P2 Math - General Discussion

[acforfamily]

david59:

Unfortunately, problem sums these days require the students not only to be good in Mathematics but also to comprehend exactly what the question is asking. When you come to Pr 5 and 6 problem sums, sometimes you need to read a few times before you finally understand the qn. Rather than criticising the need to make things less ambigious, it is better to improve our understanding of the qns. As it is, 30 more cookies simply means another 30 cookies. There is no ambiguity in the statement.

While I agree that the students need to be good in English too, isn't it much clearer if the question had been \"30 more than Monday\" if it was intended to add or \"another 30 cookies\" if it was not intended to add?

At P1 level, we should focus on whether they get their concepts right first.
No offence intended but I feel that properly worded questions will help to reinforce the learning of Maths concept better.

[Full.010894Cream]

GreenQ:

Hi david59,


I start to confuse as I have read some time back in another thread \"Chit chat - Rant - Mistake\" for similar question :

tankee:

Another one. Or is it a trick question?

3. Mrs Quek baked 57 apples pies in the morning. She baked 28 more apple pies in the afternoon. How many apples pies did she bake in the afternoon?

Thought the above answer is 57+28. :?

perhaps it's the way we normally speak. If we say '28 more in the afternoon', we normally mean that after the 57, we made another 28. Seldom we expect the other person to do some maths, in this case, (57+28 ) in our conversation.

Just4Fun:

I agree those examples illustsrated by David59 do sound logically.

But, pls allow me to quote these scenarios :-

(A)
For Paper 1 , I have scored 30 marks.
For Paper 2, I have scored 10 more marks .
So what is the actual score for Paper 2 ? 10 or 40 marks ?

(B),
Last year, I had scored 30 marks for Maths Paper
This year, I have scored 10 more marks.
So, what is the exact score that I hv scored for this year ?

(C)
For English , I have scored 30 marks .
For Maths, I have scored 10 more marks
So, what is the exact score for Maths ?

Does the answer to A looks unclear, but answer to B looks more towards 40 marks , while answer to C is quite obvious towards 40 marks ?

So how to explain to a P1 student, under what situation shd u add to the previous number, and under what situation u shd not do the summation ????

For the above 3 examples, I strongly believe we should include 'than' if we intend to make a comparison. Too often, we skip 'than' in our daily conversation that we become too comfy without it.

BTW, should it be 'lesser than' or 'less than' ?

[Just4Fun]

Shd be "lesser than".


We usually say " fewer than ", "smaller than ", " smarter than "…
But somehow when we come to "less" , we usually mix up these .

[Muffins]

Just4Fun:

//Moderator's note: Topics merged.


This is what my DS got for his Maths paper :
There were 6 cookies in each packet.
I bought 3 packets of cookies on Monday.
a, How many cookies did I buy on Monday ?
b, I bought 30 more cookies on Tuesday.
How many cookies did I buy altogether on both days ?

Answer to (b) ??? Can some one pls help on this ????
48 or 66 cookies shd be the correct answer ???? :?

Hi Just4Fun, the answer is 48 because she bought 18 (6X3) cookies on Monday, then she bought 30 more cookies on Tuesday... Just imagine, if your son/daughter came to you and said, \"Hi Ma! I bought 18 cookies today!\", then, on the next day, says, \"Hey Mom! I bought 30 more cookies!\", how many of those cookies would you have, considering that you had none of them to begin with, 48, right? So, that's why I think 48 is the correct answer...

Hope I helped!

[Just4Fun]

OK, it seems that the answer to this question is certainly not definite, reading fr the various responses.


It will be interesting to hear from David59 :
To this \"cookie\" question, Tue's purchase is 30.

But to the other question
Mrs Quek baked 57 apples pies in the morning. She baked 28 more apple pies in the afternoon. How many apples pies did she bake in the afternoon?

Apple pies in the afternoon is 57+28 = 85.

Isn't this contradicting ?
David59, hope u can help to enlighten me yr view. Thanks so much !

[david59]

GreenQ:

Hi david59,


I start to confuse as I have read some time back in another thread \"Chit chat - Rant - Mistake\" for similar question :

tankee:

Another one. Or is it a trick question?

3. Mrs Quek baked 57 apples pies in the morning. She baked 28 more apple pies in the afternoon. How many apples pies did she bake in the afternoon?

Thought the above answer is 57+28. :?

I had deliberated on this issue in that thread. My stand is 28 apple pies in the afternoon. As I have shared then, if the answer is to be 57 + 28, then it should be \"she baked 28 more in the afternoon than in the morning\". The question set by the teacher was clearly to mean more than but it was phrased wrongly.

[david59]

Just4Fun:

I agree those examples illustsrated by David59 do sound logically.


But, pls allow me to quote these scenarios :-

(A)
For Paper 1 , I have scored 30 marks.
For Paper 2, I have scored 10 more marks .
So what is the actual score for Paper 2 ? 10 or 40 marks ?

(B),
Last year, I had scored 30 marks for Maths Paper
This year, I have scored 10 more marks.
So, what is the exact score that I hv scored for this year ?

(C)
For English , I have scored 30 marks .
For Maths, I have scored 10 more marks
So, what is the exact score for Maths ?

Does the answer to A looks unclear, but answer to B looks more towards 40 marks , while answer to C is quite obvious towards 40 marks ?

So how to explain to a P1 student, under what situation shd u add to the previous number, and under what situation u shd not do the summation ????

First of all, I have to say that I am no English expert.
Ok, for (A) I would say that - I find it rather odd to say \" I have scored 10 more marks\". I would just simply say \" For paper 2, I have scored 40 mark\" or \" had scored 10 more marks than paper 1\".

For (B), again it is rather odd to phrase the way you wrote. One would simply say that this year he has improved by 10 marks over last year.

For (C), again your phrasing is incomplete and causes ambiguity. I would say \" For Maths, I have scored 10 more marks than for English\".

[lwm99]

When kids encounter this type of questions, are they able to ask the teacher what does the word "more" actually mean in the questions, as it is a Maths exam and not an English exam?

[GreenQ]

Full.Cream:

perhaps it's the way we normally speak. If we say '28 more in the afternoon', we normally mean that after the 57, we made another 28. Seldom we expect the other person to do some maths, in this case, (57+28 ) in our conversation.

Thanks. Yes, agree that we normally speak in this way. But when it comes to maths question, we tend to think that the question should not be so straight forward or simple.

david59:

GreenQ:

Hi david59,

I start to confuse as I have read some time back in another thread \"Chit chat - Rant - Mistake\" for similar question :

3. Mrs Quek baked 57 apples pies in the morning. She baked 28 more apple pies in the afternoon. How many apples pies did she bake in the afternoon?
Thought the above answer is 57+28. :?

I had deliberated on this issue in that thread. My stand is 28 apple pies in the afternoon. As I have shared then, if the answer is to be 57 + 28, then it should be \"she baked 28 more in the afternoon than in the morning\". The question set by the teacher was clearly to mean more than but it was phrased wrongly.

Thanks david59 for your explanation! (Sorry I have missed your reply in that thread...)

[Full.010894Cream]

lwm99:

When kids encounter this type of questions, are they able to ask the teacher what does the word \"more\" actually mean in the questions, as it is a Maths exam and not an English exam?

believe the student are entitled to ask. but knowing the tense situation of exams, likelihood is that the child will put down what comes to his mind 1st.