Parents, not enrichment centres, are key to result

[corneyAmber]

Chenonceau:

I oso want you to teach mine leh... just paiseh to ask only!!!!

Yeah... I know the debate has made the issue salient to many parents. That's why I thought I should write a proper integration post. Unfortunately, we have not had much representation from parents who work and who have no time to teach their kids, so the perspective may still be incomplete.

Yes.. I noticed the streaming. Chose not to respond because seriously, my brain works by taking in new perspectives, and I CHANGE my mind as new pesrpectives come in... At present, I have no entrenched position on streaming. What I wrote... I wrote as questions to stimulate thought and push the boundaries. I haven't thought through streaming properly so I dun really have anything sensible to say. I have questions more than objections.

I do have an entrenched position on textbooks, however.

Like I tell Funz, I am still learning as a parent....you are your child's best teacher in every sense.

As for streaming, there is no standardization on how the schools deal with their best classes. It is really quite different from schools to schools though all the intent is common, to stretch their potential. Probably this is where the disparity comes about in terms of how much the children know as additional knowledge. My thought is even if MOE standardises the practices, would schools stop doing more to stretch their children just to stay on the PSLE chart or would parents stop doing more to stretch their children to get onto the PSLE chart? I don't know....

[Chenonceau]

ksi:

Chenonceau:

I oso want you to teach mine leh... just paiseh to ask only!!!!

Yeah... I know the debate has made the issue salient to many parents. That's why I thought I should write a proper integration post. Unfortunately, we have not had much representation from parents who work and who have no time to teach their kids, so the perspective may still be incomplete.

Yes.. I noticed the streaming. Chose not to respond because seriously, my brain works by taking in new perspectives, and I CHANGE my mind as new pesrpectives come in... At present, I have no entrenched position on streaming. What I wrote... I wrote as questions to stimulate thought and push the boundaries. I haven't thought through streaming properly so I dun really have anything sensible to say. I have questions more than objections.

I do have an entrenched position on textbooks, however.

Like I tell Funz, I am still learning as a parent....you are your child's best teacher in every sense.

As for streaming, there is no standardization on how the schools deal with their best classes. It is really quite different from schools to schools though all the intent is common, to stretch their potential. Probably this is where the disparity comes about in terms of how much the children know as additional knowledge. My thought is even if MOE standardises the practices, would schools stop doing more to stretch their children just to stay on the PSLE chart or would parents stop doing more to stretch their children to get onto the PSLE chart? I don't know....

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

I, for one, have no intention to stretch my kid beyond the PSLE. He's doing secondary stuff 'cos it helps with PSLE. I can think of much more fun and exciting developmental journeys that have nothing to do with PSLE. :frustrated: :frustrated:

[corneyAmber]

Chenonceau:

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

Oh if I am still learning, I may deliver the wrong things...

[Chenonceau]

ksi:

Chenonceau:

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

I am not sure... but I rather suspect that even the top class doesn't get as much stretch as it should in class to cope with P5 work. Most in top class have tuition. Also, the PSLE results for DS' school last year dropped quite a bit. Perhaps even in best class the PSLE training is insufficient?

But well... I conjecture only. Perhaps not fair to the school.

However, we already know that Piggy's GEP didn't handle heuristics... and neither did my friend's GEP. Piggy taught her son simultaneous and my friend's son did like mine - Onsponge, and went to MindStretcher regularly. So maybe even the best of the best aren't taught these stretch stuff eh?

[HAPPYH]

Chenonceau:

ksi:

[quote=\"Chenonceau\"]

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

I am not sure... but I rather suspect that even the top class doesn't get as much stretch as it should in class to cope with P5 work. Most in top class have tuition. Also, the PSLE results for DS' school last year dropped quite a bit. Perhaps even in best class the PSLE training is insufficient?

But well... I conjecture only. Perhaps not fair to the school.

However, we already know that Piggy's GEP didn't handle heuristics... and neither did my friend's GEP. Piggy taught her son simultaneous and my friend's son did like mine - Onsponge, and went to MindStretcher regularly. So maybe even the best of the best aren't taught these stretch stuff eh?[/quote]

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

[Chenonceau]

HAPPYH:

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

That is why I said that even good students have to go for enrichment lor... when really if the system tests what it adequately can teach, then good students won't have to go for external help.

BUT people want tough tests mah... so that they know which child is smarter than which. Is it so important to know which child is smarter than which to a very fine-grained detail?

You can't stop some parents from wanting to push their kids ever upwards. But the testing doesn't have to follow this crowd. If one day, enrichment reached the level where 10 year olds are doing university modules, will PSLE follow suit and test at that level? Let the crazy parents who want to develop ALL BRAIN in their kids skip levels... do university stuff... but let normal people like my DS, be normal.

[HAPPYH]

Chenonceau:

HAPPYH:

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

That is why I said that even good students have to go for enrichment lor... when really if the system tests what it adequately can teach, then good students won't have to go.

BUT people want tough tests mah... so that they know which child is smarter than which. Is it so important to know which child is smarter than which to a very fine-grained detail?

I personally feel dont need at all. But being kiasu, we also wont stop chasing each other

[Always21]

I guess all parents want the child to feel at ease learning in school. I just worry if the child cannot understand what the school is teaching and give up on themselves. That is why I sent my child to enrichment class, to prepare him, not aiming him to go top class.

[Funz]

My kiddos are not yet at the PSLE stage yet so all is still kinda rosy right now. Just trying to understand what I might be heading in for so don’t shoot me hor.


But I am just wondering, all these talk about testing beyond what is taught or beyond the abilities of kids this age, is it really so? Of the entire exam paper, are all the questions beyond what is taught in the syllabus? Or just a small percentage of the questions to sniff out those with higher order thinking?

Is it the paper that is forcing the parents to need all these tuition and enrichment or is it the parents who refuse let their children stumble on these questions that led to this ‘tuition culture’?

[HAPPYH]

Funz:

My kiddos are not yet at the PSLE stage yet so all is still kinda rosy right now. Just trying to understand what I might be heading in for so don't shoot me hor.


But I am just wondering, all these talk about testing beyond what is taught or beyond the abilities of kids this age, is it really so? Of the entire exam paper, are all the questions beyond what is taught in the syllabus? Or just a small percentage of the questions to sniff out those with higher order thinking?

Is it the paper that is forcing the parents to need all these tuition and enrichment or is it the parents who refuse let their children stumble on these questions that led to this 'tuition culture'?

I think it is like \"egg came from the hen or the hen came from the egg\"\" type.