Why students study more during school holidays
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I think students are given further chances after PSLE to do better. Now with full subject base banding, students are only place into lower stream for the subject(s) didn’t perform well during PSLE. Other subjects are streamed into G3 level. And if students improve subsequently they can rejoin G3 band.
If the stress is due to not able to get into IP schools, I think we can see it in different light. Just like only the top income bracket can afford to purchase landed property. The majority of us (90%?) stay in public housing. Life still goes on for the 90% of us and it is commonly acceptable by us adult. Why not view our children not able to get into IP schools in the same light as most adult can’t afford landed property?
I think the issue lie in students at PSLE age are immature in handling being compared to those that have done relatively well. We adults can help them by not adding the pressure onto them -
bbbay\" post_id=\"2135342\" time=\"1718933540\" user_id=\"175278:
FSBB does not allow an O level student the social mobility to upgrade to IP track. This is the frustration and causes the high stakes mentality of PSLE.
I think students are given further chances after PSLE to do better. Now with full subject base banding, students are only place into lower stream for the subject(s) didn’t perform well during PSLE. Other subjects are streamed into G3 level. And if students improve subsequently they can rejoin G3 band.
If the stress is due to not able to get into IP schools, I think we can see it in different light. Just like only the top income bracket can afford to purchase landed property. The majority of us (90%?) stay in public housing. Life still goes on for the 90% of us and it is commonly acceptable by us adult. Why not view our children not able to get into IP schools in the same light as most adult can’t afford landed property?
I think the issue lie in students at PSLE age are immature in handling being compared to those that have done relatively well. We adults can help them by not adding the pressure onto them
If u want to use landed property as a parallel, what if i were to tell u that if by age 40 u arent rich enough to buy landed, u forever cannot buy landed, even if u strike toto or finally promoted to CEO at age 50, how fair would that sound? -
ChiefKiasu\" post_id=\"2135339\" time=\"1718932933\" user_id=\"3:
Repeating A levels is demoralizing for an 18 year old (who is nearly an adult).
I feel repeating levels is extremely demoralizing for kids, despite its obvious forgiving nature. Even if you get good results at the repeat, I think employers would nitpick the fact.
Perhaps the problem lies in the fact that students are being streamed too early into various categories. I think more should be done to expose kids to more possible routes earlier in Secondary school so that they can become more sure of what they want their career to be.
And being streamed at PSLE into a non choice school, or failing to get into IP, is not demoralizing for a 12 year old?
Which is more damaging?
As far as I can tell, the tuition fever is not as severe or intense in the A level / IB stage (it is still present, just not as pervasive) than at the PSLE stage. There are a number of subjects that have no tuition services at those levels either, unlike the PSLE. Noone has a choice of subjects at the PSLE - it is the bluntest form of streaming. At the A levels/IB stage, there is some leeway to pick subjects according to your interests and inclinations. -
bbbay\" post_id=\"2135342\" time=\"1718933540\" user_id=\"175278:
Fully agree with your last point.
I think students are given further chances after PSLE to do better. Now with full subject base banding, students are only place into lower stream for the subject(s) didn’t perform well during PSLE. Other subjects are streamed into G3 level. And if students improve subsequently they can rejoin G3 band.
If the stress is due to not able to get into IP schools, I think we can see it in different light. Just like only the top income bracket can afford to purchase landed property. The majority of us (90%?) stay in public housing. Life still goes on for the 90% of us and it is commonly acceptable by us adult. Why not view our children not able to get into IP schools in the same light as most adult can’t afford landed property?
I think the issue lie in students at PSLE age are immature in handling being compared to those that have done relatively well. We adults can help them by not adding the pressure onto them
The reason why I could refrain from pressuring the kids too far, aside from religious perspectives, is because since our kids were born, we had made preparations that we may have to seek alternative paths for the kids as they may not thrive in the system. This is because my son had global developmental delay and we were told to prepare that he could not join in mainstream P1. If I didn't have the mentality and if I had not deliberately put aside resources, I am very sure I would also be swept into the narrative of the FOMO and asking kids to aspire towards this and that. I was also greatly humbled and cognizant of how tough things could be for a child who is academically slower at the start. Till today, I still have to remind myself to be careful what I say or how I convey things to my kids, especially the one taking national exams, in case I inevitably pass my anxiety and kiasu-ness on to them, or misconvey what I value about them and their journey.
On landed property, I shudder to think if kids would also continually nag at us adults to do our best in our careers, to fulfil our potentials, to try our best to get that landed property. I would have died of stress if this is how my kids view me. -
I think the IP idea is great! Frees up curriculum time to provide broader education within the limited timeframe. Resources are always finite so eligibility via meritocracy is by far the most unbiased method of allocating the resources. If a child does not qualify at P6, there is always transfers at sec Sch or O level, a second chance. Otherwise not getting into IP is also not a big deal because all roads lead to Rome. We may or will end up with a degree somehow otherwise there’s always continuous learning or upgrading opportunities after working
NB: I have never thought being eligible for IP is a big deal or vice versa and I am sure many parents feel the same so not sure what’s the grind here? -
I do not think PSLE will be removed from our educational system anytime soon because it just went through a reform (from tscore to AL banding) just couple of years back.
