame them in public- it will also warn others to stay away from these two morons.well..it is not mainly the academic results of the school teacher, but the character and personality as well. I simply dont understand, being an adult, would ransack someone's cupboard and not only this, at times when i have to be overseas, the lessons were conducted at my mum's place, and she did the same thing, when my mum taking the nap, she again ransack her cupboard, she can even just took the pork floss and eat it. Sometimes there were packets of titbits where friends or relatives bought from overseas, she just simply take and eat (even it is brand new packet, without asking for permission).
Another case of a primary school teacher, who is my neighbour, every morning, you can hear her voice shouting for her son to hurry up (at 6.30am). i am staying 2 doors away from hers, and i will be waken up by her voice. and many times i met her at the lift, i smile at her, she look away... and worst of all.. many times when i was back and when the lift reached our floor, i cant come out of the lift, bcos she will be standing right at the middle of the door and not even waiting for ppl to come out first becos she tried to squeeze in (and many times, her husband had to tell her \"let ppl come out first\").
Teachers are to teach, not only in acedemic but also being a role model.. but with teachers like this.... -
Im sure there are many passionate teachers and tutors around. I believe that quite a handful started much passion and interest but with the kind of attitude from several parents and students, its just horrid. It makes teaching third world.
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Well, good day to all. Just to share i believe my proudest moment is when i was “sacked” recently because my student who has never been able to pass CL, did so for his final paper in secondary after some last minute appointment of me by the mother. I was tutoring the younger sister and managed to pull her results from 20+ to B. The mother asked if i can try teaching the son for 2 months just to try out and there it was. Pass on the result slips meant everything to the boy. It might not be good to some parents or children, but I am proud of the boy.
If you never try, you will never know -
I chose to be a teacher not because I had no other alternative. Please do not make this kind of assumption that passion does exist among teachers just because you do not have the passion for teaching.
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Mdm Koh:
Whitecorp, yes, I agree with you that the education system can be improved. However, someone who chose teaching as a second career can become a good teacher too. It's really about the individual's attitude.
True Mdm Koh- thanks a lot for your constructive inputs. I believe you are a great teacher and your students are lucky to have you. Happy belated Teacher's Day!
JC H2 Maths Graduate Tutor -
whitecorp,
Maybe you have met with some black sheep. But let me assure you that these black sheep are in a huge wide field of white sheep. They are the minority rather than the majority.
If you compare the training of teachers to other countries, I would say NIE is not too bad! There are some really fantastic profs there too, who inspire the teacher-trainees.
NIE is definitely not a dumping ground. There are many who choose to teach because they have the passion. They have given up careers or offers to do Medicine, Law and such that you have mentioned, to pursue teaching.
Precisely because teaching is not an easy job, and has lower perceived status than being a doctor or lawyer or engineer, teachers who choose to teach should be commended and lauded.
How do you think these school teachers would feel when they read that they are supposedly being \"dumped\" at NIE because they had no other alternative?
Personally, I have met some black sheep too. But contrary to what you say, that the gems are few and far between, my encounters with such black sheep are the \"few and far between\" instead. Many of my own teachers were the kindest and most motivational people around, and then now, meeting some of my own kids' teachers have been such an eye opener.
There is so much dedication and passion in them. They spend so much time preparing their lessons and they deliver the lessons so well that my kids do not need tutors, yet. :xedfingers:
The only difference between them and my own teachers is that, now they use sms texting, emails, blogs, video clips and photos to communicate and share with us. In the past it was the good old phone call or PTM or handwritten note.
Happy Teachers' Day to all teachers, and tutors! -
tutormum:
This is not only true of tutors... but of teachers and schools too!!If this particular tutor is really capable, she should be able to help my friend's daughter to score \"A\" instead of giving up on her. :slapshead: :slapshead:
My proudest achievement is when my students improve academically. I have helped students turn their \"fail\" to \"pass\", \"pass\" to \"A\" and \"A\" to \"excellence\". I believe this should be the ambition of any tutor and what tutoring is all about - helping the students to do well academically regardless of their abilities. :nunchuk:
My DD's classmate has been receiving grief from her FT coz she claims the classmate does not deserve to be in the best class :sad:
In her case, she could not choose the students but the whole class knows she's not happy that the child can spoil her record.
Secondary schools are the same. Instead of helping the weak pass, they ask them to drop the subject!!
What you mention about value adding is exactly what I'd expect of a school too. Sorry if I went off topic... :siam: -
kabalevsky:
kabalevsky, on what grounds can you provide the assurance that the number of white sheep far outnumbers that of black sheep?whitecorp,
Maybe you have met with some black sheep. But let me assure you that these black sheep are in a huge wide field of white sheep. They are the minority rather than the majority.
If you compare the training of teachers to other countries, I would say NIE is not too bad! There are some really fantastic profs there too, who inspire the teacher-trainees.
NIE is definitely not a dumping ground. There are many who choose to teach because they have the passion. They have given up careers or offers to do Medicine, Law and such that you have mentioned, to pursue teaching.
Precisely because teaching is not an easy job, and has lower perceived status than being a doctor or lawyer or engineer, teachers who choose to teach should be commended and lauded.
