Asia spending billions on tutors: study

[BeContented]

Limlim,

since you believe in data analysis…help me in this.

In an exam…those who scored include some with tuition, some without. Some with tuition scored worse than those without. Some parents complaint badly amongst themselves that the T couldn’t teach properly. Some of their kids did so so even with tuition.
After T resigned, some quit other tuition to join the external tuition class conducted by this ex-T.

Can we derive logical analysis from datapoints like this? Do enlighten me cos’ I cannot figure out.

PS : This is real data hor.

[iRabbit]

autumnbronze:

Ooooooi bro FQW, KSP is a 'her' addoi


What an apt title for Chen!! Mother of Peace indeed :hi5:

Soli soli. In movies most of the baddies are guys one mah.

[Busymom]

limlim:

Busymom:

Chen, on your suggestions on how to help teachers, just want to tell you that when I commented that it is fine for materials from one school to be shared with another school, there are some who think that it is wrong. Materials developed by a school should remain within that school, otherwise it is a conflict of interest.


So you see, even if you think certain suggestions are fine and should work, there are always others who think otherwise. MOE's role is therefore not an easy one as in it can't please everyone.

I believe that is what some of us are trying to say.

Btw, I also owe you a PM. :imsorry: will get to it.

No.. I guess you misunderstood my comment..

Free sharing is good.. no doubts about that.. If they put it up on the internet for free, it would be so noble. Or they could share it via free tuition lessons for needy families, it would be noble too.

It is the use of the materials for personal gain and profit that is not desirable.

I didn't say materials within a school shd remain within that school.

I say materials developed via public funding should not be use as instrument or tools for personal gain.

For public benefit, it is good and most welcomed.

Limlim,

I wasn't referring to you. I didn't misunderstand what you wrote. I did subsequently clarify this point in my reply to another forummer.

[iRabbit]

BeContented:

Limlim,

since you believe in data analysis.....help me in this.

In an exam.....those who scored include some with tuition, some without. Some with tuition scored worse than those without. Some parents complaint badly amongst themselves that the T couldn't teach properly. Some of their kids did so so even with tuition.
After T resigned, some quit other tuition to join the external tuition class conducted by this ex-T.

Can we derive logical analysis from datapoints like this? Do enlighten me cos' I cannot figure out.

PS : This is real data hor.

Whoa I read this use case and I've to suppress my natural urge to change my nick to BeConfused liao.

And we're talking about just one scenario rite? Now if we want MOE to track up to Sec sch level, geez, we're talking about tracking potentially hundreds of thousand of students/teachers/tutors - parents too cos we play a big[ger] part in the equation.

Think need to mobilise the army to conduct an exercise of this scale. And at the end, hopefully we'll derive something remotely useful from the data collected.

Or like you suggested, if we want to expend national resources of this scale, we can utilise them to reduce the teacher-pupil ratio which will surely yield much higher, more obvious benefit.

[cherryc]

Why are we so worried about MOE capability when they have the best people? They definitely can get some macro figures and analysis for sure. Whoever can come out with the solutions will have my vote.

[verykiasu2010]

cherryc:

VKS 2010 : MOE bashers and teacher bashers are unwilling to quote which school, don't even talk about which teacher. constant repeating the same accusations but unwilling to even name the school, has zero credibility. if one is so unhappy then why afraid to name the school ?


people quoting examples of teachers who care inevitably quote the school name as well.


Can you share with us your good experiences ?? AS a counsillor, I wonder what is your motives to keep asking people to quote the names etc all the time, is it allowed in this forum , is it ethical ? This thread is on tuition phenomenon, not on specific teachers/schools. Can you kindly write to the Straits Times forum to justify your stand in reply to today's forum letter by Ms Wily Wan, probably you can ask the writer to give you examples and quote the school/teachers names too ? Thank you very much.

I have both good and bad experiences and they are all shared in this forum as well, over various threads on various schools over an extended period of time, if you bother to read at all lah.

I have never denied any one with \"pain\" experience but I don't appreciate blanket sweeping statement bashing of MOE and teachers; neither am I a defender of MOE. For the record, I was a teacher too and my DD attended the same school that I taught. My DD was bullied in the same school but the principal could not do / won't do anything. I did what I need to do. And BTW, I was highly recommended in a report filed with MOE when I was a teacher there.

Whether councillor or not, the demand to quote names is for the claimants to back up the claims instead of just repeating hearsay of hearsay, which honestly speaking, has zero credibility unless one is willing to back it up. Keyboard warrior can say anything behind anonymity, parroting others' comments adding salt and vinegar, creating a false front of alarming issues

BUT if they really want to track you down even if you don't name names, they could. That is how they tracked down those who make racial / seditious comments and they are caught by their IP number. If one day MOE decides enough nonsense is enough, they could just do it. As for me and my comments, they are on valid school names which can be validated

Now, I am getting on a long flight, 30 hours at least, with two transits and two changes of aircraft. Won't be able to log on for the next few days.