One suggestion I can make is to make the AL bands wider. For example, just need 85 marks (from current 90) to score AL1. Exams should just be used to test a 12yo proficiency in the subject and not rank them.
In the old tscore system, 91% is almost as good as getting an A-star. There is not much of a difference between scoring 90% and 91%. If a parent is hoping for 90, it is as good as asking the kid try to score 4 A-stars. Of cos child would need to go for tuition lah. As to why MOE sets AL1 at 90 it could be that they still want to keep RI and HCI as the top top schools. Or else, as long as a kid can hit a proficiency of 85 marks, just let them have a chance to be balloted into these top top schools too.
A difference of 5 marks could drop to next AL banding, is likely to give PSLE parents heart attack because 5 marks it’s like one cannot afford to get additional 2 MCQ wrong for every subject!! -
zac's mum\" post_id=\"2135343\" time=\"1718934169\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2135343 time=1718934169 user_id=53606]
Good morning Zac's mum,
FSBB does not allow an O level student the social mobility to upgrade to IP track. This is the frustration and causes the high stakes mentality of PSLE.
If u want to use landed property as a parallel, what if i were to tell u that if by age 40 u arent rich enough to buy landed, u forever cannot buy landed, even if u strike toto or finally promoted to CEO at age 50, how fair would that sound?[/quote]
, it seems you are 有点在钻牛角尖 . Not allow to upgrade to IP track does not mean kids cannot go or not allow to go for university in future. There are so many students in NUS, NTU and SMU are not from IP track.
Whether people will consider kids in O / N level are second-rate and those in IP track are first grade - Yes, some people may think in this way - but I believe not most people - at least, for me - I believe Zac and the 2 dds from Mrs. Kiasu are the best after staying in this forum for 2 years.
Sometimes, we cannot too care how other people think - if you 活在別人的想法中, then it will be a hard life for you and Zac.
I have a classmate - who is a very famous professor in university now - did not have a very good results in his A level. He had 3 attempts to sit for A Level exam before he went to university for degree. Most people will appreciate his 毅力 and not one will have any adverse feeling on him. -
zac's mum\" post_id=\"2135343\" time=\"1718934169\" user_id=\"53606:[quote=\"zac's mum\" post_id=2135343 time=1718934169 user_id=53606]
If a person strike Toto or become a CEO later in life, I think he may do even better - will go beyond landed property or not. While others’ option may be limited, to continue to work to pay for the landed property mortgage, the Toto winner may even decide landed property is not for him/her anymore, choose to live in a yacht that can berth anywhere him/her fancy, or a bigger farm with change of seasons instead. The CEO may even wonder why did he work so hard to aim for a landed property when he can now travel around the world during work, taste the culture of different cities, for the joys these excitements bring.
FSBB does not allow an O level student the social mobility to upgrade to IP track. This is the frustration and causes the high stakes mentality of PSLE.
If u want to use landed property as a parallel, what if i were to tell u that if by age 40 u arent rich enough to buy landed, u forever cannot buy landed, even if u strike toto or finally promoted to CEO at age 50, how fair would that sound?[/quote]
What I think is, IP schools is one of the many means, to the end. We may be even glad we did not decide over committed to a landed property early, have to work hard to service it, and miss the opportunity to have less baggages, for a lighter heart to travel around the world -
bbbay\" post_id=\"2135357\" time=\"1718946989\" user_id=\"175278:
塞翁失马,焉知非福. :roll:
If a person strike Toto or become a CEO later in life, I think he may do even better - will go beyond landed property or not. While others’ option may be limited, to continue to work to pay for the landed property mortgage, the Toto winner may even decide landed property is not for him/her anymore, choose to live in a yacht that can berth anywhere him/her fancy, or a bigger farm with change of seasons instead. The CEO may even wonder why did he work so hard to aim for a landed property when he can now travel around the world during work, taste the culture of different cities, for the joys these excitements bring.
What I think is, IP schools is one of the many means, to the end. We may be even glad we did not decide over committed to a landed property early, have to work hard to service it, and miss the opportunity to have less baggages, for a lighter heart to travel around the world -
lee_yl\" post_id=\"2135350\" time=\"1718938419\" user_id=\"17023:
The costs of each PSLE Multiple choice wrong answer is ... 2 marks.
I do not think PSLE will be removed from our educational system anytime soon because it just went through a reform (from tscore to AL banding) just couple of years back.
