Hanging out with intelligent friends makes children smarter

[Joule]

sinoboy:

Coolkidsrock2:

[quote=\"sinoboy\"]
[color=#0000FF]Why change my view when my bosses and other company bosses thinks that people and degrees from overseas more intelligent than local ones?

You sound very disgruntled and am not sure the basis of this impression. In the last 12 years or so, there was never a discussion on my academic/professional qualifications in my job interviews. What was being assessed is my \"cultural fit\" with the company and the people whom I will be working with. I know for a fact that in my job search, there were candidates better qualified or cheaper than me, but I landed the job because I \"fitted\" the cultural better.

In fact, the same was reiterated by headhunters. Every candidate has nearly the same technical knowledge, it is the cultural fit that determines which of the candidate who will get the job.

Well I'll make an intelligent guess and say that you are not working in a local company. Foreign firms may have off limit topics during job interviews or even application forms which may be construed as discriminatory. Yes perhaps I hung around smart kids when I was young and ended up with a competitive nature. I'm no yes man so it's easy to brand me a cultural misfit. Too on the ball and people will complain I'm too aggressive, too passive people and I'm slack and better buck up if not people are lining up outside to replace me. I've learnt to be smarter from my overseas trained colleagues and talk more in an intelligent way so that work less. Agree somewhat that fitting into a corporate culture helps my survival and promotion. [/quote]

hi brother

hope you're not so intense and angsty at work, man

and yes, I agree that really, especially in govt and stat boards, the overseas scholars get promoted first.

It's quite annoying, really

part of climbing corporate ladder is also waiting in the background for your enemies to burn out because they burnt their candle at both ends

[Coolkidsrock2]

I had worked in local firms previously but not currently. Not sure your definition of agressive but I had experienced tables being banged on and screaming matches at work. But it is all about work, nothing personal.


There are also local grads with high EQ as well as capacity for work and they are recognised for it.

[ChiefKiasu]

Joule:

...

and yes, I agree that really, especially in govt and stat boards, the overseas scholars get promoted first.
...

Perhaps we need to temper our observations with the fact that overseas scholars probably have more to prove to themselves and therefore work harder, which naturally means that they would seem to be more competent for that promotion. Unless, of course, we feel that they don't deserve the promotion because they are less capable than others?

[Coolkidsrock2]

But it is a fact of life that we will always feel that there are people who do not deserve to be promoted are promoted and it happens year in, year out.

[sinoboy]

ChiefKiasu:

Joule:

...

and yes, I agree that really, especially in govt and stat boards, the overseas scholars get promoted first.
...

Perhaps we need to temper our observations with the fact that overseas scholars probably have more to prove to themselves and therefore work harder, which naturally means that they would seem to be more competent for that promotion. Unless, of course, we feel that they don't deserve the promotion because they are less capable than others?

To me there is a difference between promotion for overseas scholars and grads and local grads. Overseas scholars and grad promotion is an entitlement and it's assumed they can do no wrong. NATO never mind, just talk more to be more high profile and promotion will be faster. Judge by basic degree or MBA can already no need to look at capability. To the local grads they will say promotion is based on merits and you have to earn it by having right EQ and delivering results as we are a meritocrazy system. It's competition at different level and it happens year in year out. If given a choice I want to study overseas and have priority treatment also, right? :lightrod:

[pirate]

Coolkidsrock2:

But it is a fact of life that we will always feel that there are people who do not deserve to be promoted are promoted and it happens year in, year out.

:goodpost:
It is also a fact of life that sometimes we feel this way even though the other person is, on an objective basis, more deserving that we are of the promotion.

[Imami]

pirate:

Coolkidsrock2:

But it is a fact of life that we will always feel that there are people who do not deserve to be promoted are promoted and it happens year in, year out.

:goodpost:
It is also a fact of life that sometimes we feel this way even though the other person is, on an objective basis, more deserving that we are of the promotion.

Pirate, this one (ie your post ) is the :goodpost:

[sinoboy]

pirate:

Coolkidsrock2:

But it is a fact of life that we will always feel that there are people who do not deserve to be promoted are promoted and it happens year in, year out.

:goodpost:
It is also a fact of life that sometimes we feel this way even though the other person is, on an objective basis, more deserving that we are of the promotion.

Unless you are at senior management level, there is no point feeling deserving or not. And what is objective? By objective measures overseas degrees are regarded as more qualified and by subjective measures someone said EQ or culture fit supposed to be more important than academic or professional qualifications. Who knows maybe your boss does not want to promote you because either you are too good and will one day in the near future climb above him or her, or simply just want to keep you working under him or her if you are a good yes man who doesn't complain. Boss just have to tell you that you are good but you lost on qualification because promotions are based on merits, nevermind fight for you again next year ok? Meanwhile continue to work hard.

[ChiefKiasu]

sinoboy:

To me there is a difference between promotion for overseas scholars and grads and local grads. Overseas scholars and grad promotion is an entitlement and it's assumed they can do no wrong. NATO never mind, just talk more to be more high profile and promotion will be faster. Judge by basic degree or MBA can already no need to look at capability. To the local grads they will say promotion is based on merits and you have to earn it by having right EQ and delivering results as we are a meritocrazy system. It's competition at different level and it happens year in year out. If given a choice I want to study overseas and have priority treatment also, right? :lightrod:

In the government admin service, exemplified by military service, promotion is based on computed estimated potential (CEP). If an employee has been identified as a person of great potential, he will be placed on an accelerated career path, regardless of whether he is a local or overseas grad. This CEP is evaluated throughout his career based on his performance at each step of the ladder he is climbing. The better his performance, the faster he gets promoted. If he stumbles at a particular rung, his ability to climb would be seriously hampered.

Your claim that overseas scholars get greater opportunity may be true in the sense that they are seen to have a greater potential, ie. CEP. After all, they did beat everyone else when they won those scholarships, did they not? So their opportunity to open doors is greater. But if they do not perform, those doors will remain closed to them.

In this respect, the system is truly meritocratic. You may argue that CEP is unfair to begin with, since there could be \"late bloomers\". But you can't deny that it is a better system than pure cronyism, where promotion is based entirely on networking and relationships.

[wonderm]

sinoboy:

ChiefKiasu:

[quote=\"Joule\"]...

and yes, I agree that really, especially in govt and stat boards, the overseas scholars get promoted first.
...

Perhaps we need to temper our observations with the fact that overseas scholars probably have more to prove to themselves and therefore work harder, which naturally means that they would seem to be more competent for that promotion. Unless, of course, we feel that they don't deserve the promotion because they are less capable than others?

To me there is a difference between promotion for overseas scholars and grads and local grads. Overseas scholars and grad promotion is an entitlement and it's assumed they can do no wrong. NATO never mind, just talk more to be more high profile and promotion will be faster. Judge by basic degree or MBA can already no need to look at capability. To the local grads they will say promotion is based on merits and you have to earn it by having right EQ and delivering results as we are a meritocrazy system. It's competition at different level and it happens year in year out. If given a choice I want to study overseas and have priority treatment also, right? :lightrod:[/quote]Sinoboy, given your strong view about overseas education, are you planning to sponsor your DC for an overseas education? since you are a parent now.