Foreign Workers

[limlim]

Musings:

I have personal friends in spouse company (degree holders) who lament about remote location of the plant and quit...Cases like this abound in spouse company. Nobody can fault you for making this personal choice but let's not turn around and slam the foreigner who is willing to come in to take on the job.

If there is no foreigners, the company can still get locals for, say, additional 20% salary. It is the presence of these foreigners that prevented the company from rising wages to attract suitable local talents.

So, why can't locals slam the foreigners who is willing to come CHEAP and took away the job that would else go to locals at premium wage?

[limlim]

Funz:

I agree. Singapore employees have to bear some responsibility for this so called 'hiring of foreigners trend'. Though I will say that it has been blown out of proportion. Jialat gonna get hantam for saying that.

Ok, wrote too much oredi. Gonna kenna .

It's easy to just give a vague account of how difficult it is to employ locals..

Why don't you state what are the job scope, working hours and the salary that you're paying to allow viewers to better judge the situation?

Let the facts speak for itself.

There are companies offering $900/mth for 10hrs working hours in some ulu places and complaining that they cannot find local workers. How you expect locals to survive on $900/mth?

Is locals asking for too much?

[verykiasu2010]

limlim:

If the plants refuse to employee locals, they should simply just move to other countries, since it is no lost to locals anyway for they are not giving jobs here. The fact that they remains here means that there most be something that attracts them here, such as security or obedient workers.. And, it is fair that they pay a premium for the \"benefits\" that they derive from this little red dot.

more like locals refuse to work there rather than company refuses to employ locals.

yes, cost is an issue and it is not simply no loss to locals ...... economics is not simple

don't forget the saga of PSA versus Maersk Lines ......the collateral damage was huge as it resulted in huge retrenchment in the supporting industries, many thousands jobs were lost as the supporting industries got no more biz and had to scale down or shut down....some biz went bankrupt.....not merely loss of terminal-usage revenue by PSA when Maersk moved out.... so, don't be so short sighted. To you, it is just a salary, may be 20% more or 20% less as you quoted. To the larger economy, the spin off that would be lost is much larger

on the other hand, when the biz is sustained even though by foreign workers, the supporting industries and biz services benefited and grow, no retrenchments....you don't benefit is okay and in any case you don't want it.

got to look at the larger picture

[verykiasu2010]

limlim:

verykiasu2010:

$4k per month finance assistant position (below manager rank) in Jurong, 5 day week, no OT, factory transport aircon coach provided

Sounds quite good leh..

Don't know why, companies always complain that no Singaporeans want to take the jobs or they are too picky, but based on the salaries, benefits given, like so good leh.. I would want to take the job, and I know many of the pple around me would want to take the job, but.. would the company employ us??

Those that the companies want, doesn't want the job, but those that want the job, the companies doesn't want.. Essentially, a mis-match of expectations? Is it fair to just say that Singaporeans are choosy? For every 10 Singaporeans that reject a $4k job, I believe, 1000 Singaporeans wants the job badly..

$4k is so much higher than many engineering/technical jobs requiring a degree!

ok.. OT too much.. but just find it difficult to accept/understand why those pple reject the $4k job..

many this kind of examples lah

[Musings]

limlim:

Musings:

A well established company understands the need not to compromise their business quality by hiring less than able foreigners simply because they are cheaper. Let's just say that spouse company is not small - one of the biggest foreign investor in Singapore. But the difficulty they face in particular in filling engineering positions (BTW these are not blue collar positions) and skilled technician positions (though not managerial) is that Sporeans shun such jobs. I have personal friends in spouse company (degree holders) who lament about remote location of the plant and quit...Cases like this abound in spouse company. Nobody can fault you for making this personal choice but let's not turn around and slam the foreigner who is willing to come in to take on the job.

You're talking about plants in isolated locations, very specific cases. In those instance, I do not totally disagree with companies employing foreigners because they cannot get locals. But still, they can always up the salary to make up for the inconveniences. If an employee staying in pasir ris got the same offer, one at tuas the other at tampines, of coz they'll choose the tampines one given the same pay. But if the tuas plant is playing 20% more, it could meant a different story.

The case I'm referring to is factories in town area.. There'll be no lack of local applicants. Still, company likes foreigners bcoz they are cheaper.

In any cases, it just boils down to costs.

If the plants refuse to employee locals, they should simply just move to other countries, since it is no lost to locals anyway for they are not giving jobs here. The fact that they remains here means that there most be something that attracts them here, such as security or obedient workers.. And, it is fair that they pay a premium for the \"benefits\" that they derive from this little red dot.

I don't disagree that there will always be companies who will hire cheaper foreign labour.