How do you think these school teachers would feel when they read that they are supposedly being \"dumped\" at NIE because they had no other alternative?
Personally, I have met some black sheep too. But contrary to what you say, that the gems are few and far between, my encounters with such black sheep are the \"few and far between\" instead. Many of my own teachers were the kindest and most motivational people around, and then now, meeting some of my own kids' teachers have been such an eye opener.
There is so much dedication and passion in them. They spend so much time preparing their lessons and they deliver the lessons so well that my kids do not need tutors, yet. :xedfingers:
The only difference between them and my own teachers is that, now they use sms texting, emails, blogs, video clips and photos to communicate and share with us. In the past it was the good old phone call or PTM or handwritten note.
Happy Teachers' Day to all teachers, and tutors!
As mentioned in your post, your encounters are merely those of a personal nature, they can hardly count towards describing the actual picture in Singapore.
The fact your kids don't require tutors is a blessing, but look at the large percentage of households which seek tuition-wouldn't that be an indication of something going awfully wrong in the public schools?
If the school teachers were so good, tuition centres and private tutors like
myself would be out of business a long time ago. Besides, maybe your kids are still quite young so they could manage by themselves; however, just as you have crossed your fingers, we can never be too sure your situation will remain as cheery as now.
I didn't coin this whole \"NIE is a dumping ground\" opinion, like I stated earlier, this was a common sentiment reflected to me from various groups of people, and yes they include NIE trainees themselves. Wouldn't an insider's pov carry more credibility?
It is never my intention to demean the teaching profession in the civil service sector, though at times it just seriously irks me when parents stubbornly cling onto the old mentality that \"school teachers definitely make good private tutors\" without devoting an ounce of rational consideration towards current trends.
JC H2 Maths Graduate Tutor -
whitecorp:
I am not a research/ survey company, so of course I don't have statistics to quote you. But my evidence is anecdotal. From what I see, from what my relatives/ family/ friends see. And Singapore is small, and we have friends and relatives all over Singapore North South East West, so that covers many many schools.kabalevsky, on what grounds can you provide the assurance that the number of white sheep far outnumbers that of black sheep?
So yup, anecdotally, we see a lot of good teachers rather than those that come into class only thinking about their $$$ and wanting to strangle the kids instead of helping them.
[quote]As mentioned in your post, your encounters are merely those of a personal nature, they can hardly count towards describing the actual picture in Singapore. [/quote]See above. Singapore is very small.
[quote]The fact your kids don't require tutors is a blessing, but look at the large percentage of households which seek tuition-wouldn't that be an indication of something going awfully wrong in the public schools?[/quote]Not necessarily. Many parents I know who send their kids for tuition just want their kids to have an edge, or not to fall behind, or to get into the better classes. Doesn't mean there is something awfully wrong with the public schools.
[quote]If the school teachers were so good, tuition centres and private tutors like
myself would be out of business a long time ago. Besides, maybe your kids are still quite young so they could manage by themselves; however, just as you have crossed your fingers, we can never be too sure your situation will remain as cheery as now.[/quote]Well, that is why I was very humble and said the word \"yet\".They don't need tutors yet. I am hoping they don't need, of course, as long as possible.
[quote]I didn't coin this whole \"NIE is a dumping ground\" opinion, like I stated earlier, this was a common sentiment reflected to me from various groups of people, and yes they include NIE trainees themselves. Wouldn't an insider's pov carry more credibility?[/quote]Is it? I read this entire thread and I think you started it with saying NIE is the dumping ground for all those who cannot get into other courses they want in Uni so they choose teaching...
Insider? I am an insider.
I chose teaching over medicine, over law, over accountancy, over engineering.... My grades were certainly good enough to enter any course. But because I love teaching, I chose to go to NIE. Otherwise, I wouldn't feel your statement was being misleading, right?
There are many in my extended family who are teachers too. And of course, friends. So I should think I am very much qualified to be an insider.
[quote]It is never my intention to demean the teaching profession in the civil service sector, though at times it just seriously irks me when parents stubbornly cling onto the old mentality that \"school teachers definitely make good private tutors\" without devoting an ounce of rational consideration towards current trends. [/quote]I know. I can understand where you are coming from. If you didn't mention NIE being a dumping ground, I wouldn't have needed to comment. I have nothing against you as a tutor. I just wanted to correct the opinion or view you might be sending out to everyone who reads this forum that so many teachers are teachers just cos they have nothing else they can do.
I think that's very sad and negative. So I had to say something. Of course, even in my school, which supposedly takes in the creme de la creme, there are good and not so good teachers too.
However, the percentage of the so-called teachers who chose teaching just cos they have nowhere to go, is still much lower than those who are overqualified. So that's why I felt I had to point it out, that the black sheep are few and far between.
Just for the record, I agree that not all school teachers make great tutors too. Doesn't mean that at all.
Once again, I have nothing against tutors. I was a tutor at several points in my life too. I just enjoy teaching very much, whether it is in school or as a private tutor.
Have a good weekend! -
Just as you have gathered positive feedback from those you know, I did so from mine as well, except that what I heard wasn’t pleasant stuff.