One suggestion I can make is to make the AL bands wider. For example, just need 85 marks (from current 90) to score AL1. Exams should just be used to test a 12yo proficiency in the subject and not rank them.
In the old tscore system, 91% is almost as good as getting an A-star. There is not much of a difference between scoring 90% and 91%. If a parent is hoping for 90, it is as good as asking the kid try to score 4 A-stars. Of cos child would need to go for tuition lah. As to why MOE sets AL1 at 90 it could be that they still want to keep RI and HCI as the top top schools. Or else, as long as a kid can hit a proficiency of 85 marks, just let them have a chance to be balloted into these top top schools too.
A difference of 5 marks could drop to next AL banding, is likely to give PSLE parents heart attack because 5 marks it’s like one cannot afford to get additional 2 MCQ wrong for every subject!!
If a student get more than 5 MCQs wrong in PSLE Science, bye bye, there goes his (her) AL 1.
(90 marks & above) -
so many different roads (route), different path to walk upon, lead to the same Rome, eventually.
Will you die, if you don’t end up in IP ?
Whether u come from IP or from O level track, at the end of aged 18, what is the name of that common A level National exam to sit for ?
Answer -
GCE “A” level
So,
will you die, if u don’t end up in Sec 1 (IP) programme?
Of course not !
so, why or what’s this sudden fuss over this “IP” thing?
If you,
as a parent (whether u are a father or a mother) ,
start to have this warped (wrong) thinking that your own kid not able to end up in Sec 1 (IP) programme, is a source of embarassment to yourself
Or
you begin to feel inferior for your child for not being able to join the “IP” league
and
somehow during the course of conversation(s) with your own child, you seem to focus on this “LACK”,
then,
sad to say, I feel very Sorry, for your kid.
Why ?
Because
you as a parent, are passing on or rubbing on your sense of inferiority complex of not being able to join IP onto your poor child. And your poor child can sense it immediately, because you are the one in the family, closest to him (her).
So,
get rid of this NEGATIVE thinking, Negative emotion inside you (parents). Every child Is uniquely created by God. Everyone has own unique talent, whether they come from O level track, or otherwise. -
phtthp\" post_id=\"2135359\" time=\"1718958928\" user_id=\"35251:
Very interesting. Yes, just 5 MCQ wrong can say bye bye to AL1
The costs of each PSLE Multiple choice wrong answer is ... 2 marks.
If a student get more than 5 MCQs wrong in PSLE Science, bye bye, there goes his (her) AL 1.
(90 marks & above) -
Imp75\" post_id=\"2135348\" time=\"1718936669\" user_id=\"2358:
I stressed over PSLE back then was because I hope my girls can make it to IP (need not be RGS/NYGH) to avoid yet another high stress year at O-level and out of fear that at 16, grabbling with puberty-related issues, girls may be too distracted to do well.
I think the IP idea is great! Frees up curriculum time to provide broader education within the limited timeframe. Resources are always finite so eligibility via meritocracy is by far the most unbiased method of allocating the resources. If a child does not qualify at P6, there is always transfers at sec Sch or O level, a second chance. Otherwise not getting into IP is also not a big deal because all roads lead to Rome. We may or will end up with a degree somehow otherwise there’s always continuous learning or upgrading opportunities after working
NB: I have never thought being eligible for IP is a big deal or vice versa and I am sure many parents feel the same so not sure what’s the grind here?
Maybe you can share with us what was the motivation behind your decision to resign from your high paying job to be with your kids prior their PSLE exams? -
lee_yl\" post_id=\"2135369\" time=\"1718962917\" user_id=\"17023:
I left my job when my girls were P3 and P1. Reason not because I want them to go IP. It’s because I brought so much work stress home that every question they asked me about Sch work will result in me venting my frustrations at them which was very unhealthy to our relationships. My hubs just told me to take it easy quit and be taitai lol.
I stressed over PSLE back then was because I hope my girls can make it to IP (need not be RGS/NYGH) to avoid yet another high stress year at O-level and out of fear that at 16, grabbling with puberty-related issues, girls may be too distracted to do well.
Maybe you can share with us what was the motivation behind your decision to resign from your high paying job to be with your kids prior their PSLE exams? -
Imp75\" post_id=\"2135380\" time=\"1718967900\" user_id=\"2358:
Thanks for your sharing. Actually your hub could have taken on the tutor role mah.
I left my job when my girls were P3 and P1. Reason not because I want them to go IP. It’s because I brought so much work stress home that every question they asked me about Sch work will result in me venting my frustrations at them which was very unhealthy to our relationships. My hubs just told me to take it easy quit and be taitai lol.