Hope to grab some pop corns and a Singapore sling when I next log on to read the ensuing \"mud slinging\".

[BeContented]

cherryc:

Why are we so worried about MOE capability when they have the best people? They definitely can get some macro figures and analysis for sure. Whoever can come out with the solutions will have my vote.

What vote? GE2016?

[verykiasu2010]

limlim:

verykiasu2010:

all these hearing from friends, always hearing from friends ...... ....... shadow boxing ?

Why are you so worked up over a single posting by a newbie with maybe questionable remarks?

I don't even get what she is trying to say actually.. Is she saying tuition is a problem or we should embrace tuition as a way of the education system and accept as it is?

no worry! not worked up at all

just waiting for a good laugh, and I think you just quoted out of context

in any case never mind

[autumnbronze]

FQW:

autumnbronze:

Ooooooi bro FQW, KSP is a 'her' addoi


What an apt title for Chen!! Mother of Peace indeed :hi5:

Soli soli. In movies most of the baddies are guys one mah.

:rotflmao: :rotflmao:

[BeContented]

Chenonceau:

My 2 Cents on Contentment
As the people like Becontented (apologies... not directed at you... just can't resist a play on your nick) who MAY possibly want everyone to be contented, then seriously, I would be contented too if my daughter were a prefect and my son were in the best class. Indeed, Chenonceau is most contented with the MRT system and bus system because she doesn't take public transport AT ALL. Certainly, I could wish for better. Chenonceau is the name of a castle that I wish I owned and lived in. Nonetheless, I still am most contented with my housing because my public housing was great. Gee... I really don't understand why people complain so much about housing and transport.

In my opinion, whilst I may be contented with my housing/transport life... and I expect many would rejoice with me for my good fortune... I think it is somewhat not quite logical for me to expect others like Janet, who don't live my blessed life, to be quite as contented as me.

My experience in education has made me more tolerant of complaints by other Singaporeans who do have to brave the crowds in the MRT every day. I don't really know their pain, but I do now feel enough for them to refrain from judging or scorning them.

Limlim's issue is in coming across as tarring all with the same brush. He probably does it because he lacks subtlety (like most men :siam: ). I think he means well.

Hi Chen,
You sure you are not directing at me :evil: :evil:

Contented = virtue OR lazy, less ambitious, bo-chap. Different view.

Am not asking people to be contented and dun care, but to relook and adjust some of their expectations. But probably most would consider it as a 'downgrade' which is highly unacceptable.

Housing/transport - I am contented cos'
- I have a big enough HDB house with a room for my children (vs I cannot afford condo/private property)
- I have an old car that serves as a transportation means. Keep us dry when it rains, dun have to squeeze into MRT/bus during peak hours, can ferry my kids and elders around etc. I am thankful I dun have to go under the hot sun most of the time. BUT just because I dun take the public transport as often, it does not mean I do not believe that people's agony exist. It's painful tho to listen to people complaining about being unable to buy new/luxury car, ranting over 5-10 mins of waiting time for bus/MRT.
- I am happy that Govt issued out rebates to help citizens, more for lower income/smaller house. Not happy when people from high income/bigger units complain about the peanut$ and getting less than others.

Education
True, I am blessed that my kids are doing well....but does that mean that I have a perfectly blessed journey with zero pain...as implied by some? Not the same type of pain? Ohhhh, my pain not as painful as yours.....

Sometimes it's really the approach to life that we take. You might be a perfectionist and cannot accept a 2nd best.....I CAN. If one try their best, clear, pass, over. Move on.

DD is not a prefect and it does not matter. Top class - got the ability to squeeze in and stay there, good. If not, go 2nd class or 3rd.....I will accept, as long as the child tried their best. Com'on, there's lotsa smarter people around 天外有天， 一山还有一山高。 Are my kids affected emotionally that they are not as smart to some others? Nope. Both happy-go-lucky, kinda like me.

I may not experience/understand the full extent of the pain of those who fail. But yes, these kids need help. But those who are pushing beyond and not achieving the results they want, perhaps the expectation was simply unrealistic for the child? No matter what type of changes are made, will still be unhappy.
I know of 1 parent, she has always compared her gal with my DD....their gap widen over the years and she increased her gal's tuition to 7 per week (4 subjects). Her comparing and complaints are still on-going and these are the types of pain I will ignore. But then again, all of us will feel that our pain are geniune and should not be ignored/dismissed.

As mentioned before, if the particular sch sets exam that are too difficult, stay or get out -- it's a choice. Judging how parents still insist on entering those schools, pls then bear with the 'pain' please. No wonder these schools dun bother, cos' it is still in HIGH demand & parents are still flocking there. Let's admit this.......difficult exams = higher standard = will still do better vs. school setting easy paper.