Parents, not enrichment centres, are key to result

[corneyAmber]

Chenonceau:

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

Oh if I am still learning, I may deliver the wrong things...

[Chenonceau]

ksi:

Chenonceau:

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

I am not sure... but I rather suspect that even the top class doesn't get as much stretch as it should in class to cope with P5 work. Most in top class have tuition. Also, the PSLE results for DS' school last year dropped quite a bit. Perhaps even in best class the PSLE training is insufficient?

But well... I conjecture only. Perhaps not fair to the school.

However, we already know that Piggy's GEP didn't handle heuristics... and neither did my friend's GEP. Piggy taught her son simultaneous and my friend's son did like mine - Onsponge, and went to MindStretcher regularly. So maybe even the best of the best aren't taught these stretch stuff eh?

[HAPPYH]

Chenonceau:

ksi:

[quote=\"Chenonceau\"]

The issue bears thinking about... I really have no very strong objections at present against streaming because as someone who teaches adults, I am familiar with the challenges of managing a disparate class.

But I do feel that some contingencies in the form of better documentation of scholastic material would go some way in tempering some of the negative effects of streaming - building linkages between streams so kids who can and want to, can stretch themselves... without Mommy having to hunt high and low for material. I would have been happy with just a bibliography... or even NLB resources earmarked as useful stretch material for PSLE.

The best teachers are those who don't stop learning.

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

I am not sure... but I rather suspect that even the top class doesn't get as much stretch as it should in class to cope with P5 work. Most in top class have tuition. Also, the PSLE results for DS' school last year dropped quite a bit. Perhaps even in best class the PSLE training is insufficient?

But well... I conjecture only. Perhaps not fair to the school.

However, we already know that Piggy's GEP didn't handle heuristics... and neither did my friend's GEP. Piggy taught her son simultaneous and my friend's son did like mine - Onsponge, and went to MindStretcher regularly. So maybe even the best of the best aren't taught these stretch stuff eh?[/quote]

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

[Chenonceau]

HAPPYH:

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

That is why I said that even good students have to go for enrichment lor... when really if the system tests what it adequately can teach, then good students won't have to go for external help.

BUT people want tough tests mah... so that they know which child is smarter than which. Is it so important to know which child is smarter than which to a very fine-grained detail?

You can't stop some parents from wanting to push their kids ever upwards. But the testing doesn't have to follow this crowd. If one day, enrichment reached the level where 10 year olds are doing university modules, will PSLE follow suit and test at that level? Let the crazy parents who want to develop ALL BRAIN in their kids skip levels... do university stuff... but let normal people like my DS, be normal.

[HAPPYH]

Chenonceau:

HAPPYH:

This is interesting.

Conclusion is children should rely on tuition/enrichment/assessment books/parents to do the exam well. ??????

That is why I said that even good students have to go for enrichment lor... when really if the system tests what it adequately can teach, then good students won't have to go.

BUT people want tough tests mah... so that they know which child is smarter than which. Is it so important to know which child is smarter than which to a very fine-grained detail?

I personally feel dont need at all. But being kiasu, we also wont stop chasing each other

[Always21]

I guess all parents want the child to feel at ease learning in school. I just worry if the child cannot understand what the school is teaching and give up on themselves. That is why I sent my child to enrichment class, to prepare him, not aiming him to go top class.

[Funz]

My kiddos are not yet at the PSLE stage yet so all is still kinda rosy right now. Just trying to understand what I might be heading in for so don’t shoot me hor.


But I am just wondering, all these talk about testing beyond what is taught or beyond the abilities of kids this age, is it really so? Of the entire exam paper, are all the questions beyond what is taught in the syllabus? Or just a small percentage of the questions to sniff out those with higher order thinking?

Is it the paper that is forcing the parents to need all these tuition and enrichment or is it the parents who refuse let their children stumble on these questions that led to this ‘tuition culture’?

[HAPPYH]

Funz:

My kiddos are not yet at the PSLE stage yet so all is still kinda rosy right now. Just trying to understand what I might be heading in for so don't shoot me hor.


But I am just wondering, all these talk about testing beyond what is taught or beyond the abilities of kids this age, is it really so? Of the entire exam paper, are all the questions beyond what is taught in the syllabus? Or just a small percentage of the questions to sniff out those with higher order thinking?

Is it the paper that is forcing the parents to need all these tuition and enrichment or is it the parents who refuse let their children stumble on these questions that led to this 'tuition culture'?

I think it is like \"egg came from the hen or the hen came from the egg\"\" type.

[Chenonceau]

Funz:

But I am just wondering, all these talk about testing beyond what is taught or beyond the abilities of kids this age, is it really so? Of the entire exam paper, are all the questions beyond what is taught in the syllabus? Or just a small percentage of the questions to sniff out those with higher order thinking?

It depends on when the exam I think. In P5 CA1, these unknowns can hit about 35 marks. As the school teaches forwards you MAY find that the SA2 paper is easier than the SA1 paper. By the time PSLE comes around, it may just be 10 marks that are beyond?

Funz:

Is it the paper that is forcing the parents to need all these tuition and enrichment or is it the parents who refuse let their children stumble on these questions that led to this 'tuition culture'?

For me, if the paper tests this much, and I have time and resources (and my son is capable), I will cover the whole domain tested by the paper. I am unlikely to cover the full domain for Chinese because he started at a really low base, and we have little time. We haven't even LOOKED at HCL, and probably won't. However, I probably CAN cover the whole domain tested for Science, Math and English because he already has very strong foundations in these 3 subjects.

BUT if the exam papers' domain wasn't so ambitious, I wouldn't cover so much. I would cover what the papers test only. If papers target less, I will cover less. If papers target more, I will cover more. The objective is to teach to the domain the paper covers. So I for one, am responding to what the papers test.

[PiggyLalala]

Chenonceau:

ksi:

Yup think further and I too have nothing against streaming, in fact, to some extent it is beneficial for both teachers and students in terms of making progress in the class. So you can say I am pro streaming but not overly granular streaming. I find it strange that your school's top class and second best class is handled differently, so granular in treatment.

I am not sure... but I rather suspect that even the top class doesn't get as much stretch as it should in class to cope with P5 work. Most in top class have tuition. Also, the PSLE results for DS' school last year dropped quite a bit. Perhaps even in best class the PSLE training is insufficient?

But well... I conjecture only. Perhaps not fair to the school.

However, we already know that Piggy's GEP didn't handle heuristics... and neither did my friend's GEP. Piggy taught her son simultaneous and my friend's son did like mine - Onsponge, and went to MindStretcher regularly. So maybe even the best of the best aren't taught these stretch stuff eh?

Just to clarify. If I did not remember wrongly, I did not see any worksheets that specifically taught simultaneous equations, and neither did the teacher specifically teach the skill to the pupils. However, in class, the teacher might have used it as a method to solve certain practice questions, which allowed the better students to indirectly learn the way of doing simultaneous equations.