Government, what you really want us to do?
-
concern2:
I agree that one person cannot represent a whole population but I do think that many (not all) Singaporean women are molly-coddled. I do also think that the working culture here does make it harder than elsewhere as there are fewer opportunities to work part-time, shortened hours etc which is how many women in the US & Europe are able to handle working and their children without any help.
Wrong judgement made. One person cannot rep. the whole population. Not ALL SINGAPOREANS cannot manage with more than 2 kids without maids. And there are also AMs who cannot manage as well. To be more objective, perhaps have a better understanding of the background of the individuals.nightlone:
I agree with not hiring maids.
I lived in the States for a couple of years and observed the ang mohs. they have 3, 4 kids. Maybe 1 kid goes to a preschool. The other 2 goes to middle school. The other is, maybe, an infant. The mum brings the kids to school with no external help at all. She puts the car seat in the stroller and drops her preschooler off. Then drives off to drop the other 2. Or vice versa.
I suppose it is much easier with a car and big roads. I just do admire how they are able to do it.
The Singaporeans who have a young child and then give birth there (which makes 2) grumble and whine about how difficult it is to take care of 2 kids. But the ang mohs can do it in the same environment, so why can't the Singaporean?
I concluded that we are all molly-coddled in singapore so cannot adapt to make things work.
Sometimes I think that we set our expectations too high as well - if you are working you may not be able to put a home-cooked meal on the table every evening, the floor may not be mopped every day, there may always be a big pile of ironing to be done, children may have to do their homework on their own but it is possible. -
Ya, its true. I can do it but some cannot do it. It applies to everything in fact.
Car over in states is much cheaper & some mothers do not know how to drive here. Thus they need external help. -
well, the thing is every singaporean there will complain about how they cannot handle. they need the parents or parents in law to come over to take care. then when the grandparents are gone, it’s like the ‘holiday’ is over.
i ascribe to the thinking that "it’s my choice to have kids so i need to be responsible for them and not park them at the grandparents or someone else."
if i think i cannot handle it, then i’m not going to give birth.
what’s the point of having a child but being unable to spend time with them and nurture them? what’s the point of giving birth when you just leave them with the grandparents or someone else all the time? -
mummy so kiasu:
Just bring your kids for an outing (Sentosa, Zoo, Universal Studio etc) over the weekend when your maids take off. You can settle your meals out to save your trouble of cooking & washing. Take it as a family bonding time & you can get all the privacy to be with your family. It is a matter of adjusting & it is not that tough.
can you do that for 52 weekends ? -
nightlone,
When u're sick & your DH oversea for work trips, how ??
By the way, I no maid, mother in law not staying in S'pore. Mother need to take care of my bro's kids. I die die also cannot be sick la. But will think of a way, maybe the young one cannot go school while the elder ones still can go school by themselves.
I don't think anyone wants to put off their parental duties. They just need help here & there. I myself prefers no maid, if not I'll be handling an extra person at home.
Yes, u have to set priorities, what to go first. I put my children first, follow by the rest.
Sorri dear, u can voice up whatever u feel. Not :pokeeye: u. Just stating what I have come across. Do continue to voice your opinions. -
I think it’s the mindset. If few people around you have helpers and they all cope, you take it as the norm. You do whatever you can to manage. You might resort to using other mums to take turns to carpool or babysit.
If even your company receptionist or your junior colleagues, no offense just an example, has a maid, you will feel miserable when your own chores stack up at home.
Here, many perceive housework as low class work. You think this is what maids do, if I am doing it, then I am no better than a maid. Hiring a maid is expensive but is still within the budget of many. In the west, having an au pair or part time, is already a luxury.
How many of our children have chores around the house? Few are trained with housekeeping skills because we sayang them and say they have no time. So when they leave the nest, keeping house can be overwhelming. -
I think it’s the mindset. If few people around you have helpers and they all cope, you take it as the norm. You do whatever you can to manage. You might resort to using other mums to take turns to carpool or babysit.