You’re experience is not uncommon as a number of working mums I know quit when their kids were in primary sch. One of my friends thought her Pri sch kid was reading or doing homework while she was working until she found out that the grandma had been giving the kid handphone so that the grandma could have some peace. My friend resigned with immediate effect. While my friend’s resignation is not not directly related to IP, she definitely quit out of concern for her kid’s education. -
lee_yl\" post_id=\"2135383\" time=\"1718975671\" user_id=\"17023:
Really? Then I must hv been a chilled mom bc my girls were exactly brought up this way in a nanny’s home with tv and iPad whole day and attended neighbourhood pcf kindy haha.
Thanks for your sharing. Actually your hub could have taken on the tutor role mah.
You’re experience is not uncommon as a number of working mums I know quit when their kids were in primary sch. One of my friends thought her Pri sch kid was reading or doing homework while she was working until she found out that the grandma had been giving the kid handphone so that the grandma could have some peace. My friend resigned with immediate effect. While my friend’s resignation is not not directly related to IP, she definitely quit out of concern for her kid’s education.
Back to me being SAHM during those years. I think my presence also helped. I removed their Chinese tuition (they didn’t hv any other), I taught them myself, assigned regular work (specially curated bc I believed in tackling only weakness and not cramming lots of practices bc I also wanted them to hv time for play/rest) on top of Sch work, assisted my eldest in her sports dsa journey, made connections, volunteered in Sch and made my girls presence felt, anything and everything I could do for my girls, I would.
However before my girls psle journey concluded, I went back to FT work and then they were on their own again. -
Giving up a job to raise kids doesn’t guarantee good outcomes. In fact, with some family support and efficient use of external help available, a parent’s exposure to the outside world in a professional capacity can even help the child go further because one can communicate and engage with the kids at a higher level.
I can see a lot of parents are under a lot of stress, most of it self inflicted. If we always focus on the academics rather than the relationship with our child, we will lose many bonding and teaching moments. We play a lot with our kids when they are young. Through play, we teach them to do their best. This means before the game or even exams, we put in our best resources, prepare our ammunitions, and do our best when the “game” starts.
Putting up a strong fight doesn’t mean one must win. As long as the child (and ourselves) understands that, there is no stress. In fact one might even have fun in the process. The focus should really be on building character and resilience. Once the child masters that, sooner or later the child can maximise their potential in every exam or challenge.
As a parent with kids in IP schools, I do see the benefits of the system. However, I do not agree getting into IP is a sure way (and is surely not the only way) to success and not getting into one won’t mean one is doomed for life too. Take it easy, parents. There are many pathways. If we adults put labels and brands on schools, we are creating the exact toxic environment that we do not want our kids to grow up in.
:siam: -
doodbug\" post_id=\"2135312\" time=\"1718869212\" user_id=\"13281:
This is the point that i was trying to agree with when i spoke up in my earlier comment.
I know that one cannot run away from streaming/sorting forever. There must be some way to determine who gets into university, and which course in university.
In most countries, major national sorting only occurs at the 16 year old or some, even the 18 year old stage.
I know that I am in the minority here, but I still do not support sorting at a national level, at 12 years old, which is what our PSLE does. I don't see it as a necessary step. Worse still, unlike any other major exams which you can retake, you can't retake PSLE. The problem is not with the PSLE, but what PSLE is used for and what it determines - I wonder if MOE is able to see this point. They cannot keep blaming parents for being kiasu. Society, including parents and children, are shaped by the structures and systems. The system rewards those who do well academically handsomely - hence the whole flurry anxiety over performing well academically.
I spoke up because i wanted to see if MOE (or some opposition politicians if they wish. HELLO: elections this year, any leader want to hear our voice) will look into the structural causes of the stress and anxiety of psle.
I spoke up, not for myself (already past the sour grapes that i have eaten, dont worry, and don’t worry also about my child, who is really happy go lucky type) but for the current and future batches of kids i see in those documentaries who are under pressure to get into IP.
IP has wonderful enrichment programs, well touted and all know that. Are the IP schools willing to open up these programs to the Express kids in their community so that they can benefit as well? -
For my 2 fellas, they do not study during holidays. I stop all tuition right after exams and will resume only when school starts. Given that their tutors also seem to go for their own vacation during the school holidays, I think quite a lot of their students’ parents stop tuition during the holidays too. DD had tuition up to O levels while DS did not have any tuition after primary school. The whole holiday was really for all to unwind.
I do see friends and even my own sister insisting that they have to continue with a regiment of tuition and assign work for their kids else the kids will struggle when school starts. Admittedly my 2 fellas will be sluggish with their work when school starts after the holidays and their initial few assessments might take a hit but they do catch up thereafter.
I agree that there is societal pressure and expectations and I did feel it too when kids were going through their PSLE, O levels and all. Ultimately, we parents have to be the ones to filter and shield our kids from all these excessive pressure and allow them to find their own footing. -
For us, we avoid tuitions during school holiday except covid period. To me, I somehow feel that some would prefer the holiday prog and probably skip the weekly regular lessons?