Singapore is small no doubt, but can you say you have reasonably close access to even 1 percent of the population, which is 50,000 people? I reckon not likely. So despite you knowing “many many children and relatives etc” , the number of stories you have heard is not substantially significant to make a solid statement, even if we accept the anecdotal ones. Besides, given that you are a parent to young children, would you be aware of the teaching standards in the polytechnics and junior colleges? Quite a handful of my students (past and present) have reflected to me that their JC lecturers were very atrocious in their explanations; some even made tons of mistakes during each lesson, which ultimately left the class scratching their heads in confusion.
Yes, you are not wrong in saying that some kids are made to attend tuition so as to have an added advantage, but these examples are a minority in our “tuition nation”. I mean, just pause and think: do majority of the students seek tuition because they are scoring 90 plus and want to aim for a 100 in a particular subject, or because they are struggling and need some sense of direction? I guess I don’t need to sound out which is the actual reality do I? You may know many parents who push their children into extra lessons to be academic aces, but its still, what, less than 0.1 % ( I am already being statistically generous as I believe it should be much smaller) of all parents?
I respect you as a teacher, but bear in mind how long ago have you graduated from NIE? My “dumping ground” theorem comes from the mouths of students/juniors who are still schooling there. Trends and expectations do change, your personal insider’s perspective might be out of vogue for quite a while.
Seriously, are you correct or am I? We will never know. You support the stance that rotten apples are still far and few because the teaching profession has consistently been successful in attracting good and passionate talent, but I feel we are actually going downhill. One single person’s negative remarks about NIE might well be made out of spite, but when a sizeable number echo similar sentiments over an extended period, well…
As mentioned previously, back when I was a student, I had exceptional teachers. I am grateful to have been taught by them, or I wouldn’t be what I am today. But I really can’t say that high level of competence still largely remains untainted today going by various observations and increasingly bad press coverages.
I can understand why you are so defensive about such a topic given your background, but do bear in mind its the overall system I am feeling disheartened about, not the individual teacher. I just wished the higher ups would take heed of ground sentiment and acknowledge that some mending really needs to be done, instead of simply brushing everything aside and insist nothing’s wrong.
You have a good weekend too.
JC H2 Maths Graduate Tutor -
I know I am older than you. :evil: :rotflmao: Most probably anyway. But I graduated from NIE in 2001. And I don't think that's too long ago.
And I am a JC teacher. I just happen to be on childcare leave now to take care of my young kids.
I have been around KSP forum for sometime. I don't think I am the sort to comment or post irresponsibly. I have others who can vouch for me in this online community.
So definitely, I will not say something if I am not slightly qualified to.
So yes, I am a JC teacher and no, I didn't graduate too long ago, and so yes, what I say still holds water.
And of course there are atrocious teachers (I have come across such too), but then they are not the majority. Not that many JC students take tuition. Not the majority as least. So if all the JC teachers are atrocious, how come the A level results Singaporeans churn out each yr seems to be more and more outstanding?
I think I would like to end this discussion here. Since the topic is about tutors choosing students. And I commented just to give hope to readers in this forum that there are still many good teachers around. Not to argue with you and have you make all kinds of assumptions about me.:nailbite: :roll:
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You are definitely much older than me, which means you have indeed graduated quite a while ago. 10 years is a long time, and many things have changed since then.
Most of the straight A students hail from the two (or maybe three) top JCs which I believe isn’t necessary to name. You get so many of them because they were already brilliant to begin with and it was peer pressure which kept them on their toes to compete and do well; in fact, some parents (and teachers) have told me the lecturers in a certain R brand school are really lousy. And this father in particular runs a chain of tuition centres fyi.
Secondly, if you hadn’t noticed, besides chemistry, you have tons of stuff taken out compared to the old syllabus. For example, think C/F maths and the current H1/H2 maths format. It doesn’t take much for one to figure out scoring an A these days is much easier compared to the past, and that the academic market value of distinctions is drastically cheapened in the current day. Which is why doctors in the 90s needed merely 4As to get into med school, while now even a 7/8 As record might not grant you a local med school application interview.
If you are a JC teacher, then you should be aware of how bad things really are, unless you had wool pulled over your eyes all this while. I would be curious to know which JC and what subject you specialise in.
Like I mentioned earlier, this is not a personal attack, and both of us have made assumptions about each other’s opinions, but I can’t help it if you feel you are being targeted.
There are still good school teachers around, just not many left. Period.
END OF DISCUSSION*****
JC H2 Maths Graduate Tutor -
I came across this tuition co-ordinator's blog. http://lifeofatuitioncoordinator.blogspot.com/
The last entry was in 2007. If she's here on this forum, I hope she can continue posting on her blog. :please:
It's an interesting read and I can certainly empathise with some of her concerns. I've recently taught yet another student who \"disappeared\" after the last session without paying his fees. I wouldn't mind if he had forgotten, but it's not the case here because he did not reply my sms or answer my call after he took his final exams. Neither did his parent.
Luckily, such cases are in the minority. Most parents are responsible and rightly so, because for growing children and teens, parents are the most important role models in their lives.