If even your company receptionist or your junior colleagues, no offense just an example, has a maid, you will feel miserable when your own chores stack up at home.
Here, many perceive housework as low class work. You think this is what maids do, if I am doing it, then I am no better than a maid. Hiring a maid is expensive but is still within the budget of many. In the west, having an au pair or part time, is already a luxury.
How many of our children have chores around the house? Few are trained with housekeeping skills because we sayang them and say they have no time. So when they leave the nest, keeping house can be overwhelming. -
nightlone:
Not fair to SG mummies. Did you also factor in the fact that they can choose to be SAHM, while most SG couples have to be dual income cos they are struggling to pay their HDB flats (esp those bought in the last 3 years)?I agree with not hiring maids.
I lived in the States for a couple of years and observed the ang mohs. they have 3, 4 kids. Maybe 1 kid goes to a preschool. The other 2 goes to middle school. The other is, maybe, an infant. The mum brings the kids to school with no external help at all. She puts the car seat in the stroller and drops her preschooler off. Then drives off to drop the other 2. Or vice versa.
I suppose it is much easier with a car and big roads. I just do admire how they are able to do it.
The Singaporeans who have a young child and then give birth there (which makes 2) grumble and whine about how difficult it is to take care of 2 kids. But the ang mohs can do it in the same environment, so why can't the Singaporean?
I concluded that we are all molly-coddled in singapore so cannot adapt to make things work.
Also, the ang mo education system is so much more relaxed, they don't really care if the kid can read before P1, and they don't have spelling tests etc in pre-schools. They have almost no homework in Primary schools, so the mummy only needs to worry about their well being. Even then, it is perfectly normal for them to just feed their kids a peanut butter sandwich for lunch, would SG mums do that?
I also have no maid, used to be a PTWM, now FTWM, still no maid. I try to cook dinner 3 weekdays. And hubby travels frequently or have night telecons a few times a week. If not he'll be at home working till wee hours of the night almost everyday. No grandparents help also. I could only go back to FTWM cos my girl is bigger now and more independent. She does help out in the housework.I can tell you, it's very very tough. I only have 1 kid. I cannot imagine having a 2nd one. -
Mychildren:
:goodpost:nightlone,
When u're sick & your DH oversea for work trips, how ??
By the way, I no maid, mother in law not staying in S'pore. Mother need to take care of my bro's kids. I die die also cannot be sick la. But will think of a way, maybe the young one cannot go school while the elder ones still can go school by themselves.
I don't think anyone wants to put off their parental duties. They just need help here & there. I myself prefers no maid, if not I'll be handling an extra person at home.
Yes, u have to set priorities, what to go first. I put my children first, follow by the rest.
Sorri dear, u can voice up whatever u feel. Not :pokeeye: u. Just stating what I have come across. Do continue to voice your opinions. -
3Boys:
And pray tell the evidence that the falling birth rate has ANYTHING to do whatsoever with those policies you are critiquing? Who's to say it's not just navel-gazing, lazy, short-sighted Singaporeans displacing blame?
Just telling people to 'suck it up', instead of examining and dealing with the side-effects of your own policies constitutes passing the buck.pirate:
[quote=\"3Boys\"]Something quite technical but worth a read --> http://www.economist.com/node/21561112
I don't actually think anything the g'ment suggests that requires even a modicum of effort on the part of the people would work. What constitutes passing the buck? Working hard and making some sacrifices too difficult for the modern family? The g'ment need to coddle at every step?
And, yah, that's just your opinion. :evil:
'Suck it up'? I'd say take it or leave it.[/quote]You mean apart from all these people telling them it is? Look at the US total fertility rate. How come it is higher than Singapore's? How come it is going up? You think it is because they have a lower standard of living or is it because it is a less developed economy? Of course, if one does not want to see the evidence, one will never find it. Have they even bothered to do a census to see how many families with 3 or more children have both parents working? I may be wrong, but most of the families I know with 3 or more kids have a SAHM, at least when the children are young.
What modicum of evidence do you or the government have that it is all because Singaporeans are lazy and short-sighted as you assert?
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