But let's face it. Many of our industrial plants/companies are located in Tuas/Jurong Island area. Collectively, the companies located there offer substantial employment opportunities. Even for those who stay in the West, they complain about going to Jurong Island. Will Singaporeans really be prepared to give up all the engineering jobs (white collar), blue collar technician jobs on Jurong Island? No they will just blame foreigners again. Why should employers offer to pay more because they are located in Tuas/Jurong Island? Foreigners don't complain and ask for transport subsidy - and these guys dont stay in dorms. They travel long distance if necessary like anybody else. These foreigners tell me the commute to work in Spore is no big deal - it takes them 3 hours in their own country.

How many factories can be located in convenient areas to suit Sporeans' liking especially given our land scarcity problem? You will face another set of complaints, I don't want the plant near my house...

I don't think I would want these companies to just move away from Singapore - they bring tangible economic benefits to Spore and we will feel a real sense of loss when they move out. MNCs support a whole chain of suppliers, vendors and other companies in that sector. I can remember the palpable fear my company felt when we see clients planning to pull out or downsizing during the financial crisis in 2008.

[Musings]

limlim:

Musings:

I have personal friends in spouse company (degree holders) who lament about remote location of the plant and quit...Cases like this abound in spouse company. Nobody can fault you for making this personal choice but let's not turn around and slam the foreigner who is willing to come in to take on the job.

If there is no foreigners, the company can still get locals for, say, additional 20% salary. It is the presence of these foreigners that prevented the company from rising wages to attract suitable local talents.

So, why can't locals slam the foreigners who is willing to come CHEAP and took away the job that would else go to locals at premium wage?

The MNCs will just move out. The SMEs will not survive. Spore suffers at the end of the day.

[puff]

Last time when I visit food court , the one preparing my noodle will be local aunties. After the flood gate open, those cooking for u in the food court r mostly PRC.

Where did all those local aunties go? R they holding higher position somewhere else or issit these aunties r force out of job.

[Kissgurami]

limlim:

verykiasu2010:

$4k per month finance assistant position (below manager rank) in Jurong, 5 day week, no OT, factory transport aircon coach provided

Essentially, a mis-match of expectations? Is it fair to just say that Singaporeans are choosy? For every 10 Singaporeans that reject a $4k job, I believe, 1000 Singaporeans wants the job badly..

$4k is so much higher than many engineering/technical jobs requiring a degree!

ok.. OT too much.. but just find it difficult to accept/understand why those pple reject the $4k job..

Nope.. The word \"Jurong\" scares them as if it is on the other side of the world. They over-think about the distance and prefer to work nearer to their home. I received a look of surprise from my FT employer when I dismissed that distance isn't an issue ( I was staying at Punggol before) as that seem to be the main grouse they receive from locals.

[verykiasu2010]

puff:

Last time when I visit food court , the one preparing my noodle will be local aunties. After the flood gate open, those cooking for u in the food court r mostly PRC.

Where did all those local aunties go? R they holding higher position somewhere else or issit these aunties r force out of job.

the local aunties cannot get higher pay and prefer to shake legs at home

they are not forced out of a job. they force the biz owner to hire foreigners. please don't think it is easy to lobby MOM to increase ratio of foreign workers

to the biz owner, the basic pay for foreign workers may be lower, but when you add up the FWL, dorm cost, insurance etc etc it is the same cost as local auntie

so to the biz owner there is no additional profit but these people will not complain about standing for 8 hours a day

local auntie will gossip and complain and want more benefits etc

to maintain a stable biz operating environment, foreign worker is preferred over local auntie....that is business.....or do I see stones coming at me ? :siam: :siam:

[verykiasu2010]

Kissgurami:

limlim:

[quote=\"verykiasu2010\"]
$4k per month finance assistant position (below manager rank) in Jurong, 5 day week, no OT, factory transport aircon coach provided

Essentially, a mis-match of expectations? Is it fair to just say that Singaporeans are choosy? For every 10 Singaporeans that reject a $4k job, I believe, 1000 Singaporeans wants the job badly..

$4k is so much higher than many engineering/technical jobs requiring a degree!

ok.. OT too much.. but just find it difficult to accept/understand why those pple reject the $4k job..

Nope.. The word \"Jurong\" scares them as if it is on the other side of the world. They over-think about the distance and prefer to work nearer to their home. I received a look of surprise from my FT employer when I dismissed that distance isn't an issue ( I was staying at Punggol before) as that seem to be the main grouse they receive from locals.[/quote]EXACTLY. Some Singaporean are pampered too much and whine a lot. Pointing fingers at others without realising four fingers are pointing back at themselves. Sigh !